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Chinese Handwriting?


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28 replies to this topic

#1 nimrod

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Posted 02 October 2007 - 05:00

I'm currently learning to speak/read/write Chinese and I actually bought my first fountain pen because this book insisted that using a fountain pen was pretty important to develop good Chinese handwriting:

Learn to Write Chinese Characters

Does anyone else on here write Chinese or am I alone in this?

BTW, this seems to be the best brush pen at the moment for Chinese calligraphy:

Sailor Profit Brush Pen

I have one on it's way to me in the mail now.

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#2 WillAdams

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Posted 02 October 2007 - 10:57

I find writing Chinese characters (Hanja they're called in Korean) easier w/ a fountain pen, esp. one which affords some line width variability --- an alternative to the brush pen which you noted is the bent nib design developed by Noboyushi Nagahara-san of Sailor pens called the Concord, (Richard Binder offers a similar design called the Condor), though a flexible nib or broader nib such as a cursive or crisp italic can be made to work as well.

http://www.stutler.c.../sailor_clinic/
http://www.penseller.../sailornibs.htm
http://www.richardsp...info/CONDOR.htm

William



#3 Taki

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Posted 02 October 2007 - 11:08

I write Japanese including Kanji with pens all the time. I actually prefer regular nibs to brush-type pens as I usually write relatively small. Sailor makes diefferent kinds of nibs to make strokes like brush, but you have to write big to get full effects with them, IMHO.

#4 graceaj

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Posted 02 October 2007 - 12:36

I guess you have to not learn Chinese from young to appreciate this sort of thing. My Chinese handwriting looks pretty much like my English one... wink.gif
Looking to exchange ink samples! Available: Noodler's Bulletproof Black, Noodler's 54th Massachusetts, Noodler's Black Swan in English Roses, Noodler's Bad Belted Kingfisher, Noodler's Operation Overlord Orange

#5 nimrod

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Posted 02 October 2007 - 22:20

QUOTE(WillAdams @ Oct 2 2007, 06:57 AM) View Post


Thanks for the info!

#6 ngfchen

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Posted 03 October 2007 - 03:36

I write Chinese characters the day I can write...
I 'm afraid a pencil is enough for you to start it.
but a fountain pen must be better,hehe biggrin.gif .

Edited by ngfchen, 03 October 2007 - 03:37.


#7 Renzhe

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Posted 03 October 2007 - 06:44

I prefer fountain pens, but not for line width variation. It's not just with Chinese. Like with other writing systems, a smooth, consistent line is desirable.

Brush pens are convenient if you want to write with a brush on the go, but if you're serious about calligraphy, use a "real" brush.
Renzhe

#8 kirianth

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Posted 06 October 2007 - 16:52

My learning of written Chinese has been pretty spotty. But when I was taking an actual class, I found it really relaxing to just spend time with my brush to make flash cards for new characters, and write it slowly 'til I got it right. That said, I've had some Chinese calligraphy training, and am a native speaker, just... woefully illiterate.

The fountain pen requirement seems a bit odd to me, but what do I know about flexy nibs?

#9 nimrod

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Posted 07 October 2007 - 05:56

The book I have recommends a firm nib on the fountain pen. It actually says you should use one with an enclosed nib but it seems to be difficult to find a cheap pen of that type in the US. The Lamy Vista I have seem to have a pretty firm nib though and seems to work pretty well.

Regarding using a pencil, yes I know you can write Chinese with anything but in addition to what this book says, my wife (who was born in China) says that her teachers required that she use a fountain pen when she was first learning to write. So I don't know if it's learning to write Chinese or just learning to write anything that a fountain pen is supposed to be best for. (I think I read somewhere that schools in europe might require fountain pens for elementary school or something.) Maybe the friction on the nib gives you a better feel for how you're moving the pen?

#10 Excoriar

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Posted 09 October 2007 - 08:59

I use a medium flex FP to write chinese characters at work. Heck.. I think any character written in FP will look nicer than a BP, but that's just me. thumbup.gif I recommend using a F or XF nib for best results.

Edited by Excoriar, 09 October 2007 - 09:04.


#11 Dr.Grace

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Posted 09 October 2007 - 21:21

I just returned from Beijing. While there, at the PanJiaYuan (a famous sort of regular "flea market") I ran across some brush pens that are a piston-fill design and with REAL rabbit- or goat-hair brushes. I tried one out with water and it worked quite well. I will post pics in a separate thread when I get a chance. If there's any interest, I can probably ask my new Chinese wife's relatives to obtain some more.

Don
These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives everything its value.--Thomas Paine, "The American Crisis", 1776

#12 Renzhe

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Posted 10 October 2007 - 02:24

Piston-fill real hair brush pen? COUNT ME IN!
Renzhe

#13 nimrod

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Posted 10 October 2007 - 04:41

QUOTE(Dr.Grace @ Oct 9 2007, 05:21 PM) View Post
I just returned from Beijing. While there, at the PanJiaYuan (a famous sort of regular "flea market") I ran across some brush pens that are a piston-fill design and with REAL rabbit- or goat-hair brushes. I tried one out with water and it worked quite well. I will post pics in a separate thread when I get a chance. If there's any interest, I can probably ask my new Chinese wife's relatives to obtain some more.


Yes, there is certainly interest here! Please post info!

#14 matthewk

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Posted 10 October 2007 - 14:46

QUOTE(Dr.Grace @ Oct 9 2007, 05:21 PM) View Post
I just returned from Beijing. While there, at the PanJiaYuan (a famous sort of regular "flea market") I ran across some brush pens that are a piston-fill design and with REAL rabbit- or goat-hair brushes. I tried one out with water and it worked quite well. I will post pics in a separate thread when I get a chance. If there's any interest, I can probably ask my new Chinese wife's relatives to obtain some more.

Don


If I'm reading things properly congratulations are in order. smile.gif

I may also be interested in the brushes.

matthew

#15 Dr.Grace

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Posted 10 October 2007 - 21:59

Yes, thanks!

I'll post pics of the brush pens when I get a chance. I have a lot to catch up on today.

Don
These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives everything its value.--Thomas Paine, "The American Crisis", 1776

#16 mischaz

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 19:19

Hi, Folks:

I know that this is a long delay for replying on this thread, but please indulge me, since I am new to this network.

My interest concerns Italic fountain pens, and since I am writing a new book, I feel like I have quite an opportunity to learn fine penpersonship/calligraphy. I have ordered a Lamy Al-Star from Swishers, with 1.1mm (now back in stock) and 1.5mm Italic nibs. I also ordered a Chinese pen from:

http://www.chinapenking.com
Your Oriental Pen Specialist

This dealer has a huge inventory posted, with many great deals on mint, used Chinese fountain pens, as well as new Hero pens, etc., etc. The dealer urged me to try a calligraphy nib called a "Flip-Up," which he contends is a very smooth writer in a new East/West calligraphy design that works well on both Far East writing and on Western Italics. This design supposedly writes from very fine to broad, quite a feat. I'm looking forward to it; it should only take a couple of weeks to get to me. Even the shipping from China is now reasonable! I want to put in Chinese granite lantern in my newly planted grove of timber bamboo, along trails to a planned Japanese teahouse and an intimate concert pavilion. I sure hope these reasonable shipping rates will be available in about 3 years, for I will want a large container of carved marble and granite for this garden, if I can afford it, for I expect China's prices to rise dramatically, due to the ongoing devaluation of our currency. I must guess that China's government is helping to subsidize shipping, to encourage direct trade with Chinese companies.

Has anyone here tried the Flip-Up nib? I am new to this, waiting for my first real calligraphy pen, and my penpersonship is atrocious. But, I'll attempt to post some examples of this nib's writing. Are there any posted guidelines or examples that would be possible for those of us who are only beginning? What would you folks like to see, what would help you to decide the value of such a nib? Would Oriental ideograms(?) still be of interest to this forum?

I hope that this thread is still alive and kicking!

My very best,

Mischa Z

#17 Renzhe

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Posted 09 February 2008 - 05:01

If you're talking about the nibs that are bent up at the tip like this...
,
...they're not very convincing, in my opinion. Here are some samples of my handwriting with one the the Jinhao X450's I review here.





I suggest, if you want to write Chinese, Kana, or Hangul, that you're better off using a brush pen. If you're really serious about East Asian calligraphy, you should use a normal brush.

By the way, Dr. Grace, any news?

Edited by Renzhe, 09 February 2008 - 20:37.

Renzhe

#18 losskywalker

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Posted 09 February 2008 - 15:32

as a Chinese I am so happy to see that so many people are fond of Chinese
whatever questions...I'm all ears...although my handwriting isn't so beautiful.I do know some knowledge about my language...and my Dad has a great penmanship~
China Agricultural University! that's where I am going~

#19 Dr.Grace

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Posted 09 February 2008 - 18:35

QUOTE(Renzhe @ Feb 8 2008, 09:01 PM) View Post
By the way, Dr. Grace, any news?


My wife's brother-in-law is still trying to find a source for them. Here's a picture of the two kinds I saw. In the middle, for size comparison, is one of the original Danitrio $27 pens.
brush_pens.jpg

Edited by Dr.Grace, 09 February 2008 - 18:37.

These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives everything its value.--Thomas Paine, "The American Crisis", 1776

#20 losskywalker

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Posted 10 February 2008 - 02:12

traditional brush pen are better and it's best to use ink of brush pen rather than those of fountainpen~
here are some examples


and check thishttp://ucesp.ws.binghamton.edu/~xli/old/interest/calig/bmzy.html

Edited by losskywalker, 10 February 2008 - 02:17.

China Agricultural University! that's where I am going~






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