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*research* On Pen Companies And Their Quality Control And Aftermarket Service.


professionaldilettante

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Added my pens.

 

Some further suggestions: you're missing MF and flex (i.e. Ahab) nibs on the nib chart (also, BB is listed twice). Perhaps an "other" or "custom" nib option might be in order as well. There's also no option for "Wasn't worth the bother." on the customer service menu (could also just be "Haven't contacted customer service yet."), for those pens that just aren't worth enough to bother with the hassle of customer service.

Those are good ideas. I have implemented the changes. Thanks, and keep em coming!

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of.

Blaise Pascal

fpn_1336709688__pen_01.jpg

Tell me about any of your new pens and help with fountain pen quality control research!

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This is a great idea, good luck with it! I'll add a few as I can.

 

Hopefully we get something interesting out of it.

Non est ad astra mollis e terris via. - Seneca

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I am seeing some interesting data coming in. I will post something once I get 200 entries (almost there) but I don't want them to stop. Keep em coming!

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of.

Blaise Pascal

fpn_1336709688__pen_01.jpg

Tell me about any of your new pens and help with fountain pen quality control research!

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I am delivering what I had promised. Here is a general overview of the results, of about 240 different pen experiences.

 

fpn_1337923563__pen_graphs.png

 

I am hard pressed for time, so I haven't done any analysis on what the ratios of good to dud pens are, the info is promising. There is much to be drawn from this information, but we need more. Please submit more~! If you haven't yet, please do, I would really appreciate it. For those who have already submitted their lot, I am grateful, and I hope to be able to digest it in order to return something useful to this community after so many months of my curt and sometimes insensitive responses.

 

Thanks again,

-PD

 

*edit* Reviewing the data, I noticed an issue with the form.

One of the question reads:

"Did you ever need to have that pen serviced by the company or distributor straight out of the box because of quality control issues?"

One of the choices was: "Yes, but I serviced it myself."

 

I realized that there were some people who had forced to put down an answer for the next question: "Did you ever have trouble reaching the company to service your pen?" with "Nope. The pen never needed servicing in the first place."

 

This seems odd and I realized the problem, and have revised the form to reflect the fact that while some pens have issues, the reason why they are not sent out is because the user has fixed the problem themselves.

 

Thank you for your patience, as this is the first time I've done a study like this, especially on such short notice. I will keep you posted with any new developments.

 

Therefore, the graph isn't quite reflective of this change in the form. I'll put a new one up in a day or so when there are more entries.

Edited by professionaldilettante

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of.

Blaise Pascal

fpn_1336709688__pen_01.jpg

Tell me about any of your new pens and help with fountain pen quality control research!

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Thanks for doing this; I submitted a few :)

 

However, had a few qualms about the survey at the same time.

 

First, it never differentiated between buying the pen from an authorized seller vs reseller (of new items). Buying a Pilot pen in an authorized B&M store here might be different than say an eBay seller from Japan.

 

Second, sample bias. The FPN is a percentage of fountain pen buyers.. they may be more picky/vocal about minor issues or what not. It's also biased towards English speakers. Plus since it's a self-selecting population, the results may be skewed... for example, by people who had really bad experiences (and need to vent).

 

That being said, to fix the above problems would require a lot of time, effort, and money. :P So... I definitely appreciate the effort and will be interested to see what comes out of it (as long as we take everything with a grain of salt). :thumbup: :notworthy1:

[url="http://i-think-ink.tumblr.com/"]thINK[/url]: my pen & paper blog :)

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Thanks for doing this; I submitted a few :)

 

However, had a few qualms about the survey at the same time.

 

First, it never differentiated between buying the pen from an authorized seller vs reseller (of new items). Buying a Pilot pen in an authorized B&M store here might be different than say an eBay seller from Japan.

 

Second, sample bias. The FPN is a percentage of fountain pen buyers.. they may be more picky/vocal about minor issues or what not. It's also biased towards English speakers. Plus since it's a self-selecting population, the results may be skewed... for example, by people who had really bad experiences (and need to vent).

 

That being said, to fix the above problems would require a lot of time, effort, and money. :P So... I definitely appreciate the effort and will be interested to see what comes out of it (as long as we take everything with a grain of salt). :thumbup: :notworthy1:

The points you make are very valid. I have added the extra questions reflecting the warranty issues. Aside from this, it will be hard to include other languages since FPN is predominantly English speaking. As for being predominated with individuals just needing to vent, I tried to encourage people to enter pens that had not had any issues. The thing is, I can't force people to answer, and I need to trust this population to give both the good and bad.

 

Also, the main goal of this research is to answer these questions:

What is the ratio of good to bad pens a company makes? and What is the treatment of their customers when a bad pen lands in their posession?

 

This was in a response to a post that was saying how can we as a community of FP users put up with shoddy craftmanship, if a $3 Varsity had a better success rate than a $400 pen. I don't want to throw the thread off topic, but I'm just giving that information here, since the tread was deleted.

 

Thank you danahn17 for pointing things out that I have overlooked, and for making this a more insightful study. Any help is appreciated.

Edited by professionaldilettante

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of.

Blaise Pascal

fpn_1336709688__pen_01.jpg

Tell me about any of your new pens and help with fountain pen quality control research!

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As for being predominated with individuals just needing to vent, I tried to encourage people to enter pens that had not had any issues. The thing is, I can't force people to answer, and I need to trust this population to give both the good and bad.

 

Also, the main goal of this research is to answer these questions:

What is the ratio of good to bad pens a company makes? and What is the treatment of their customers when a bad pen lands in their posession?

 

This was in a response to a post that was saying how can we as a community of FP users put up with shoddy craftmanship, if a $3 Varsity had a better success rate than a $400 pen. I don't want to throw the thread off topic, but I'm just giving that information here, since the tread was deleted.

 

Thank you danahn17 for pointing things out that I have overlooked, and for making this a more insightful study. Any help is appreciated.

 

PD, while I salute your dedication in attempting to collect useful information, I have to agree with others that this survey method will not give valid or objective data. Besides the squeaky wheel venting with a valid issue, you could easily have a malicious brand basher (or group of bashers) fill out 100-200 forms that are highly negative towards their target...with no way to even verify that they made the purchase. Conversely, you could have just as large of a biased group making a concerted survey effort to give glowing marks to their championed brand.

 

Valid and useful customer surveys are almost all initiated from an actual purchase, and then the voluntary survey is conducted anonymously by a third party.

With the new FPN rules, now I REALLY don't know what to put in my signature.

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As for being predominated with individuals just needing to vent, I tried to encourage people to enter pens that had not had any issues. The thing is, I can't force people to answer, and I need to trust this population to give both the good and bad.

 

Also, the main goal of this research is to answer these questions:

What is the ratio of good to bad pens a company makes? and What is the treatment of their customers when a bad pen lands in their posession?

 

This was in a response to a post that was saying how can we as a community of FP users put up with shoddy craftmanship, if a $3 Varsity had a better success rate than a $400 pen. I don't want to throw the thread off topic, but I'm just giving that information here, since the tread was deleted.

 

Thank you danahn17 for pointing things out that I have overlooked, and for making this a more insightful study. Any help is appreciated.

 

PD, while I salute your dedication in attempting to collect useful information, I have to agree with others that this survey method will not give valid or objective data. Besides the squeaky wheel venting with a valid issue, you could easily have a malicious brand basher (or group of bashers) fill out 100-200 forms that are highly negative towards their target...with no way to even verify that they made the purchase. Conversely, you could have just as large of a biased group making a concerted survey effort to give glowing marks to their championed brand.

 

Valid and useful customer surveys are almost all initiated from an actual purchase, and then the voluntary survey is conducted anonymously by a third party.

This is why I try and scan data. So far, nothing gives it away that someone has done this, and I really hope that no one would do this. My hopes are that people will be as honest and forthcoming with information. As for the third party thing, I will never have access to the privileged connections to ever pull something like that off.

 

What I have hopes for this information is to develop a list of companies for newbies to try with the lowest percent of faulty pens, give a resource for others to know generally what to expect from a company they are buying their pens from, and hopefully, the power for our little community to get the slacking companies to pull their act together, if there is such a thing as a slacking company. Putting in false information will do nothing but destroy this project, but answering truthfully, will result in something much greater.

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of.

Blaise Pascal

fpn_1336709688__pen_01.jpg

Tell me about any of your new pens and help with fountain pen quality control research!

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Again, I'm praising your intention and nobility of the project. I just know what I have seen at FPN over the years.

 

Not to get into the REALLY controversial brands that seem to elicit irrational opinions, but as an example, there are a good number of people who are opposed to MB purely from the standpoint of their economic/marketing model.

 

While it would be fabulous to see everyone submit totally objective and fair reports, it is naive to believe that most people are going to do what you seek, rather than using this survey to add volume to their own personal agenda.

 

There is no way for you to detect a single, or orchestrated bias with this form. I'm concerned what could be unfairly 'codified' from whatever results show up, when the survey design is not valid regarding objectivity or actual purchases.

 

My intention in making these comments here is to be constructive, not destructive. I know what you want to find out, but I cannot see where this survey method will be valid.

With the new FPN rules, now I REALLY don't know what to put in my signature.

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I entered all that I had...I just wish I had more to enter!

 

This is a really great project, thank you very much for putting it together. If there winds up being enough folks participating, this will be an incredibly useful tool.

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Again, I'm praising your intention and nobility of the project. I just know what I have seen at FPN over the years.

 

Not to get into the REALLY controversial brands that seem to elicit irrational opinions, but as an example, there are a good number of people who are opposed to MB purely from the standpoint of their economic/marketing model.

 

While it would be fabulous to see everyone submit totally objective and fair reports, it is naive to believe that most people are going to do what you seek, rather than using this survey to add volume to their own personal agenda.

 

There is no way for you to detect a single, or orchestrated bias with this form. I'm concerned what could be unfairly 'codified' from whatever results show up, when the survey design is not valid regarding objectivity or actual purchases.

 

My intention in making these comments here is to be constructive, not destructive. I know what you want to find out, but I cannot see where this survey method will be valid.

 

I think for taking the pulse of the community, this is a fine form. As for detecting a bias, if the sample gets to be large enough, it should be readily detectable.

 

Also, I think that these quirks (personal agendas, controversial brands, etc...) are moments to study in and of themselves. I am curious how much they are able to come across in anonymous survey form, and how the more vocal proponents/opponents of a brand come across in anonymity. I mean, for a good number of out of the box FP issues we're dealing with user perception, which is a purely human phenomena. Think dry writer vs. manufacturing/assembly defect. Is a dry writer necessarily a production-side defect?

 

No matter how hard you try to generate a survey that eliminates subjective data, it will still manifest. If not in the results survey, than in the creation of the survey. The use of surveys and other quantitative methods for studying human populations has been debated in anthropology for at least the last forty years, with no consensus regarding their overall validity for collecting objective information about people. Honestly, simply recognizing the places where subjectivities arise, like a number in this thread have done, you've created a space of recognition.

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This is my attempt at gathering data to find which company we need to pressure to improve their QC, and which ones are less problematic straight from the box.

-PD

 

Do you believe that the major pen companies that you decide (by a poll of a small percentage of pen purchasers) are not doing the right thing are going to bow down to some of the members of FPN who don't like their QA and QC systems.....

Do you honestly believe that the members of FPN are the major source of income for these companies....

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No matter how hard you try to generate a survey that eliminates subjective data, it will still manifest. If not in the results survey, than in the creation of the survey. The use of surveys and other quantitative methods for studying human populations has been debated in anthropology for at least the last forty years, with no consensus regarding their overall validity for collecting objective information about people. Honestly, simply recognizing the places where subjectivities arise, like a number in this thread have done, you've created a space of recognition.

I actually really appreciate PD's effort as well :)

 

However, I disagree that recognizing subjectivities is enough for a project like this. And I disagree about there being no consensus about overall validity of objectivity in surveys. Having worked in marketing research and in epidemiology, there are data collection and study design methods used by both marketing groups and by the scientific community that minimize confounders and subjectivities. If done well, they have a great deal of accuracy which enables the researcher to draw credible conclusions. Unfortunately, the higher reliability methods often require a great deal of time and money.

 

The main issue here is a lack of a randomized population (which means we won't know the true rate of bad pens in the real world). The bad:good pen ratio, while interesting for sure, would have little scientific meaning due to the self-selection/response, and small sample sizes (while we have over 200 entries, since we're including all possible makes, a given pen probably won't have a large enough data size to minimize bias) method.

 

Again, not trying to harp on PD at all... Just trying to offer some thoughts and constructive criticism. I really appreciate PD's efforts... if he were in B'more I'd buy him a beer or something. :happyberet:

[url="http://i-think-ink.tumblr.com/"]thINK[/url]: my pen & paper blog :)

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the result looks promising!

is there a way to view a report brand/model?

Either write something worth reading or do something worth writing

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If anything this is a constructive attempt. Any further research or surveys may draw experience and refined designs from PDs' efforts.

What Would The Flying Spaghetti Monster Do?

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One thing it's done for me is confirm my belief in the three brands I trust most. The problems I've had were one-offs that I bought because I loved the look of the pen and did not research the quality of the (relatively uncommon) brand. The exception was a fluke in production that was resolved years ago by my favorite brand. Since then I've not had a single bad pen in 6 years or so. Go me!

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Venerable are letters, infinitely brave, forlorn, and lost. V. Woolf, Jacob's Room

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No matter how hard you try to generate a survey that eliminates subjective data, it will still manifest. If not in the results survey, than in the creation of the survey. The use of surveys and other quantitative methods for studying human populations has been debated in anthropology for at least the last forty years, with no consensus regarding their overall validity for collecting objective information about people. Honestly, simply recognizing the places where subjectivities arise, like a number in this thread have done, you've created a space of recognition.

I actually really appreciate PD's effort as well :)

 

However, I disagree that recognizing subjectivities is enough for a project like this. And I disagree about there being no consensus about overall validity of objectivity in surveys. Having worked in marketing research and in epidemiology, there are data collection and study design methods used by both marketing groups and by the scientific community that minimize confounders and subjectivities. If done well, they have a great deal of accuracy which enables the researcher to draw credible conclusions. Unfortunately, the higher reliability methods often require a great deal of time and money.

 

The main issue here is a lack of a randomized population (which means we won't know the true rate of bad pens in the real world). The bad:good pen ratio, while interesting for sure, would have little scientific meaning due to the self-selection/response, and small sample sizes (while we have over 200 entries, since we're including all possible makes, a given pen probably won't have a large enough data size to minimize bias) method.

 

Again, not trying to harp on PD at all... Just trying to offer some thoughts and constructive criticism. I really appreciate PD's efforts... if he were in B'more I'd buy him a beer or something. :happyberet:

 

Agreed on the lack of a randomized population, and the limitations on makes and models. And yes, there are plenty of study designs available for dealing with confounds, etc...As an anthropology grad student, I am currently steeped in a great deal of the theory and debate around qualitative/quantitative data collection and analytical methods relating to human populations. Also, I had a toddler buzzing around my head this morning, which I am sure didn't help with any clarity.

 

Overall, I still think this is a pretty useful guage, so long as there are enough respondents. Sure, more data will be available for particular pens, which will limit the ability to conduct any statistical analysis. I think one thing that could help is to have some way to track the respondents- keep it anonymous, though have the ability to list more than one pen per submission. That way, each submission could have a number or some other marker attached to it, along with all of the pens they either own or have chosen to enter. Just a thought.

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This is my attempt at gathering data to find which company we need to pressure to improve their QC, and which ones are less problematic straight from the box.

-PD

 

Do you believe that the major pen companies that you decide (by a poll of a small percentage of pen purchasers) are not doing the right thing are going to bow down to some of the members of FPN who don't like their QA and QC systems.....

Do you honestly believe that the members of FPN are the major source of income for these companies....

No, but you never know. At least it will empower us as consumers.

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of.

Blaise Pascal

fpn_1336709688__pen_01.jpg

Tell me about any of your new pens and help with fountain pen quality control research!

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the result looks promising!

is there a way to view a report brand/model?

I will be working on that. I just need some time, but I do have the spreadsheet for the entries. I am currently at 340~ entries, and I'm just waiting before I can put a "cutoff" for the first round of data processing. Maybe in a week?

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of.

Blaise Pascal

fpn_1336709688__pen_01.jpg

Tell me about any of your new pens and help with fountain pen quality control research!

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