Wet Tests: Pelikan Blueblack, Legal Lapis, M B Midnight Blue

[Sandy1]

Hello,

 

This wee set of samples was made to support discussion of water resistance of some inks; and the manner in which water resistance is examined and reported.

 

Some Member/s mentioned rubbing an ink-bearing piece of wet paper to emulate a nefarious act [by an amateur / spur of the moment villain]. Running water, whether under a tap or with the spray featured on some kitchen sinks, or in the hamam, ErHmm.

 

My approach is simply to take some water from a typical sink of dishwashing water, (liquid washing-up detergent plus a thimble of household bleach), and place the written sample into the wee dish of that water. I let it sit for at least four hours, never more than ten. It seems that there is no real change to the ink after a half-hour soak. The paper is a different story though - it starts to revert to pulp after about an eight hour soak. Ick!

 

Rubbing the surface of the wet paper is very likely to damage the surface of the paper, making the tampering obvious. So, it seems that although the inked image may remain, problems with the paper stock, (e.g. warping, wrinkles, texture, hand), may well indicate villains about.

 

But, I address domestic accidents, setting aside nefarious acts, industrial hazmat incidents, bio/chem lab accidents. Those Members involved in such chemical resistance sampling are often addressing hazards they foresee as being realistic in their occupation, hobby, etc. So those are beyond the scope of a wet test.

 

I also do a 'Splatter' test, which is dripping water from an eyedropper, to emulate rain, sneezes, perspiration dripping from one's brow, wet dogs shaking themselves, etc. This does not allow the dissolved ink to be washed away.

From personal experience, when ink-laden paper gets splattered, the best thing may be soak the page to remove all soluble ink components. Ink-side down in a pan/sink of still water does the trick for Quick Blue-Black, olde version.

 

YMMV to a huge degree!

 

Please run your own samples with your daily writer inks and papers. It takes next to no time, and is a risk management thingy.

 

To generate some metrics, the '4S Scale' for water resistance samples was devised, and is used in my Ink Reviews.

 

So enough chit chat, let's cut to the chase:

 

 

Please take a moment to adjust the brightness & contrast of your monitor to accurately depict this Gray Scale.

As the patches are neutral gray, their colour on your monitor should also be neutral gray.

• Mac My link
  
• Wintel PC My link
  

Figure 1. Gray Scale.

http://i783.photobucket.com/albums/yy116/Sandy1-1/InkyThoughts2010/INK576-1.jpg

 

WRITTEN SAMPLES - Moby Dick.

 

Figure 2.

Simple written text to portray routine appearance of the inks:

Row 1 - Pelikan 4001 Blue-Black, no claims of water resistance, etc.

Row 2 - Noodler's Legal Lapis, claims to be 'bulletproof'

Row 3 - Montblanc Midnight Blue, claims to have iron-gall content

Row 4 - Pelikan 4001 Blue-Black, no claims of water resistance etc.

http://i783.photobucket.com/albums/yy116/Sandy1-1/InkyThoughts2010/WetTest1/c3d24b1c.jpg

 

 

Drawn loop-the-loops & 2 horizontal lines, subjected to:

Column A - Splatter.

Column B - Soapy Soak; and some tries at scrubbing wet paper.

Column C - Control, nothing done.

Column D - More Soapy Soak.

Inks:

Row 1 - PRB

Row 2 - NLL

Row 3 - MBMBl

Row 4 - PRB

Figure 2.

Paper : HPJ1124

http://i783.photobucket.com/albums/yy116/Sandy1-1/InkyThoughts2010/WetTest1/25816f2a.jpg

Figure 3.

Paper : Royal, 25% cotton rag content.

http://i783.photobucket.com/albums/yy116/Sandy1-1/InkyThoughts2010/WetTest1/425c6248.jpg

Figure 4.

Loop-the-loops & text, written with the top of the nib, on bank-check paper stock, soaked and rubbed.

(Extremely wrinkled & warped.)

http://i783.photobucket.com/albums/yy116/Sandy1-1/InkyThoughts2010/WetTest1/2093f13d.jpg

Note: I neglected to include the drawn scales. The sample above is tiny, a mere 63mm wide ⇔

 

No HiRes Scans! The line quality after Soapy Soak was remarkably 'clean' after the samples dried.

 

Bye,

Sandy1

 

===============

 

MATERIEL

 

Pen: Pelikan M200 with M200-series g-p steel Medium nib.

Papers: As above.

Inks: As above.

Labels: Pilot 78G+F with Quink Red

 

++++++++++++

 

Images - The usual Epson V600.

 

-30-

Edited October 2, 2010 by Sandy1

[Chrontius]

Oh wow. Legal lapis is really green. I hadn't expected that. Oh well, I bought some anyway.

 

Thank you for the review, Sandy

Edited October 2, 2010 by Chrontius

[BobR]

Thank you. Two surprises--the Pelikan BB is more water-resistant than I thought--and the Montblanc Midnight is less! As a matter of fact, the Pelikan seems to do better in your tests than the allegedly iron-gall Midnight Blue. My old Montblanc BB is quite resistant, I thought the Midnight Blue was the same ink. Am I wrong or am I seeing things?

[Russ]

Thank you for posting this test. I began working on a Pel Blue-Black test recently, and am encouraged by what I see here.

[Sandy1]

Oh wow. Legal lapis is really green. I hadn't expected that. Oh well, I bought some anyway.

 

Thank you for the review, Sandy

Hi,

 

Yes indeed - NLL is a foggy green.

Whenever I use the stuff, I much prefer a wet writer to generate a darker line.

And then there's the chalky appearance to the ink, which is not apparent from the scans.

And the ink creeping up the pen's nib embarrasses the nib - so perhaps a writer with a hooded nib, yes?

 

Bye,

S1

[Sandy1]

Thank you. Two surprises--the Pelikan BB is more water-resistant than I thought--and the Montblanc Midnight is less! As a matter of fact, the Pelikan seems to do better in your tests than the allegedly iron-gall Midnight Blue. My old Montblanc BB is quite resistant, I thought the Midnight Blue was the same ink. Am I wrong or am I seeing things?

Hi,

 

The Pelikan BlBk is impressive - and not only in the Wet Tests!

 

The MBMBl, like all i-g inks, is compromised by even the slightest bit of bleach - which is an ingredient in my Soapy Soak. A plain water soak would've yielded a somewhat less-changed line. But, the MBMBl does have water soluble components that rinse away with little provocation. The remaining image is quite stable.

 

☞ I think this is a key aspect to looking at Wet Tests. So long as I can read what's left after a soak, I consider the ink OK. Other practitioners, especially those dealing with multi-colour docs / docs where the colour & density must be accurate, would never accept such a result.

 

One might take a look at the Ink Review of MBMBl, (My link), where aspects were compared to the departing MBBlBk.

 

Same ink? Well, IMHO, yes; or so close it's not worth getting fussed about. And I am very familiar with both.

 

Bye,

S1

Edited October 2, 2010 by Sandy1

[calhoun tubbs]

Impressive results from Pelikan Blue-Black! It certainly reassuring to find that the ink I use for notes is great for the purpose. Thanks for putting up the tests.

[Faulkner]

Hi there.

Have you tried Pel BB on Moleskine? What about bleedthrough. I use Montblanc BB mainly because doesn't bleed but I might consider Pelikan if it behaves nicely on bad quality-moleskine paper

[JohnS-MI]

Oh wow. Legal lapis is really green. I hadn't expected that. Oh well, I bought some anyway.

 

Thank you for the review, Sandy

Hi,

 

Yes indeed - NLL is a foggy green.

Whenever I use the stuff, I much prefer a wet writer to generate a darker line.

And then there's the chalky appearance to the ink, which is not apparent from the scans.

And the ink creeping up the pen's nib embarrasses the nib - so perhaps a writer with a hooded nib, yes?

 

Bye,

S1

 

NLL "leans" green. With a wetter writer, it is not quite so green. I use it in a rather wet P51 and it is a slightly greenish blue-black. The color isn't bad, but certainly not my favorite. Its strong point: In the tests above, it didn't even notice it was being tested. The others suffered some "wear and tear."

 

With a dry writer, the color is (to me) quite a bit more disappointing. Be sure to shake the bottle before filling.

[Sandy1]

Hi there.

Have you tried Pel BB on Moleskine? What about bleedthrough. I use Montblanc BB mainly because doesn't bleed but I might consider Pelikan if it behaves nicely on bad quality-moleskine paper

Hi,

 

I don't use a Journal, so I'm not familiar with Moleskine paper. I have looked at a few in the shops, but couldn't rationalise the (wide) appeal; and the paper was unimpressive - and that's just looking at it!

 

However, I was gifted with a QuoVadis Habana journal with unlined buff-colour paper. Nice item! But working both sides of a page - it really does need to be used with an i-g ink, or at least a very dry ink from a writer with less than normal wetness. (I'm fiddling about with Brown inks just now, so I'm using that paper for some ad hoc sampling of inks - not impressive paper performance at all.)

 

When I'm in the field, I'll use the odd-numbered pages for my notes, and the facing even-numbered pages for addenda, illustrations, etc., so the paper must perform well. I haven't found a truly acceptable one yet.

 

Bye,

S1

Edited October 2, 2010 by Sandy1

[Russ]

Hi there.

Have you tried Pel BB on Moleskine? What about bleedthrough. I use Montblanc BB mainly because doesn't bleed but I might consider Pelikan if it behaves nicely on bad quality-moleskine paper

I haven't found a truly acceptable one yet.

 

Bye,

S1

 

You might consider the Exacompta Sketch Book, item #9920. They handle my wettest pens and inks; absolutely no bleedthrough. I have filled about six of them. The creamy, thick paper is delightful.

[Russ]

While Pel BlBk is on topic, can anyone suggest a lubricant? I tried dishwashing soap, but it just increased flow. Smoothness didn't seem affected. I haven't tried glycerine yet, but it's next on my list. I like this ink; I just wish for that Noodler's Polar flow.

[Sandy1]

Oh wow. Legal lapis is really green. I hadn't expected that. Oh well, I bought some anyway.

 

Thank you for the review, Sandy

Hi,

 

Yes indeed - NLL is a foggy green.

Whenever I use the stuff, I much prefer a wet writer to generate a darker line.

And then there's the chalky appearance to the ink, which is not apparent from the scans.

And the ink creeping up the pen's nib embarrasses the nib - so perhaps a writer with a hooded nib, yes?

 

Bye,

S1

 

NLL "leans" green. With a wetter writer, it is not quite so green. I use it in a rather wet P51 and it is a slightly greenish blue-black. The color isn't bad, but certainly not my favorite. Its strong point: In the tests above, it didn't even notice it was being tested. The others suffered some "wear and tear."

 

With a dry writer, the color is (to me) quite a bit more disappointing. Be sure to shake the bottle before filling.

Hi,

 

I haven't taken to shaking the bottle before inking-up, so perhaps that explains the difference in colour. (??)

But - is the colour of NLL in these samples even close to your results?? (An image would be nice to have for comparison. And then we could do another: 'Stirred - not shaken.')

 

Indeed, the soapy soak and splatter don't faze the NLL. And that's why its part of my array - certainly not for the odd colour!

 

Bye,

S1

[Sandy1]

Hi there.

Have you tried Pel BB on Moleskine? What about bleedthrough. I use Montblanc BB mainly because doesn't bleed but I might consider Pelikan if it behaves nicely on bad quality-moleskine paper

I haven't found a truly acceptable one yet.

 

Bye,

S1

 

You might consider the Exacompta Sketch Book, item #9920. They handle my wettest pens and inks; absolutely no bleedthrough. I have filled about six of them. The creamy, thick paper is delightful.

Hi -- Thank-you for the suggestion! l'll give it a go. -- Bye, S1

[dizzypen]

Oh wow. Legal lapis is really green. I hadn't expected that. Oh well, I bought some anyway.

 

Thank you for the review, Sandy

Hi,

 

Yes indeed - NLL is a foggy green.

Whenever I use the stuff, I much prefer a wet writer to generate a darker line.

And then there's the chalky appearance to the ink, which is not apparent from the scans.

And the ink creeping up the pen's nib embarrasses the nib - so perhaps a writer with a hooded nib, yes?

 

Bye,

S1

 

Legal Lapis is one of those funny sorts of ink colors. Mine is much more blue. Sort of a navyish blue-green.

 

I don't know if it's batch variations or varying degrees of shaking the bottle before use, but I've never been able to get mine to go as green as what I see in online reviews and even a few snails.

 

http://dizzypen.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/nd-legal-lapis-card.jpg

 

:hmm1:

[carpedavid]

Excellent comparison test, Sandy1! Very interesting results. I think I need to go back and perform another water test on the Pelikan BB, which is, if I recall correctly, the ink that started this topic.

 

Dave

[Sandy1]

Oh wow. Legal lapis is really green. I hadn't expected that. Oh well, I bought some anyway.

 

Thank you for the review, Sandy

Hi,

 

Yes indeed - NLL is a foggy green.

Whenever I use the stuff, I much prefer a wet writer to generate a darker line.

And then there's the chalky appearance to the ink, which is not apparent from the scans.

And the ink creeping up the pen's nib embarrasses the nib - so perhaps a writer with a hooded nib, yes?

 

Bye,

S1

 

Legal Lapis is one of those funny sorts of ink colors. Mine is much more blue. Sort of a navyish blue-green.

 

I don't know if it's batch variations or varying degrees of shaking the bottle before use, but I've never been able to get mine to go as green as what I see in online reviews and even a few snails.

 

http://dizzypen.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/nd-legal-lapis-card.jpg

 

:hmm1:

 

:hmm1:

Now that iteration of NLL, I would buy for the persistence-on-paper properties AND colour!

I suppose there is more batch variation than expected; but in a way those batches become 'vintages' if you will, with some more desirable than others. (??)

[Chrontius]

How much do you shake your bottles? I didn't at all and ended up with something like the original post, but I really prefer the bluer side of the blue-black. I love how the stuff writes and how the stuff sticks, but it's a creepy ink in a creepy pen (TWSBI) and I end up with ink spatter all up in the cap.

 

Oh wow. Legal lapis is really green. I hadn't expected that. Oh well, I bought some anyway.

 

Thank you for the review, Sandy

Hi,

 

Yes indeed - NLL is a foggy green.

Whenever I use the stuff, I much prefer a wet writer to generate a darker line.

And then there's the chalky appearance to the ink, which is not apparent from the scans.

And the ink creeping up the pen's nib embarrasses the nib - so perhaps a writer with a hooded nib, yes?

 

Bye,

S1

 

Legal Lapis is one of those funny sorts of ink colors. Mine is much more blue. Sort of a navyish blue-green.

 

I don't know if it's batch variations or varying degrees of shaking the bottle before use, but I've never been able to get mine to go as green as what I see in online reviews and even a few snails.

 

http://dizzypen.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/nd-legal-lapis-card.jpg

 

:hmm1:

[Northwoods]

How much do you shake your bottles?

 

One should never have to shake a bottle of FP ink. If the ink separates in the bottle, what is it doing in your pen? I can't speak for everyone, but I have no desire to be shaking a pen.

 

LL is an ink-looking ink, albeit a bit dull. It's an ink I'll use when I want the water resistance, but otherwise, I find Diamine Twilight to be a very similar tone, but with quite a bit more life to it. It appears that the chalkiness is the price of permanence.

[dizzypen]

How much do you shake your bottles? I didn't at all and ended up with something like the original post, but I really prefer the bluer side of the blue-black. I love how the stuff writes and how the stuff sticks, but it's a creepy ink in a creepy pen (TWSBI) and I end up with ink spatter all up in the cap.

 

Oh wow. Legal lapis is really green. I hadn't expected that. Oh well, I bought some anyway.

 

Thank you for the review, Sandy

Hi,

 

Yes indeed - NLL is a foggy green.

Whenever I use the stuff, I much prefer a wet writer to generate a darker line.

And then there's the chalky appearance to the ink, which is not apparent from the scans.

And the ink creeping up the pen's nib embarrasses the nib - so perhaps a writer with a hooded nib, yes?

 

Bye,

S1

 

Legal Lapis is one of those funny sorts of ink colors. Mine is much more blue. Sort of a navyish blue-green.

 

I don't know if it's batch variations or varying degrees of shaking the bottle before use, but I've never been able to get mine to go as green as what I see in online reviews and even a few snails.

 

:hmm1:

 

I shake my bottles just enough so that everything is evened out, then I let it sit for a few minutes to let any bubbles that have formed settle down. I don't shake rigorously, I just sort of turn the bottle over several times sometimes changing directions. You can tell when you've gotten everything well mixed.

 

You will see some people claim that you should NEVER shake a bottle of ink. This is simply not true. There are occasions when you should shake your inks and where you should not. For instance, you should not shake bottles which you suspect may be suffering from SITB. Shaking will not solve that problem and can result in a clogged pen.

 

However, the chemical make up of Noodler's bulletproof ink is such that it needs to be shaken if you want it to remain the same color and have the same characteristics. The maker of Noodler's inks suggests that you shake the bulletproof inks.

 

Now, if folks want to disregard the manufacturer's suggestions then that is their business, but they certainly should not complain when they get inconsistent results.

 

I'd also like to note that I have never had ink "separate" in my pens. You should never experience this so long as you actually use your pens on a regular basis.

 

It should be painfully obvious that the mere action of picking up your pens and writing with them results in the ink being sloshed back and forth thus keeping everything well integrated. Now, if you fill the pen and let it go unused and unmoved for 2-3 months then who knows what you'll end up with.