Are Chinese Pens A Gamble?

[Rabbit52]

I have always been of the notion that you get what you pay for. Therefore I have to ask if these Chinese fountain pens are really too good to be true. I see these pens on ebay selling for ridiculous prices for what they claim to be. Gold pens shaped like a dragon sell for ten dollars U.S. which seems crazy to me. So I have to ask are these scams or are companies like Jinhao good companies to buy from. If they are what companies and models should I stick with and which ones should I stay away from?

[Apotheosis]

I think all purchases are a gamble..no matter which country or company of origin the pens come from.

I have a few el cheapo pens that write like a dream while some expensive pens i have are only so-so on paper.

Best best would be 2 things :

Stick to the more reliable companies like pelikan or pilot and stay away from companies you've never heard of.

Hunt down a review of the pen here on the board by one of our members and decide from there.

[Silvermink]

They're not scams, but they are inexpensive fountain pens (regardless of how they look) and you should set your expectations accordingly. The QC's often a bit lacking, and construction's often brass which I find on the heavy side for my preferences. There are definitely decent ones out there, though.

[estie1948]

I've had some good luck with Chinese pens. Before going any further, let me make it clear that I have only a few Chinese pens. I'm not talking from a great wealth of experience here. Now, I don't have any gold ones or silver ones or any that claim to be gold or silver. With that out of the way, I can truthfully say that all of mine are good writers. I agree with Silvermink in that some of them can be a bit on the heavy side.

 

I have heard stories of terrible quality control, but I've not found that to be the case with my few Chinese pens. One thing to keep in mind is the fact that many major pen companies have moved to China and their pens are now being produced there. Also, I am told that while the West was caught up in the switch to ballpoint pens, the Chinese stayed mainly with the fountain pen. If they have been constantly making fountain pens for that long, they should know what they are doing.

 

Hope this helps.

 

-David.

[faustulus]

I have always been of the notion that you get what you pay for.

While this used to be more or less true, today, not so much. It hinges on the assumption that you have some idea of intrinsic value, but in modern manufacturing value is often hidden (often times because the company wants it so).

The materials that go into making a fountain pen are the least of its costs. Labor will always be more, as often will advertising. Economy of scale also comes into play as does market forces (you won't sell many pens to people if they can't afford to buy them).

All this is to say that it is hard to know what a western pen should cost, and even more difficult with Chinese pens.

But you shouldn't be scared off by them. Most of them, like most western pens, are quite good. Usually much better than the price you pay. A quick look on this board and you will see all kinds of problems with modern western pens, and the same is true of Chinese pens. The difference? The Chinese pens usually cost less than $20.

Don't be afraid to give them a try, start with the really cheap ones and if you find some you like try some more from that brand. Don't be afraid of never having heard of them, the only way to find out is to give them a go.

So yes, they are a gamble, but so are western ones, the difference is that for 50 bucks you get one western pen or five or six Chinese ones, even if two don't work and the on western one does, with the Chinese bet you come out two pens ahead.

[pendulous]

Get yourself a Jinhao 159, 'cheap as chips' - you might have to epoxy a couple of repairs to the section and/or cap thread liner. It is a remarkable writer. Total cost to UK £7 - what's that in real money? $10?

 

Experiment - life can be full of surprises.

Edited August 11, 2012 by pendulous

[de_pen_dent]

On a whim, I bought 3 Chinese pens at the local stationary shop, to see what they sell to kids around here these days - one for 27c (Hero 9), one for about 85c (a Hero 343 with a painting of a flower on it. Maki-e, anyone?) and one costing a whopping $1.80 (a Qibao A350).

 

The $1.80 pen stomps on my Sheaffer 300 (gave it away) and the Parker Sonnet. Fine nail, writes a little dry and hard to get started initially; but after a day or two, the flow improved and now the works really well for everyday writing, providing just the right amount of feedback without getting scratchy. Heck, both the 343 and even the Hero 9 write significantly better than my Sheaffer and Sonnet.

 

I'll post a couple of photos and a mini-review soon.

[steviebee]

+1 on the 159. For the money, an exceptional pen. It's biggest fault IME is the converter - seems to not supply ink to the feed unless it's full....solution: fit a new one, cost pennies. The finish isn't going to last long at wear points (the clip has rubbed a little spot in only a month) but hell, for seven quid! Nib's good, writes smoothly, looks a beast. And it has options on the nib, colour and clip if you don't fancy the standard: increase in cost tho, but even so.....

[Seele]

Rabbit52,

 

It's a little difficult to consider Chinese-made pens as a homogenous whole, it's not. Let's have a look from where I stand. I know it could be generalizing a bit, but it's more convenient to divide the manufacturers into different categories.

 

First are the classic manufacturers who started out prior to the "opening" of the country. The best known of them is Hero, probably by virtue of it still existing and having bought out pretty much everyone else. The others faltered over the decades as rounds after rounds of mergers decimated their numbers, and yet for various reasons, smaller makers popped up for relatively short periods as means to encourage local employment. Certainly you can get new models and classic ones by Hero, but the firm is still vexed by unscrupulous types making bogus ones. Brand new products by the defunct firms are still available at eBay and Taobao, those by Wing Sung (Everlast) who ceased manufacturing in 1999 are the best known. There are also dozens of other brands like Golden Star (KinSin or Jinxing), Changhong (Rainbow), Youlian (Alliance), Jinyan (Golden Swallow), and perhaps more than a score of others. Quality tends to be good, but of course only limited by the actual capability of the actual manufacturer and the possibility of the negative impact due to storage. Personally I prefer these; currently I can only say a few things about Hero and Wing Sung hooded nibs, and I can safely say the Wing Sung ones are stunning; a 612A would cost you no money at all but as you write with it you're going to giggle like a schoolgirl!

 

With the "opening" of the country, many new firms started out wanting a piece of the action. Generally their products are styled to be more "modern" and eye-catching, and would immediately grab you both visually and during preliminary tests; some stalwarts at forums dedicated to Chinese pens opined that they made a conscious effort to make the nibs particularly smooth, which would give the customer/prospective customer a good first impression. However they also found that in terms of construction and longevity, some of them are much in wanting, such as surface finish falling off in chunks and such. If you shop carefully and selectively I think it is indeed possible to find fully satisfactory pieces.

 

As I said it's generalizing a bit; in the watch industry it is pretty much the same too. When it comes to brass tacks, you are going to get your money going a lot further here, and for me I would be happy to play with Chinese made ones - by the classic makers - and never to touch a non-Chinese pen again.

[studiohead]

I have always been of the notion that you get what you pay for. Therefore I have to ask if these Chinese fountain pens are really too good to be true. I see these pens on ebay selling for ridiculous prices for what they claim to be. Gold pens shaped like a dragon sell for ten dollars U.S. which seems crazy to me. So I have to ask are these scams or are companies like Jinhao good companies to buy from. If they are what companies and models should I stick with and which ones should I stay away from?

 

Having played with Chinese pens for the last 9 months and getting good working relationships with many Chinese pens wholesalers/distributors, I can safely say, some pens are not scams, some are most definitely are and you always have to do your homework.

 

The first item of business is to understand the situation first, Chinese pen manufacturers normally make for their home market which range from cute pens with characters sold in supermarkets to pens as expensive gifts (or for the person who look for negatives, bribes). And some manufacturers will cover the whole line. Next there are big and small companies making fountain pens in china, some of them main business is making stationary products and make a few models to those which make fountain pens exclusively. Pens can cost less than USD$1 in China to USD$1,000 and over by chinese companies. (In case people are wondering, look up "King Crown" by Shanghai Duke company)

 

The second order is to also look at the reason of the design, most pens in the dragon type are nice pens which would see very little use beyond taking it out signing a document or look impressive on a table or at a formal event. They will work nice once properly clean may skip or be a slow starter. But for those uses, they are fine. There are also pens made by Jinhao for more conventional use as well. Gold pens are mostly gold plated and not 100% gold in most cases. Nibs can range from real gold nibs which is extremely rare or gold plating which is very common.

 

The third item is that there are many fakes around, so certain brands in china have many counterfeit versions selling. So for this, you need to see which brand you are buying, but most counterfeits will be of western brands. They will work, many of work are quite good to write with but the finishing maybe of poorer quality.

 

There are reviews of the various models in the reviews sub forum. But the easy answer should be look at Duke or Kaigelu (Watch the convertor on some of the Kaigelu models) for good quality products. Jinhao/Baoer have QC issues now and than. Hero has too many lines and there are many counterfeits so you need to be very careful. But, a good way is to look for what you want and ask about experiences with that particular make/model than such a wide net.

Edited August 11, 2012 by studiohead

[Ernst Bitterman]

Sometimes they're an Esterbrook. Sometimes they're a Warwick. If you're prepared for disappointment, the good surprises will feel that much better.

[Kugelschreiber]

+1 on the 159. For the money, an exceptional pen. It's biggest fault IME is the converter - seems to not supply ink to the feed unless it's full....solution: fit a new one, cost pennies.

 

 

Are there larger and better converters that will fit in the 159? If so, which one(s)? Thanks.

[79spitfire]

To a point. Many are equally as good writers as any 'traditional' brand of pen, my main problem has been finishes and plastics that crack or fail. I have had several WingSungs that have had the section crack at or above the nib, leading to inky fingers, (seems to be the light blue colored ones!) The Hero 616 is the most questionable pen, as many seem to be second production or fakes, get a good one (especially a Jumbo) and they are truly great every day pens, durable and smooth writing, get one of the others and, well, not so. That's where a reputable seller comes in. Paying a few $$ extra will pay off in the long run, however if you like to tinker, a 10 pack of ultra cheapies will give you ample opportunity to experiment!

 

I've had good luck with the Jinhao pens, the X450 and the 159, except the X450 developed wear on it's finishes (nib and pen body) fairly quickly. Xfountain pens sells German made replacement nibs that have thicker plating of a much higher quality for a few $$ each.

 

I've found the higher end Hero pens to be very nice, one of my favorites is the 100 flighter, which has a 12 or 14K nib, (can't remember which).

 

Read reviews and decide from there, the most I've paid for a Chinese branded pen was $35 so it's not like your gambling enough to buy a MB. The odds are better with Chinese pens than they are in Vegas!

 

Keep in mind many 'Western' brands of pens are now made in China, Parker, Sheaffer, and Cross all have FP models made in China, and they retail for much more than the Chinese brands. (please don't get into a economic/political argument!). My Sheaffer 100 was made in China, and is a fine writer, with a very high quality finish.

[79spitfire]

+1 on the 159. For the money, an exceptional pen. It's biggest fault IME is the converter - seems to not supply ink to the feed unless it's full....solution: fit a new one, cost pennies.

 

 

Are there larger and better converters that will fit in the 159? If so, which one(s)? Thanks.

They take 'international' cartridges, so any that fit other pens should work. You'll have to hunt to find ones with bigger capacity. I haven't tried, but I wonder if the large cartridges will work. They can be refilled with a syringe...

[KrazyIvan]

I guess it depends on how you look at it. So far, my Chinese pens have been good in the sense that they provide a nice and inexpensive proving ground to learn about adjusting and grinding nibs.

[Kugelschreiber]

+1 on the 159. For the money, an exceptional pen. It's biggest fault IME is the converter - seems to not supply ink to the feed unless it's full....solution: fit a new one, cost pennies.

 

 

Are there larger and better converters that will fit in the 159? If so, which one(s)? Thanks.

They take 'international' cartridges, so any that fit other pens should work. You'll have to hunt to find ones with bigger capacity. I haven't tried, but I wonder if the large cartridges will work. They can be refilled with a syringe...

 

 

I put a J. Herbin Perle Noire cartridge into my 159 and am guessing it should give me at least as much writing as the converter. Cartridges are easier to deal with, but I'd still prefer to fill from a bottle. A better/bigger converter would be ideal.

[professionaldilettante]

All pens are a gamble. However, the win ratio is higher for some than others.

[Sailor Kenshin]

I have always been of the notion that you get what you pay for. Therefore I have to ask if these Chinese fountain pens are really too good to be true. I see these pens on ebay selling for ridiculous prices for what they claim to be. Gold pens shaped like a dragon sell for ten dollars U.S. which seems crazy to me. So I have to ask are these scams or are companies like Jinhao good companies to buy from. If they are what companies and models should I stick with and which ones should I stay away from?

 

They can be a gamble if you get them from just any old where as opposed to isellpens, his nibs, speerbob on the bay or a few others. Of these, isellpens is my favorite. Other people here will have equally good recommendations.

 

Just recently I bought a batch of different Guanleming, five bucks each, a make with which I was unfamiliar, and I am supremely happy. And a Hero fude, for about fifteen.

 

I buy just about all my Heroes from him.

Edited August 11, 2012 by Sailor Kenshin

[Seele]

Sailor Kenshin,

 

While most Chinese manufacturers from the classic period had interesting histories, Guanleming (alternatively spelt as Guan Leming or Guan Le Ming) has probably the most complicated. No definitive story of the firm has yet been compiled but the following is what I can piece together from snippets of information.

 

It was originally an American company, founded in NYC in 1926 and manufactured there. Two years later they hauled anchor and moved to Shanghai and soon became a major manufacturer; no NYC-built products has yet been discovered; pre-war Shanghai-built examples in good condition now command up to four-figure prices due to collectors interests. It's also known that the firm also branded some of their pens "Rockman" but I do not know when that happened.

 

WWII got things messed up, obviously, and the civil war which continued for four more years did not help much either. After the establishment of the PRC, Guanleming got back on their feet again, but a year later in 1950, it was decided that a pen industry needed to be established in the far north-east (the area that used to be Manchuria). The Guanleming factory was loaded in trucks and transported north, along with a number of staff members, and that was the start of Youlian ("Alliance") Pens which has been defunct for a while.

 

However, Guanleming carried on operating in Shanghai. Probably due to the disposal of their assets they acquired a new factory opposite the Zhongshan Park, and from there they also started experimenting with watchmaking, one source said that they used the Diamond brand and finally be became the Shanghai Watch Component Factory.

 

Here the accounts get a bit odd: another source said that in 1955 they acquired Doctor Pens. Doctor was the first pen manufacturer in Shanghai and indeed in China, founded in 1926 as Guoyi Pens, and later changed its name to Doctor. Two years later another round of amalgamation saw Guanleming acquiring more smaller pen manufacturers.

 

From then on, things got a bit hazy; there seems to be little mention of the brand, or of they're still actively engaged in pen making. It's also been said that it was acquired by Hero and used for "badge-engineering" but I actually doubt that somewhat, for I have seen Guanleming products which were quite unique, although some were co-branded "Jinrong" (Golden Glory), and Hero does own the Doctor brand, possibly through its acquisition of Quanleming. What is for certain is that one group of companies under the name Guanleming is apparently still extant, based in the new development area of Putong in Shanghai, and involved in several industries such as precision engineering... and pen manufacture, but I cannot tell if the actual manufacture was done by Hero, or the corporate nature of the current Guanleming companies.

 

Hope this is of some interest.

Edited August 12, 2012 by Seele

[Newjelan]

1344666552[/url]' post='2431106']

I have always been of the notion that you get what you pay for. Therefore I have to ask if these Chinese fountain pens are really too good to be true. I see these pens on ebay selling for ridiculous prices for what they claim to be. Gold pens shaped like a dragon sell for ten dollars U.S. which seems crazy to me. So I have to ask are these scams or are companies like Jinhao good companies to buy from. If they are what companies and models should I stick with and which ones should I stay away from?

 

I have a Jinhao, and it's great.