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Changing Inks


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#1 pvdiamon

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 01:09

I know you have to rinse the pen to change colors. But is there any reason to do that changing brands of the same color? What about Noodlers? Would you rinse going from Aurora black to Noodlers Black? I know mixing them is not advised, but I'm not sure if the ink left in the nib is considered "mixing."

John
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#2 M4R1N4

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 01:24

I'm not the smartest person on the board, but if they were both black ink (like in your example) then I would probably not bother flushing it out.

I have had no bad experiences mixing ink brands with each other. Greg Clark wrote a great article about this that he copied in his Ink Sampler .. there is probably a copy of it floating around online somewhere but I don't know where... hope this is somewhat of a help.
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#3 Titivillus

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 01:26

I know you have to rinse the pen to change colors. But is there any reason to do that changing brands of the same color? What about Noodlers? Would you rinse going from Aurora black to Noodlers Black? I know mixing them is not advised, but I'm not sure if the ink left in the nib is considered "mixing."

John

For me when I finish a fill of ink I figure it's a good time to flush out the pen so that if there might even be anything in the internals it won't have a chance to build up but will be washed out with the water.


So far I have never had any problems with my pens over time.

Kurt H

#4 pvdiamon

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 01:32

I've seen replies that 6 months of use requires a rinse. That sounds long, but every fill sounds like a pain. But I like hearing about different experiences. thanks. Still wondering if changing to Noodlers requires a rinse (as opposed to from Noodlers?).
John in NC

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#5 pvdiamon

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 01:52

I found a great answer to my own question in the other Forum (Inky Thoughts) from July 18:

"I have been using Noodlers inks for the past year or so and I have had ZERO problems with this ink. I have about 12 bottles of different colors and I have yet had a problem with clogging. I also use Private Reserve, Waterman, Aurora, Lamy and Pelikan and I have not run into a problem either. I think noodlers is pretty close in saturation to a lot of Private Reserve inks. Nathan Tardiff has done a wonderful job in creating inks that perform well and pleasing to the eye!!


I think the way i care for my pens has a lot to do with it. After I am out of ink, Ill either fill the pen up with the same color ink for a total of 3 fills before I completely flush the pen out. If I am changing colors or brands, then I will completely flush out the pen before filling it. If I am going to let the pen sit, then I will completely flush the pen out. This is simple and universal ways of ensuring the pens remain clog free."

I like this method--rinse if switching colors or brands, rinse every 3 fills or so.
John in NC

The passion not to be fooled and not to fool anybody else..two searching questions of positivism: what do you mean? How do you know? (Bertrand Russell, Dominant Passion of The True Scientist)

#6 Guest_Denis Richard_*

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 02:07

I think the standard safe answer is indeed a flush when changing colour or every few months.

Personally, I flush and empty any pen that is not used regularly, but my daily writer is never flushed. Not between colour, not between anything. If I really am in a goo dmood and slightly bored, I'll flush one once a year :D The pen that has suffered that treatment the longuest is my Duofold (12 years of uninterrupted daily use), and it writes better than when I bought it.

My take on it is that, unless you find inks that do not react well together (never happened to me, but I vaguely remember hearing about two inks that make funny stuff when mixed), flushing a daily users is not really a must.

Denis.

#7 tntaylor

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 02:38

I think the standard safe answer is indeed a flush when changing colour or every few months.

Personally, I flush and empty any pen that is not used regularly, but my daily writer is never flushed. Not between colour, not between anything. If I really am in a goo dmood and slightly bored, I'll flush one once a year :D The pen that has suffered that treatment the longuest is my Duofold (12 years of uninterrupted daily use), and it writes better than when I bought it.

My take on it is that, unless you find inks that do not react well together (never happened to me, but I vaguely remember hearing about two inks that make funny stuff when mixed), flushing a daily users is not really a must.

Denis.

Phew! I'm glad someone else said it first! Yeah, color me lazy, but when my Phileas runs out of ink, although I do clean the empty cartridge, I've dropped the notion of flushing/drying. Takes too long (like, overnight) and my patience simply does not stretch past about five minutes. So, I just fill the cartridge with the color du moment and commence to writing. Sure, the color may start off a little funky, but I just think of it as being a unique hybrid and keep on scribbling. Sometimes, the transition between colors is quite attractive. Ok, maybe attractive isn't the word. But definitely interesting.

I've decided to buy a few dip pens, so that I'll be able to continue writing when a fountain pen runs dry or when I want to use a new color for a specific purpose.

t!
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#8 wimg

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 11:06

Hi John,

Essentially, there are several reasons to rinse a pen, and most are mentioned here already:

1. Make sure the colour of the ink is not diluted or mixed.
2. Prevent any possible chemical reactions between inks that cause damage to the innards of the pen.
3. Make sure the pen keeps on working properly, without any deposits from an ink to clog it up or damage it in any other way.
4. To prevent staining a pen, especially celluloid pens or ink windows, by agressively staining inks (mostly red and violet inks).
5. To prevent clogging up or other damage to a pen, due to dried out ink, prior to putting it away for a while.

Filling with another ink without rinsing, I only do when I don´t mind the funky colour changes and when I am sure there is not going to be a funny reaction between both inks or remnants thereof. Essentially, that covers 1 and 2.

So far I have encountered problems of type 3 and 4 myself. Specifically, Parker Penman Ebony causing feed and nib problems in my Duofold Centennial (so no problemless use like in Denis´ case :D), which were only solved about 6 years later (!). This was caused by a combination of teh particles in virtually all black fountain pen inks (microparticles of soot) in combination with other chemical in the mix. And I encountered staining by red inks or inks containing red dyes. Two of my celluloid pens suffered minor stains (on the outside!), when put away for three weeks without regular cleaning or writing.

No. 5 I´ve encountered regularly in vintage pens, where either the rubber of piston fillers was deteriorated due to lack of maintenance and dried out ink, and, obviously rubber sacced pens. Rubber sacs go hard when ink is left to dry in them, or go soft first, and hard afterwards, creating a goo that is very difficult to remove.

Oh, and yes, rinsing out pens properly is hard work, and often needs to be repeated over several days, especially with the more highly concentrated inks. I do a lot of this, because of... ink reviews. It is the least satisfying job in ink reviews, although it presents additional information on the ink: "rinsability" :lol:.

Anyway, HTH,
warm regards, Wim

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#9 Johnny Appleseed

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 16:20

Noodlers ink has a neutral PH and is completely water-based. It seems to do well with mixing with several other brands, including PR, Waterman, Levenger, etc. If two inks can mix without causing sludge then you should have no problem with transitioning from one to the other without rinsing.

Some inks are very incompatible and react chemically when mixed. I would not switch back and forth with, say, Omas, or one of the other acidic inks without testing the mix very carefully. Private Reserve used to have some colors that would make sludge when mixed with other PR ink.

Flushing is a good idea for the above mentioned reasons. However, I too have enjoyed watching your ink color change as you write, slowly shifting from green to brown to violet in the middle of a letter.

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#10 Dillo

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 16:59

Hi,
I flush every time. I am a bit used to it because I use Staedtler Marsmatic 70X-XX Technical pens. I want to enjoy the color in my pen from the first word of it, so I flush and dry my pens by letting them sit for a few hours, overnight, or, if I need to write something immediately, I strap the parts of the pen securely on the ceiling fan. (A six-bladed fan which I can balance properly).

Dillon

Stolen: Aurora Optima Demonstrator Red ends Medium nib. Serial number 1216 and Aurora 98 Cartridge/Converter Black bark finish (Archivi Storici) with gold cap. Reward if found. Please contact me if you have seen these pens.

Please send vial orders and other messages to fpninkvials funny-round-mark-thing gmail strange-mark-thing com. My shop is open once again if you need help with your pen.

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#11 KCat

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 17:48

I know mixing them is not advised, but I'm not sure if the ink left in the nib is considered "mixing."

John

IMO, nah... no reason to worry about most inks.


there are some that are noted for mixing causing problems - and they're all discontinued inks though still available from some sellers - The ones that come to mind are Private Reserve inks: Tangerine Dream, Hot Bubble Gum, and Candy Apple Red.

I did have problems with NOS Sheaffer Red mixing with other brands. created an orange precip that clung to the walls of the reservoir.

but for the most part brand to brand - not an issue IMO. I've mixed all sorts of inks in much larger amounts than anything that would be in the feed of a pen.

If you are concerned about any particular combination, put a few drops of each in an airtight container and let it sit for a few days. if there's no globs or precipitate, than I would say you're safe. I am a "mixer" and for a long time most of my favorite inks were actually mixes I made here at home with everything from Waterman, Pelikan, PR, J. Herbin....

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#12 tntaylor

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 18:02

If you are concerned about any particular combination, put a few drops of each in an airtight container and let it sit for a few days. if there's no globs or precipitate, than I would say you're safe.

Lol! Of course, if a body has got the patience to wait two or three days for an ink reaction, then he probably wouldn't mind idling one day for a flushed pen to dry... :lol:

t!
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#13 KCat

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 18:34

Lol! Of course, if a body has got the patience to wait two or three days for an ink reaction, then he probably wouldn't mind idling one day for a flushed pen to dry... :lol:

t!

true... but if you intentionally want to mix inks for later use... i always recommend this test even though i rarely have used it myself. :)

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#14 Goodwhiskers

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Posted 10 January 2006 - 19:46

. . . I flush and dry my pens by letting them sit for a few hours, overnight, or, if I need to write something immediately, I strap the parts of the pen securely on the ceiling fan. (A six-bladed fan which I can balance properly).

Hey Dillon,
ROFL! With messages like that one, who needs to do abdominal muscle crunches?
I hope the wallpaper is plastic-coated ;)

#15 Dillo

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Posted 11 January 2006 - 04:30

Hi,

Yes, I forgot to add that. :lol:

Dillon

Stolen: Aurora Optima Demonstrator Red ends Medium nib. Serial number 1216 and Aurora 98 Cartridge/Converter Black bark finish (Archivi Storici) with gold cap. Reward if found. Please contact me if you have seen these pens.

Please send vial orders and other messages to fpninkvials funny-round-mark-thing gmail strange-mark-thing com. My shop is open once again if you need help with your pen.

Dillon


#16 Betty

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Posted 11 January 2006 - 21:50

. . . I flush and dry my pens by letting them sit for a few hours, overnight, or, if I need to write something immediately, I strap the parts of the pen securely on the ceiling fan. (A six-bladed fan which I can balance properly).

Hey Dillon,
ROFL! With messages like that one, who needs to do abdominal muscle crunches?
I hope the wallpaper is plastic-coated ;)

lol! hey, at least it works :)
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