Rating Italic Nibs

[jonro]

If you were reviewing an italic nib, are there any objective parameters that you would rate. When we discuss nibs, terms like smoothness, tooth and flex are used, but those are subjective terms. Are there any objective descriptions or tests we can use to describe how well (or poorly) a nib writes?

[I am not a number]

It's a damn good question!

 

I value smoothness but wonder what other folk think...

[artaddict]

Smoothness as long as the nib is held correctly?

[DrPJM1]

width of horizontal and vertical lines, sharpness vs smoothness of edges, flex vs spring vs stiff. Any others?

[Tom Pike]

I like to think of edged nibbed pens (italics and/or obliques) in terms of line width ratio, i.e.: thin:thick. This is objective and quantifiable.

 

Can't think of a non-subjective way to quantify things like "sharpness" or "smoothness", but flex is probably either measurable or easily demonstrated visually.

 

Parameters such as how sharp or smooth an italic nib might be are purely a matter of preference. Some calligraphers strongly prefer very sharp edged pens - the kind of nibs that would not be comfortable for the average user nor usable at high speed. Hence, I agree with Jonro that these kinds of subjective parameters, while useful to some, are out of the scope of "rating" an italic nib. For these kinds of parameters, maybe subjective descriptions are as good as we can get. They're certainly important parameters for most users.

 

 

Cheers,

Tom

 

 

(edited to add some opinions )

Edited January 22, 2008 by Tom Pike

[HDoug]

I like to think of edged nibbed pens (italics and/or obliques) in terms of line width ratio, i.e.: thin:thick. This is objective and quantifiable.

 

I like the ratio idea. In fact, since we can assume thin = 1, we can just express it as the thick. Also, FPNer Escribiente has a pdf file of measured lines both vertical and horizontal to help. I mounted it on my iDisk and can be downloaded here. Just hit the down arrow in the right column.

 

Doug

 

[ANM]

I like to think of edged nibbed pens (italics and/or obliques) in terms of line width ratio, i.e.: thin:thick. This is objective and quantifiable.

 

Can't think of a non-subjective way to quantify things like "sharpness" or "smoothness", but flex is probably either measurable or easily demonstrated visually.

 

Parameters such as how sharp or smooth an italic nib might be are purely a matter of preference. Some calligraphers strongly prefer very sharp edged pens - the kind of nibs that would not be comfortable for the average user nor usable at high speed. Hence, I agree with Jonro that these kinds of subjective parameters, while useful to some, are out of the scope of "rating" an italic nib. For these kinds of parameters, maybe subjective descriptions are as good as we can get. They're certainly important parameters for most users.

 

 

Cheers,

Tom

 

 

(edited to add some opinions )

Tom brings up some important points: How the italic nib will be used makes a difference. I belive for those who just want a wide pen for longhand writing, an italic nib may not be the best choice. Oblique nibs are designed for that. I have done "Old English" style lettering for many years and used lots of pens in the process. For Text style letters I have used brushes, Speedball C style pens, Osmoid fountain pens, Sheaffer and 120 Pelikan calligraphy pens with Italic nibs, and Rotring Art Pens with italic nibs. My opinion is that the best results are from Speedball 'C' pens with india ink. When I had to do several dozen certificates, I prefer the 120 Pelikan with gold plated nibs. Rotring Art Pen nibs are my second choice. Old Sheaffer calligraphy pens are OK but just OK and I think Osmiroids are marginal. What I don't like about them is that they are scratchy, the ink doesn't flow as well and whenever I picked up a different one, the parts of it were not always interchangeable with the others.

Edited January 22, 2008 by ANM

[ANM]

Doug, my browser won't download your file but I don't understand your criteria since Italic nibs come in a variety of widths. European nibs are rated by width in cm. the thin line is virtually the same in all of them. Usually the wider the nib, the taller the letter. Lower case Text style letters are, on average, five times taller than the width of the nib and Upper case are seven.

 

I forgot to mention in my previous note that i also taught units of calligraphy to high school students for almost 35 years.

Edited January 22, 2008 by ANM

[jonro]

I like the ratio idea, too. That's a tangible measurement. I wonder if there is a standard for the perfect italic and other nibs? Also, is there a way to describe the transition between italics and cursive italics?

[Ged]

width of horizontal and vertical lines, sharpness vs smoothness of edges, flex vs spring vs stiff. Any others?

 

I'd back all those factors and add wetness to the mix, perhaps using a 'standard ink' like Quink Blue or Waterman Florida Blue.

 

I think the transition to cursive italic nib is if you can write cursive italic and a fair speed, say your cursive writing speed, without having the nib gouge the paper to death. I find my FP broad edged nibs can all do push strokes without digging into the paper, Mitchell and Speedball dip nibs dig in quite easily.

[JayLo]

HDoug -

Thanks for the pdf file of line thickness. A good gauge.

[EventHorizon]

I have one italic nib and I will also join the band wagon of horizontal vs vertical lines. Maybe focus also on the feel of the nib on the upstrokes. As stated, I only have one italic so my experience is limited but I do have to remind myself that it does not act the same as a "standard" nib.

[FrankB]

I am a big fan of italic nibs but I have never reviewed one. I have found that the nib requirements ofr an italic nib are different from those of a standard ball nib. For example, I like some flex with a ball nib. I feel the flex gives my handwriting some character. However, with an italic nib, and to some extent with a stub also, a more rigid nib allows the flat surface of the nib to do its job better. I like some "spring" to an italic nib, but I feel that real flex can actually impede an italic nib from being all it can be. All of this perspective would necessarily be part of an review I might do.

 

Just my two cents.

[jonro]

I am a big fan of italic nibs but I have never reviewed one. I have found that the nib requirements ofr an italic nib are different from those of a standard ball nib. For example, I like some flex with a ball nib. I feel the flex gives my handwriting some character. However, with an italic nib, and to some extent with a stub also, a more rigid nib allows the flat surface of the nib to do its job better. I like some "spring" to an italic nib, but I feel that real flex can actually impede an italic nib from being all it can be. All of this perspective would necessarily be part of an review I might do.

 

Just my two cents.

I hope you write that review. I would also like to know when an oblique nib or a stub nib is more appropriate than an italic.