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How 'old' is 'Vintage' currently?


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41 replies to this topic

#1 saintsimon

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 02:01

As usuall, I again want to probe the 'obvious'. Given all the intersting talk here about 'vintage' pens: looking backward in time, when does the 'vintage' period start in generall/ for you/as commonly accepted/as bitterly disputed ? 80s, 70s, 60s, 50s, 40s?

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#2 OldGriz

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 02:12

MMMM interesting question.... I was born in 1948 .. My wife claims I am vintage.... or is that just OLD...
I like to think anything 40yrs or more... but what do I know... I'm OLD
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#3 Titivillus

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 02:22

As usuall, I again want to probe the 'obvious'. Given all the intersting talk here about 'vintage' pens: looking backward in time, when does the 'vintage' period start in generall/ for you/as commonly accepted/as bitterly disputed ?  80s, 70s, 60s, 50s, 40s?

I think that vintage is in the 1950s back while old is 1960 onto 1980 then into modern.



That's my breakdown at least.

K

Edited by Tytyvyllus, 19 February 2006 - 02:22.


#4 JRodriguez

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 02:37

It is a good question. In Texas I know that vintage cars become vintage at the age of 25 - the state actually allows them to begin running without catalytic converters at that age (a part that cuts down big time on pollution). I would guess that most people have their own sense about whether something is vintage or not, and that we'll never be able to actually pin a date to it that everyone would agree with as the younger limit. I think it's similar to how most of us also kind of just have a "sense" about whether something is "vintage" or just old (Potty Mouth)!

#5 Richard

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 02:49

Here's what I say about vintage on my site, on the page that introduces my collection:

In general, vintage pens are pens that were made many years ago. Exactly how old a pen must be to qualify as "vintage" is a matter of opinion; for arbitrary reasons, I consider pens introduced before about 1960 to be vintage. The arbitrariness of this choice becomes clear if you observe that I consider all versions of the Parker "51" (except the modern 51 SE, which is a completely different pen) to be vintage even though the Mark III version wasn’t introduced until about 1969.

It is worth considering that, like wines, a given pen might be considered vintage, not because of its age, but because it is a notable pen, perhaps one of exceptional quality or one whose influence on the pen industry was of more than usual significance. A list of such pens might include the Parker 75, introduced in 1964, and the Sheaffer Connaisseur (aka the Levenger "Seas" series), introduced in 1985.


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#6 JRodriguez

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 03:49

Excellently put Richard. The "51" was exactly what came to mind when I thought of pens that could be considered both vintage or not by picking some arbitrary year.

#7 Michael Wright

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 04:05

If we wanted to look at some agreed meanings, I suppose we could model ourselves on the old motor-car aficion: Veteran, Vintage, Post-Vintage Thoroughbred, Classic. Which recognizes that up to a certain point, even schlock is interesting if it's old enough, but after that point it's only *good* old stuff that's worth keeping.

I, too, think of about 1960 as some kind of watershed. It would be reasonable to take the widespread use of reliable ball-points as marking a real era in the history of writing instruments, like the rise of quartz in the history of timekeepers.

Best

Michael

to whom a "51" is definitely vintage, but a 75 not, though a fine and collectable pen

#8 ballboy

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 19:43

Would all this rating/classifiying of pens make models like the new Parker Duofold 'retro'?
Roger


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#9 JRodriguez

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 20:03

Now that's just a whole other bag of worms. Ahh ... the finer distinctions that drive consumptions (and markets for that matter).

#10 ćon

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 20:59

The year of my birth will one day mark the beginning of modern time, therefore anything made more than 23 years ago...

Realistically, I'm tempted to draw a line around the introduction of cartridge fill pens. So, the Parker 51 and all Sheaffer touchdown and snorkel models would be considered vintage, and any cartridge pens introduced to replace them are modern. That would put the line at various places in the 60's

#11 garythepenman

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 21:05

I've got a fountain pen book at home that has sections in it such as vintage, modern etc.. I'll look at it tonight and see where it draws the line.

Gary
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#12 ballboy

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Posted 19 February 2006 - 22:08

Nice one aeon; I think cartridges could make a good divider of truly vintage and modern.

Gary: yes, will be interesting to hear what your book says.
Roger


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#13 Michael Wright

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Posted 20 February 2006 - 02:44

Would all this rating/classifiying of pens make models like the new Parker Duofold 'retro'?

Oh, yes. But the most selfconsciously retro, IMO, are Waterman. The Phileas is quite jokingly a pastiche of pastness. BTW, one of my peeves is the fact that Waterman built a pen that is clearly an homage to the 100 Year Pen, and then named it for a dance from the wrong decade. It shouldn't be called the Charleston, but more like the Lindy Hop.

Some of the MB LEs are based on earlier models, most notably the Hemingway.

All the best

Michael

#14 garythepenman

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Posted 20 February 2006 - 07:38

Well I looked up in my pen book and they consider any pre 1945 as vintage.

Gary
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#15 Glenn-SC

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Posted 20 February 2006 - 08:59

I'm old but not Vintage!

I vote "pre-1960".

#16 funzoneplanet

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Posted 15 September 2007 - 08:36

I would have to say that anything made before 1970 to me would be considered vintage.
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#17 hexyr

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Posted 15 September 2007 - 08:47

The introduction of cartridges does seem like a logical point.
Or I would say about 40yrs for vintage.
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#18 EventHorizon

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Posted 15 September 2007 - 13:20

I'll throw in my vote for the 1960 threshold also. My Mom always hung her hat on 1950 though.
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#19 Shangas

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Posted 15 September 2007 - 13:44

To me, VINTAGE PENS ended in any of these periods:

1950s - With the introduction of practical ballpoint pens.

- Whenever it was that converters & cartridges became the standard filling-systems for fountain pens (thus phasing out all the other kinds - Aerometric, button, lever etc).

If you asked me for a TIME PERIOD, I would have to say the 1950s or 60s. A lot of stuff changed after WWII.
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#20 George

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Posted 15 September 2007 - 15:05

Hmm, so would a T-1 be vintage, or modern?






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