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I will think long and hard before buying another Italian pen


Titivillus

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I have tried to contact Visconti directly in Italy about my concerns but have received no reply yet ( so your and someone elses inference that people just complain about pen quality here is unfounded :bunny01: ).

 

Kurt, as much as I appreciate your knowledge about and your experience with pens, I have read your story with Visconti so many (perhaps: too many) times on this forum. I totally understand your anger and I think it's important to let others know (I have done so many times also with problematic pen makers). I did by no means infer that you just complain. It's a very valid thing to do. However, after a certain time it becomes unproductive.

 

Anyway, I wish that you'll get a splendid Italian pen should you ever be tempted to buy another one. Would love to see you happy with an Italian! :thumbup:

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I have had some bad experiences with Omas, Stipila, and Montegrappa pens. I understand that any product can have an issue and that some of these issues can sneak past QC. Some issues take a period of use before they show up, others happen between leaving that factory door and arriving at the point of destination. Be it a pen, car, watch, an electronic component, etc. - low cost or high priced items - these things are a fact of life. And it's not just pens from Italy.

 

Many import pens (Italian, German, French, British) are sold to pen dealers through distributors. These distributors work on narrow margins and the level of "technical support" they can provide is dictated by the manufacturer. Most manufacturers want to do the repairs in house for a number of reasons, one being they can see a problem trend and solve the production or design issue and another being that they want to repair it to their standards to protect their brand name. That's why the folks at Kenro can only do so much and we have to wait for the pen to come back from Italy.

 

What I can't tolerate is poor customer service, whether is is from the manufacturer, distributor, or dealer. I went through an awful issue with Montegrappa that took a letter to Richemont's HQ to finally get Montegrappa's attention. They telephoned me, apologized for the situation and provided a remedy to the problem. In the past, I have had nothing but wonderful experiences dealing with Montegrappa/Montblanc repairs in Canada - Olivia has a real passion for writing instruments and does her very best to go above and beyond what the customer expects. I had issues with Omas (almost to the point where I was ready to not buy another Omas pen) and Stipula and they both stepped up to the plate and resolved the issue. Do I wish this would never happen when I buy an expensive pen? You bet, but the joy of owning and using a celluloid fountain pen from Italy far outlasts my being upset with a couple QC issues.

 

Now, the best way I have found to avoid some problem pens is to deal with a good dealer who lets you try the pen. By trying the pen, I mean doing the following:

 

1) Fill the pen with water a couple of times to test the piston filler/converter

2) Bring a couple paper samples with you to test the nib (some paper is better than others, so bring what you use the most and don't test on premium sample paper)

3) Test the nib with ink - good dealers will clean the nib later - Hey Pen Paradise, stop this stupid water only policy!!!

4) Find out store return policies should a defect appear within 14 days of the purchase date.

5) Take time and check the pen's construction: do the tines line up, does the cap fit, are there any loose parts, etc.

6) Don't worry about paying a little more from a good dealer, as quality is long remembered after price is quickly forgotten.

 

Enjoy your next pen and post a review. Not just of the pen, but of the dealer you bought it from.

 

 

"Giving power and money to politicians is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys."

P.J. O'Rourke

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Well, I guess I learn something everyday - the same kind of thread regarding quality control (almost an identical one in fact) is going on right now over in the Pelikan Forum. So, as some posts here have been saying - no single country of origin is guilty of bad quality control - apparently it happens everywhere. Shameful - utterly shameful is all I can say for companies in any country to sell expensive pens that don't write!!!!!

 

There is also the same interpersonal relationship issues going on over there - people with pen problems complaining and those who haven't had problems preferring to "play Ostrich" by sticking their heads in the sand and refusing to admit that their beloved brand of pen could ever have such a problem (based by the way purely on the fact that they never had a problem so they won't believe it is possible for others to have one)! Quite absurd in fact - don't you think?

 

Still others who have no pen problems are chastising the ones with pen problems and making them feel uncomfortable about it.

 

All in all - sounds identical to this forum - doesn't it???

 

The link is HERE

 

In the immortal words of Rodney King - "Can't we just all get along"????

 

Or maybe even more appropriate to the world of Fountain Pens - the immortal words of Mick Jagger - "You can't always get what you want"!

ter that

Looks to me like you've made an unfair assumption about those that haven't had any problems with their pens,assuming that because they haven't had any problems,a)their pen could never have a problem,and b)that it isn't possible for others to have problems with their pens. You're assuming that they don't care;my feeling is otherwise. They do care,but they also feel that fairness should also be set aside for the pen companies in their defense. If indeed the pen companies do read these posts as has already been stated in this thread,then let's hope that they will notify us through this forum that they will try to

rectify the problems that occur. Every company that manufactures anything will on occasion make lemons--that's just a fact of life,like it or not. It really doesn't matter whether it's fountain pens or widgets.

 

BTW,the one and only `contemporary' pen I have--an Aurora Sole--is being sent to Kenro on Monday because it has two stress cracks down by the piston filler. Having read this entire thread,I will wait to see what happens and let everyone know

how the adventure turns out.

 

John

 

Sorry John - I respectfully submit you are wrong that I have made an unfair assumption about those without problems. There are many examples of this on these pages. In one case, someone actually said to Kurt "you are an awkward kind of guy - aren't you" just because he was complaining about a pen and I will quote another member directly as saying: "I love my Italian pens, and I don't like reading about how terrible they are". OMG - If that isn't sticking your head in the sand I do not know what is!!!!! That is what I meant by my post.

 

The above being said, I have a Stipula on the way now and will report on its performance out of the box when I get it. That I assume will be a productive exercise. The last Stipula I bought failed to write at all out of the box without significant modification. Why I bought another Stipula after that horrible experience is beyond me - I guess I am either a glutton for punishment or very stupid - or combination of both! :bonk:

 

 

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The above being said, I have a Stipula on the way now and will report on its performance out of the box when I get it. That I assume will be a productive exercise. The last Stipula I bought failed to write at all out of the box without significant modification. Why I bought another Stipula after that horrible experience is beyond me - I guess I am either a glutton for punishment or very stupid - or combination of both! :bonk:

 

This summarizes nicely why this thread is more than 100 posts - complaining is one thing, but the sympathy-o-meter barely registers a twinge when you run right out and buy another pen.

 

(Edited to remove unnecessary inflammatory comments - thanks Ghost)

Edited by MarcShiman
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Ahem! Watch the "you" statements, which can sound accusatory and personal.

Ghost

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Well, I guess I learn something everyday - the same kind of thread regarding quality control (almost an identical one in fact) is going on right now over in the Pelikan Forum. So, as some posts here have been saying - no single country of origin is guilty of bad quality control - apparently it happens everywhere. Shameful - utterly shameful is all I can say for companies in any country to sell expensive pens that don't write!!!!!

 

There is also the same interpersonal relationship issues going on over there - people with pen problems complaining and those who haven't had problems preferring to "play Ostrich" by sticking their heads in the sand and refusing to admit that their beloved brand of pen could ever have such a problem (based by the way purely on the fact that they never had a problem so they won't believe it is possible for others to have one)! Quite absurd in fact - don't you think?

 

Still others who have no pen problems are chastising the ones with pen problems and making them feel uncomfortable about it.

 

All in all - sounds identical to this forum - doesn't it???

 

The link is HERE

 

In the immortal words of Rodney King - "Can't we just all get along"????

 

Or maybe even more appropriate to the world of Fountain Pens - the immortal words of Mick Jagger - "You can't always get what you want"!

ter that

Looks to me like you've made an unfair assumption about those that haven't had any problems with their pens,assuming that because they haven't had any problems,a)their pen could never have a problem,and b)that it isn't possible for others to have problems with their pens. You're assuming that they don't care;my feeling is otherwise. They do care,but they also feel that fairness should also be set aside for the pen companies in their defense. If indeed the pen companies do read these posts as has already been stated in this thread,then let's hope that they will notify us through this forum that they will try to

rectify the problems that occur. Every company that manufactures anything will on occasion make lemons--that's just a fact of life,like it or not. It really doesn't matter whether it's fountain pens or widgets.

 

BTW,the one and only `contemporary' pen I have--an Aurora Sole--is being sent to Kenro on Monday because it has two stress cracks down by the piston filler. Having read this entire thread,I will wait to see what happens and let everyone know

how the adventure turns out.

 

John

 

Sorry John - I respectfully submit you are wrong that I have made an unfair assumption about those without problems. There are many examples of this on these pages. In one case, someone actually said to Kurt "you are an awkward kind of guy - aren't you" just because he was complaining about a pen and I will quote another member directly as saying: "I love my Italian pens, and I don't like reading about how terrible they are". OMG - If that isn't sticking your head in the sand I do not know what is!!!!! That is what I meant by my post.

 

The above being said, I have a Stipula on the way now and will report on its performance out of the box when I get it. That I assume will be a productive exercise. The last Stipula I bought failed to write at all out of the box without significant modification. Why I bought another Stipula after that horrible experience is beyond me - I guess I am either a glutton for punishment or very stupid - or combination of both! :bonk:

Jk--I remember the comment about someone not wanting to read about how terrible Italian pens are,and I can agree with you on that point. After all,this thread and this forum is about notifying other f/p nuts to service problem with pen companies that they support by buying their pens. For that I owe you an apology. Let's hope that the service that we are hoping for and expecting comes through.

 

Regards,

John

Irony is not lost on INFJ's--in fact,they revel in it.

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The above being said, I have a Stipula on the way now and will report on its performance out of the box when I get it. That I assume will be a productive exercise. The last Stipula I bought failed to write at all out of the box without significant modification. Why I bought another Stipula after that horrible experience is beyond me - I guess I am either a glutton for punishment or very stupid - or combination of both! :bonk:

 

This summarizes nicely why this thread is more than 100 posts - complaining is one thing, but the sympathy-o-meter barely registers a twinge when you run right out and buy another pen.

 

(Edited to remove unnecessary inflammatory comments - thanks Ghost)

 

 

Apparently there are some people who have totally missed the purpose of this entire thread. Again, I will repeat the Subject Line we are discussing: "I will think long and hard before buying another Italian pen". Now, although I didn't start this post (Kurt did) I agree with Kurt as being in the same boat of having Italian pen problems and having to think hard before buying another.

 

But that's what these postings are for - not to get angry with each other or take stabs at each others posts - but rather to discuss Italian pens. After hearing all the discussions regarding the successful pen purchases of others, as the subject says - I thought long and hard and did decide to try again and make another Italian pen purchase. In other words, the posts here did what the were supposed to do! They made me think, convinced me and most importantly provided me with the data and feedback to make a decision on another purchase of an Italian pen.

 

I agonized over the purchase - it was a choice of the Stipula or a Parker Duofold Pearl and Black Centennial or a Bexley Americana. My experience with all my Bexley's and Parkers has been flawless. My experience with Stipula was not. But - because of you - my fellow FPN Italia pen enthusiasts - I chose the Stipula.

 

But - apparently I can't win no matter what I do because someone gets aggravated either way - even when I agree to try another Italian pen purchase people don't like it - GEEEEESHHH!!!! And why do some people seem so agitated all the time anyway - these are just pens - inanimate objects - and these forums are just discussions?

 

I even tried to be extremely fair by calling to everyone's attention that the Pelikan forum was posting a similar thread. I did this to try to show and agree with some of the Italian pen posts that the German pens also have problems. But no one cared when I agreed with them - the still got angry with me for something - again - GEEEESHH!

 

At this point it is extremely obvious to me that I just can't win no matter what I do!

 

I will tell you this though - when the Stipula arrives - should it not write perfectly out of the box, FPN members will hear about it as well as the dealer, distributor and manufacturer. And I tell you truly - it will be my last Italian purchase. I will return to the wonderful world of the other brand pens I have been buying that give me no problems.

 

If on the other hand it writes flawlessly - as so many of you have claimed is more the norm than not with Italian pens - then I will also shout my praise for the pen atop the highest FPN mountain top! And, I will also start saving for another Italian Pen. It all hangs on this purchase folks! The pen will be here this week. :unsure:

 

 

 

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...

 

But - apparently I can't win no matter what I do because someone gets aggravated either way - even when I agree to try another Italian pen purchase people don't like it - GEEEEESHHH!!!! And why do some people seem so agitated all the time anyway - these are just pens - inanimate objects - and these forums are just discussions?

 

...

 

Well that's true in life. You (both personal 'you' and general 'you') can never please everyone, and no matter how cool you are there is always someone who will dislike you, find you irritating, etc etc and so forth.

 

The bottom line is. If you've had problems with Italian pens and/or customer service, then say so. It can be a good heads up to the rest of us.. and don't give a hairy rat's behind what anyone else thinks of either Italian pens or your words. How your non personal, non inflammatory words affect others is absolutely THEIR problem, not yours. If they somehow become offended by your relating of your experiences, again, it's their problem.

 

I agree that people take the pen 'loves' wayyyyy to seriously sometimes. Good luck with the new Stipula. I sure didn't like my one and only Stipula when I first tried to write with it, but now it completely rocks. Some pens are kinda like new shoes I guess.. gotta break 'em in a little before they become comfortable.

 

Dave

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But that's what these postings are for - not to get angry with each other or take stabs at each others posts - but rather to discuss Italian pens. After hearing all the discussions regarding the successful pen purchases of others, as the subject says - I thought long and hard and did decide to try again and make another Italian pen purchase. In other words, the posts here did what the were supposed to do! They made me think, convinced me and most importantly provided me with the data and feedback to make a decision on another purchase of an Italian pen.

 

I agonized over the purchase - it was a choice of the Stipula or a Parker Duofold Pearl and Black Centennial or a Bexley Americana. My experience with all my Bexley's and Parkers has been flawless. My experience with Stipula was not. But - because of you - my fellow FPN Italia pen enthusiasts - I chose the Stipula.

 

Ah! OK then! Come grab a patch of sand and play ostrich with us!

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post removed by author as this whole thread is going in a direction that isn't nice.

 

 

Kurt

Edited by Titivillus
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Wow I didn't expect the turn this thread made and all of the wonderful attacks both personal and veiled ( thanks guys).

 

I have just had some bad luck with Italian pens and now guess I must also rank up there with the antichrist in some peoples books.

 

 

Keep those posts and PMs coming- I had to look up a few words in the dictionary as I am not quite as vulgar as some it seems :thumbup: .

 

Kurt

Edited by Titivillus
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Wow I didn't expect the turn this thread made and all of the wonderful attacks both personal and veiled ( thanks guys).

 

I have just had some bad luck with Italian pens and now guess I must also rank up there with the antichrist in some peoples books.

 

 

Keep those posts and PMs coming- I had to look up a few words in the dictionary as I am not quite as vulgar as some it seems :thumbup: .

 

Kurt

 

 

I just do not understand all the emotion, anger and drama over such a simple subject..............................

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I have just had some bad luck with Italian pens and now guess I must also rank up there with the antichrist in some peoples books.

Nope, I still love ya.

 

I haven't had perfect luck with pens, but it's still a great adventure (and I've bought about 1/2 as many pens as you have).

deirdre.net

"Heck we fed a thousand dollar pen to a chicken because we could." -- FarmBoy, about Pen Posse

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Wow I didn't expect the turn this thread made and all of the wonderful attacks both personal and veiled ( thanks guys).

 

I have just had some bad luck with Italian pens and now guess I must also rank up there with the antichrist in some peoples books.

 

 

Keep those posts and PMs coming- I had to look up a few words in the dictionary as I am not quite as vulgar as some it seems :thumbup: .

 

Kurt

 

 

I just do not understand all the emotion, anger and drama over such a simple subject..............................

 

 

And i concur with the above statement. Another attack from someone on the personal level and this thread will come to an end.

A shame that adults play this way but i know imperfection does that sometimes :thumbup:

 

Now,that being said,lets end this on a kinder,gentler note,eh??

 

Jim

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Wow I didn't expect the turn this thread made and all of the wonderful attacks both personal and veiled ( thanks guys).

 

I have just had some bad luck with Italian pens and now guess I must also rank up there with the antichrist in some peoples books.

 

 

Keep those posts and PMs coming- I had to look up a few words in the dictionary as I am not quite as vulgar as some it seems :thumbup: .

 

Kurt

 

 

I just do not understand all the emotion, anger and drama over such a simple subject..............................

 

 

And i concur with the above statement. Another attack from someone on the personal level and this thread will come to an end.

A shame that adults play this way but i know imperfection does that sometimes :thumbup:

 

Now,that being said,lets end this on a kinder,gentler note,eh??

 

Jim

 

 

Amen.

Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom - George S Patton

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Holy Cow! And I thought I stepped in it when I noted that Noodler's black ink cost me $40 in repairs to a P51... I love the Omas and Tibaldi pens up until about 1999. The reason I don't care for the newer Omas or Tibaldi designs is purely subjective... I think they are hideously ugly. The older Paragons from Omas are delightful pens, as are the Tibaldi Iride and Modello 60. Having said that, they are, in my experience, subject to a great many more problems than Pelikan. I'm sure there are people with the opposite experience, and that's fine. What really bothers me is the lack of communication with customers. Chartpak definitely has everyone beat in that category.

I would not give up the sweet EF nib in my Tibaldi, nor the beautiful celluloid of my Arco, but I could not tell a potential buyer that they are even close to as reliable as the average Pelikan M800 - again, in my experience.

Your produce alone was worth the trip...

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