Toledo

[Gobblecup]

 

I guess the correct price/value is whatever the market is willing to bear? Since mine is brand new, un-inked, I would think it's worth a bit more than the used ones? I guess I can throw it on fleabay and take my chances. Perhaps I'll set a high starting bid, maybe not quite as high as the $7.5k.

 

I'll be surprised if many young people are into fountain pens like gen-x and older folks. I know that schools stopped teaching cursive about 20 years ago and asking my nephew, who is gen-z, he doesn't even do much hand writing at all as he types faster than he can write. He does just about everything on his laptop now: taking notes, homework, etc.

I was born in the 90s and have used fountain pens exclusively since my teens, I see many people my age and younger using and collecting within their varied means all the time on reddit, instagram, and in person while at university. Furthermore, tastes may be changing, I see more attention to most modern pens than nostalgia for the popular American vintage brands these days among the younger generation of fountain pen users. This may contribute to why you don't cross paths with us often.

 

As for a pens value being inked or uninked. I consider it price gouging to distinguish price based solely on inked vs. uninked. A pen may have microscratches uninked, and another may have been inked and not have them. I refuse to pay a premium for a pen which has never been inked or dipped. I think that's the whole point of a pen (to ink it)! Inking for testing the writing is essential to knowing if the pen will work well once used. I know why people try to charge a premium for uninked pens, but what really maters is the condition of the pen's materials, filling system, and nib. Only leaving a pen inked for months or years unused would change the value of a sale to me. This isn't a car market where driving off the lot it suddenly depreciates the vehicle by 15%. Even that is a little ridiculous to me, especially when its still considered "new" after a test drive. If you cannot actually tell if the pen has had ink in it before what is the difference, that money disappears as soon a the pen touches ink? I use my pens, why lose 15% or more of my money for something inevitable?

Edited March 5, 2020 by Gobblecup

[Bo Bo Olson]

'green silver Pelikan Toledo'....which had slipped my mind such existed.

Then I saw one in a live auction lot. I actually held it....but there was no way I could afford it, considering the lot had a 149, a W.Germany 800, Cd'A, Waterman, Senator and some sort of Parker I think. I only looked at the two Pelikans.

At the auction in a buy rush...I went 1/3 over my limit, not counting the 30% auction and sales tax.

Skinny times are here. My next ink buy is late 2024.

I'll be picking up my green silver Pelikan Toledo on Monday.

I have no idea what nib widths are on any of those pens.....after all, all I was going to do was .

[peroride]

Congratulations ! that appears to be a lovely rare bird or rather deer? 😅 Pelikan Souveran M915 "Hunting"

[mizgeorge]

2 hours ago, Bo Bo Olson said:

 

 

Oh my! Just look at the pretty pens 😍

[Bo Bo Olson]

Thanks Peroride for the info.....Pelikan Souveran M915 "Hunting".

It could well be.....I really can't tell....in as I said, I didn't study the pen in I'd not expected to go bat crazy and buy that lot of top class pens.

 

Got to go over to Watermann and find out which that one is. In I am totally ignorant of Watermann. I had a fingerprint trap chrome one as one of my first pens, but sold it quickly. (Not counting my two superflex '52's.)

 

Misgeorge, I agree.

 

It is of course unfortunate that the owner died; and I missed talking to him, in he had to be from the Heidelberg area.

There was another lot of great pens in a bag; like this one, including two W.Germany 800's and another lot three old just after (or one just before) the war MB's, two of the three nibs were at least semi-flex. I still get that feeling when running into semi or maxi-semi-flex nibs.

 

I didn't really look at them to see what they were marked as, there were folks waiting to get at the poor overworked lady at the jewelry and odds and ends counter. We had to wait 15 minutes as was, and my wife had things to look at, so I hurried a bit. The MB's were standard sized, not the medium-large then 146. (The large 146 came in @ 1970.) Normally I strive to stay away from MB in live auctions; in they go for high prices.

What they went for I don't know, in I left after winning my lot. (Come Monday the prices will be up, so will come back to this thread with that.)

That man had such a fine collection of pens.

 

[peroride]

16 hours ago, Bo Bo Olson said:

That man had such a fine collection of pens.

 

I'm going to venture a guess that he would be pleased 🕊️ to know his cherished pens were in good hands of knowledgeable and passionate pen enthusiasts like you, @Bo Bo Olson

 

I told my wife when i kick the bucket; keep what you want and for the rest, sell the good stuff to good people 🌱

 

Write on!

 

 

[Bo Bo Olson]

Due to Corona, it will be Thursday afternoon before I can pick up my four items; the pens are 'one' of that lot.

[Bo Bo Olson]

The thin black one is a pen I'd only read about in passing is a Waterman Man 100 (second edition.) Top of the line and much liked by Waterman folks.

The silver plated capped thin one is a MB Noblesse Doue marble Red lacquer. A seldom pen.  (It was a good thing I was bidding against a dealer...who would have made out like a bandit.)

The man must have cleaned all his pens at least in this lot well before putting them down, in they look so minty.)

That woody looking one is the Diplomat....when I'd thought it to be the Waterman....in my lack of attention at the time of drooling over a Toledo. Nice regular flex nib.

That 149 has one Humongous nib, (second biggest I've ever owned)  and the pen is near half an inch longer than the 1005, I have. Wife wants me to keep the big 149.....sigh, one has to listen to one's wife....sometimes they are right.

 

The wife had no trouble clearing enough space in the top of my two shelf,three pens shelf glass topped cherry pen case, to put in my brag pens.........sigh cubed, whom am I to brag too? The guy who I got up to speed in pens has just seen them......bunch of uncultured folks visit, no real interest in my pens; not even my swords, of which three or four are brag pieces.  The 1900 Dutch cutlass in my hallway is my main house defense item; I can bend down enough not to stab the ceiling. Not a brag piece....but I like it.

 

 

[peroride]

5 hours ago, Bo Bo Olson said:

sigh, one has to listen to one's wife....sometimes they are right.

There's a old expression my dear one is fond of saying: the man is the head of the household and the woman is the neck that turns it. Despite a few extravagances over the years, I still have my pen collection so my head must be moving in the appropriate direction 😆

 

As for the collection, congratulations on the lucky strike! I would have gone for the black Pelikan semi-flexies, Le Man and 149 in that order; I'm pretty boring. The pens indeed look minty and it's nice to know they can live on in others.

 

Wunderbar!

[Bo Bo Olson]

The '82-91 W.Germany nibs are not semi-flex, but a tad more springy regular flex of '91-97. In '98, the 800 became a nail, the 400/600 became semi-nails of today. Fat and blobby nibs. The '82-97 nibs write with a nice clean line. The 200's nib is still a great nib, springy regular flex (the 'soft' nib of the Japanese),  with proper tipping for a nice clean line.

 

I have now; a W. Germany nib in 200 OM, the small 600 OB, and now the 800 OM, they just miss what one gets with a semi-flex 140,400/400nn in oblique. There is real line variation, in non-oblique 140,400/400nn also.

Normal regular flex oblique is really having to hunt for the line variation; not much when one is spoiled. Nail obliques, give absolutely no line variation....had the misfortune to having had a Lamy 27 OM (sold), and a Lamy Persona in OB, that Pendelton Brown made into a real nice CI............that's all you can do with nail obliques is stub or CI them.....

I really, really suggest getting semi-flex '50-65 Pelikan or '@ 50-70 in Geha or MB in oblique if you are going to get one. I am So Spoiled and have been for a decade.

 

I can remember 12 years ago, when spending up to 19 Euro was being wild with my money. But back then I was in the Pen of the Week in the Mail Club.

 

Then came my first BCHR....and it is still the sharpest pattern, a no name but I didn't ever think I was going to get one....now have 4-5 not counting my two 52's.

70E was a fortune......some time after I joined the Pen of the Month in the Mail Club, finally the pen of the quarter.

Then after a while I went over to buying only at live auctions; where I could test the nib.....had to fight Dealers only, not collectors with deep pockets...

 

 

 

That I didn't even recognize the Waterman Man 100 (or even thinking it could be a Gentleman), shows how narrow my mania had become. The nib is still regular flex.

To tell the truth, in I was never going to get those pens, I thought the brownish woody looking pen the Watermann, and thought the black pen that wasn't MB or Pelikan a Diplomat...(Diplomat use to be sued regularly by MB for making a cigar shaped pen)...didn't even realize there was a MB Noblesse in the lot. All I had eyes for was to Sigh over the W.Germany 800, over the Toledo.

 

Haven't inked any yet, have enough pens inked (afterall, it's only been since yesterday night)............wife said don't in they look mint, but I'd have to buy another wall, if all I'm going to do is display pens.

[Bo Bo Olson]

Oh, well there seems to be no edit function. I just wanted to add all were 18k/750 nibs including the MB's.

In there were era's when MB used 14K/585 nibs.

[BaronWulfraed]

1 hour ago, Bo Bo Olson said:

Oh, well there seems to be no edit function. I just wanted to add all were 18k/750 nibs including the MB's.

In there were era's when MB used 14K/585 nibs.

 

Did you click on the  *** at the top right of your post?

[Bo Bo Olson]

No....thanks for the tip.

[sketchstack]

General question: What are the sizing conventions of the Toledo models?

 

Is the M9XX the same size as the normal M800? 

 

Thanks for any insight

[zaddick]

1 hour ago, sketchstack said:

General question: What are the sizing conventions of the Toledo models?

 

Is the M9XX the same size as the normal M800? 

 

Thanks for any insight

Yes, the M900 toledo models as the M800 size. The M700 toledo is the size of the m600 standard pen. There are some M1000 size models with metal barrels but they are not really Toledo models. 

[N1003U]

13 hours ago, zaddick said:

Yes, the M900 toledo models as the M800 size. The M700 toledo is the size of the m600 standard pen. There are some M1000 size models with metal barrels but they are not really Toledo models. 

 

Is the current M700 Toledo (or any M7xx pen for that matter) based on the M600 or the M400? The size dimensions seem a lot closer to the modern M400, though it is heavier than both.

[Bo Bo Olson]

I had thought the 700=400, but I've only seen one and that was 8 or so years ago.

Pelikan Perch says is a 400 size.

 

The modern large 600 started after '97, and there were many small Toledo's made before back to the 100/100n era.

The earlier small 400 sized 600 ended in '97. Don't remember when it started.

 

 

 

I've got to explain to my wife why I need a 'normal' colored Toledo, in I lucked into a Hunter.

[sargetalon]

M9xx = M8xx

M7xx = M4xx

[N1003U]

1 hour ago, sargetalon said:

M9xx = M8xx

M7xx = M4xx

Of course.

 

If I have trouble breathing, or need detailed technical information on Pelikan products, I know exactly where to go...thanks!

[zaddick]

Thanks for the correction all. I don't use the smaller pens myself so I misremembered. Apologies for any confusion I created.