Black Swan In North African Violets

[JimB]

You are probably completely right about the best way to measure with precision. But as I mixed my recipes, I make notes, try to get exact amounts listed, but invariably I end up adding an additional drop or two of color a or color b to get the color to look the way I like it best. Add to that the variability of the packaged inks (think changes in ingredients from Nathan, or that fiasco over Omas Blue), the relationship of ink to pens/nibs and paper, and you get a slippery slope. Worse, I just filled my almost empty pen that had been using BSiNAV with ink from a bottle that I thought held the same, finding later that I confused it with a bottle of BSiAR!

 

With my record of sloppy record keeping and bad memory, a tare weigh scale would be as useless as a journal for my dog. :roflmho:

 

For those scientifically inclined ink baristas, your suggestion is probably a welcome godsend.

[Fabienne]

I just mixed up a perfect rendition of BSINAV yesterday. The only problem I had was that both HOD an NAV are so opaque that it is hard to see where they are in a syringe or even a lab beaker! Just have to make sure that you don't tilt the beaker and coat the sides of it to the level is hidden.

 

I just think BSINAV is the shiz-nitz. Really beautiful shading purple. Made me sad that DC Supershow Violet doesn't give the same shading (at least for me) but I still like it. I also like NAV on its own. Oh dear! So much purple.

[lapis]

I just mixed up a perfect rendition of BSINAV yesterday. The only problem I had was that both HOD an NAV are so opaque that it is hard to see where they are in a syringe or even a lab beaker! Just have to make sure that you don't tilt the beaker and coat the sides of it to the level is hidden.

 

I just think BSINAV is the shiz-nitz. Really beautiful shading purple. Made me sad that DC Supershow Violet doesn't give the same shading (at least for me) but I still like it. I also like NAV on its own. Oh dear! So much purple.

The best thing to do here -- IMO -- and, yes, assuming that you have same -- is to use a good balance. Like one out of a medical/science lab. Then weigh everything in. I do this all the time. Especially quicker, opaqueness-proof, and easier to clean and more accurate. I consider that 1 ml = 1 g and 1 ml = 20 drops. Roughly of course but IMO accurate enough since differences here are usually in exactly the same direction i.e. constant enough. You can also use a medical pipette like the Gilson "pipetman". All of the FP inks I've yet tried have a density of about 1.01-1.03. HOD comes in at 1.023

 

The problem is the type of dropper used. A HOD dropper, any pipette, a syringe... all of these can be considerably different in yield.

 

Mike

[HeartMan]

When mixing bulletproof black with the NAV, is the resulting blend bulletproof at all?

[Fabienne]

Thanks, Lapis. That was good advice.

 

I do think that the key in a lot of these things is consistency. If you use a certain sort of pipette, use that kind of pipette all the time. That way at least you can reproduce your results and let others know how to do the same. I am in the business of being able to reproduce exact copies of liquid products and that MO has worked for me.

[inkstainedruth]

I just mixed up a perfect rendition of BSINAV yesterday. The only problem I had was that both HOD an NAV are so opaque that it is hard to see where they are in a syringe or even a lab beaker! Just have to make sure that you don't tilt the beaker and coat the sides of it to the level is hidden.

 

I just think BSINAV is the shiz-nitz. Really beautiful shading purple. Made me sad that DC Supershow Violet doesn't give the same shading (at least for me) but I still like it. I also like NAV on its own. Oh dear! So much purple.

The best thing to do here -- IMO -- and, yes, assuming that you have same -- is to use a good balance. Like one out of a medical/science lab. Then weigh everything in. I do this all the time. Especially quicker, opaqueness-proof, and easier to clean and more accurate. I consider that 1 ml = 1 g and 1 ml = 20 drops. Roughly of course but IMO accurate enough since differences here are usually in exactly the same direction i.e. constant enough. You can also use a medical pipette like the Gilson "pipetman". All of the FP inks I've yet tried have a density of about 1.01-1.03. HOD comes in at 1.023

 

The problem is the type of dropper used. A HOD dropper, any pipette, a syringe... all of these can be considerably different in yield.

 

Mike

 

But wouldn't you get a different yield (even by weighing the "ingredients") because of different amounts of evaporation from the bottle/vial, as well as the (as someone else noted) different ingredients from batch to batch of your base colors?

edit: by yield of course I mean the specific color/property desired (I just hit the send button too quickly...)

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

who really cannot afford to get a *second* tare scale, just to do ink mixing with....

Edited April 2, 2012 by inkstainedruth

[lapis]

I just mixed up a perfect rendition of BSINAV yesterday. The only problem I had was that both HOD an NAV are so opaque that it is hard to see where they are in a syringe or even a lab beaker! Just have to make sure that you don't tilt the beaker and coat the sides of it to the level is hidden.

 

I just think BSINAV is the shiz-nitz. Really beautiful shading purple. Made me sad that DC Supershow Violet doesn't give the same shading (at least for me) but I still like it. I also like NAV on its own. Oh dear! So much purple.

The best thing to do here -- IMO -- and, yes, assuming that you have same -- is to use a good balance. Like one out of a medical/science lab. Then weigh everything in. I do this all the time. Especially quicker, opaqueness-proof, and easier to clean and more accurate. I consider that 1 ml = 1 g and 1 ml = 20 drops. Roughly of course but IMO accurate enough since differences here are usually in exactly the same direction i.e. constant enough. You can also use a medical pipette like the Gilson "pipetman". All of the FP inks I've yet tried have a density of about 1.01-1.03. HOD comes in at 1.023

 

The problem is the type of dropper used. A HOD dropper, any pipette, a syringe... all of these can be considerably different in yield.

 

Mike

 

But wouldn't you get a different yield (even by weighing the "ingredients") because of different amounts of evaporation from the bottle/vial, as well as the (as someone else noted) different ingredients from batch to batch of your base colors?

edit: by yield of course I mean the specific color/property desired (I just hit the send button too quickly...)

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

who really cannot afford to get a *second* tare scale, just to do ink mixing with....

Ruth, I'm not sure that I understand. You won't get any significant different yield due to different amounts of evaporation, regardless of the bottle or vial. Whether you measure by volume or by weight. Let's say you have a brand new bottle or each ink. The evaporation at the start is practically zilch. If both bottles are only about x% full (or empty ) the the evaporation of each will be practically the same, and both will be possibly more concentrated (saturated) so that the product of the mix will also be saturated. That too depends on how long you have been opening and closing a bottle. (I.e. if you use up a whole bottle in one week, the concentration effect will be negligible, whereas if you open and close the bottle to fill'er up every month for a year or more, there will of course be more evaporation.

Maybe what you mean is the following? Let's say I have a brand new bottle of NAV full to the brim (zero evaportion) but my bottle of HOD is so empty that there are at most 2-3 drops of ink left in the eye-dropper. Whether you use the drop method or the pipette method (as Fabienne and I suggested, using one and the same type of pipette each time) or use a scale, you're still going to get yield differences in comparison to the yield out of two brand new, hitherto unopened bottles, but you can't avoid that.

Charges can make a difference but you can't comb that out with any method of addition without first analyzing what the charge differences themselves are.

 

Whew

[tdeecy]

On some of what you wrote with the mixture I'm seeing blue at the top of letters and black at the lower parts. Two separate ink colors.

Why do you think that happened? Could it be because the two inks did not want to bind chemically, or perhaps because they remained separate after mixing them for another reason?

Interesting result.

 

T.

[Muncle]

I just mixed some of this up tonight, from samples that I got his weekend It's a fantastic ink, although I wish I had read through to the second page, with the staining warning. It's in my Parkette, which has a nice semi-flex nib, and it does a great job of shading to black. I guess I'll just have to be diligent in its use and clean-up once it empties!

[CatBookMom]

Australian Roses was nearly the first ink I bought from Goulet, and I still have it in steady use. English Roses is just too brown, and Blue Nose Bear was very disappointing.

 

This, now, is very appealing in your scans. Gotta try it. I've got a sample of NAV in my cart. Goulet may sell out of this ink again.

[JimB]

I just mixed some of this up tonight, from samples that I got his weekend It's a fantastic ink, although I wish I had read through to the second page, with the staining warning. It's in my Parkette, which has a nice semi-flex nib, and it does a great job of shading to black. I guess I'll just have to be diligent in its use and clean-up once it empties!

OR -- keep that as your dedicated BSiNAV pen? I have one.

[JimB]

duplicate info, un-needed. Sorry!

Edited April 24, 2012 by januaryman

[crunchmaster]

Hm. It just occurred to me that I should put a warning in the first post about potential staining--I've seen it, although I'm not sure if it's mostly just NAV itself that's doing it. But there seems to be no way to edit the first post...?

[Wikoster]

Hm. It just occurred to me that I should put a warning in the first post about potential staining--I've seen it, although I'm not sure if it's mostly just NAV itself that's doing it. But there seems to be no way to edit the first post...?

 

I spilled a drop of the NAV inside the section grip of my TWSBI diamond (and didn't notice it for a while as I was mixing the BSiNAV inside the barrel with a syringe for a bit) and the section grip is a very light lavender now. I don't know if the mixture of HoD and NAV will create a more stain prone ink, but I have not had any experience with HoD leaving a shade of black after a rinse/scrub/rinse. I'll try an actual surfactant, but I kind of like the light purple color. I'm curious to see how stained the barrel itself is once I use all this wonderful ink. (Kudos to the ink alchemists here, this color is a new favorite of mine!)

 

-William

[JimB]

HoD never left a stain behind in any of my pens. Ever. NAV is the "culprit" here. Still, well worth the bother, or, if you have a open mind, it makes wonderful purplish demonstrators!

[CatBookMom]

I'm finally coming back to this. I have 2.5ml of NAV, so I put in less than .5ml of HOD. The math said 1/3ml (2.5/7.5 from the original recipe), but that's beyond the exactitude of my measuring equipment (a Goulet ink syringe). I'm initially dedicating a Platinum Preppy to this, just happen to have a purple .05mm one, seems just right, and I'll dump the ink in the Platinum cartridge to replace with BSiNAV.

 

I immediately saw the speckling on the sides at the top of the ink vial with the mixture in it. Did anyone decide if this is precipitate or what?

[JimB]

I used the Goulet syringe also. Exactitude was not that necessary, but I needed to get close. It worked out fine. As for the appearance of dark "particles," it's nothing that ever clogged any of my pens.

[CatBookMom]

Reporting lack of success. My original effort was essentially a dusty black with purple tones, and I've added more purple. Will try again after it sits for a while.

 

Slightly OT, if you drop some of this on your clothes (my cartridge went rolling away, bouncing and gaily flinging droplets here and there :embarrassed_smile: ), I found that immediate application of Amodex, following the directions in the package, did remove the ink.

[JimB]

Thanks for the Amodex tip. I just ordered some.

[JimB]

Reporting lack of success. My original effort was essentially a dusty black with purple tones, and I've added more purple. Will try again after it sits for a while.

 

Slightly OT, if you drop some of this on your clothes (my cartridge went rolling away, bouncing and gaily flinging droplets here and there :embarrassed_smile: ), I found that immediate application of Amodex, following the directions in the package, did remove the ink.

 

Maybe your nib is too fine? I need a flex pen or a 0.8 CI nib to appreciate the shading. The Black Swan inks cry out for a flex pen.