Jump to content

Can I Salvage A Bad Bottle Of Noodler's Ink?


arcfide

Recommended Posts

A long time ago I purchased a nice big bottle of Noodler's Black to have in my collection, but I was instantly disappointed with the color significantly more than I thought possible, because it was writing extremely desaturated with excessive shading; it basically wrote like a warm grey/brown ink than a Black ink. I was really shocked by this, but saw that a few people have had similar results. I did try to shake the bottle, and didn't see any improvements. My conclusion was, and after testing some more today with a variety of different pens on a variety of papers, still is that I must have received a bad color batch or something went wrong with this bottle, because it's not doing what I would expect Noodler's Black to do.

 

The question I have though, is that I hate the idea of just dumping the ink. Is there any way to figure out what's wrong and "fix it?"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 49
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • arcfide

    22

  • cellmatrix

    5

  • A Smug Dill

    4

  • Arkanabar

    2

Top Posters In This Topic

Posted Images

When I find a willing recipient for a fountain pen IRL, I also offer them a bottle of ink from my discard list.

 

That's a good idea, but I am not sure I would feel good about giving someone a bottle of ink that clearly doesn't seem to be a good example or representation of that ink.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

That's a good idea, but I am not sure I would feel good about giving someone a bottle of ink that clearly doesn't seem to be a good example or representation of that ink.

 

It is a good representation of the brand, though...

Vintage. Cursive italic. Iron gall.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You could use it to experiment with ink mixing. For example, if you add a few drops of Noodlers black to a blue ink you will get a blue-black in which the black component will be waterproof.

As with all ink mixing experiments you should start out with small quantities and add the black ink one or two drops at a time. After you get the color you like set aside the mix for a few days to make sure it is stable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

It is a good representation of the brand, though...

 

You really think Noodler's Black in is consistently more like a brown grey ink than a Black ink?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You could use it to experiment with ink mixing. For example, if you add a few drops of Noodlers black to a blue ink you will get a blue-black in which the black component will be waterproof.

 

As with all ink mixing experiments you should start out with small quantities and add the black ink one or two drops at a time. After you get the color you like set aside the mix for a few days to make sure it is stable.

 

Thanks for the idea! Mostly I've been using it up trying different levels of surfactants and water trying to figure out why the ink is writing the way that it is.

 

Maybe some others can tell me if I'm crazy or not, but I noticed that this ink won't stay on a dib nib (Zebra G). It doesn't adhere to the surface, and won't flow through the dip pen. I suspect that this is also highly related to its writing characteristics. I have noticed that if I get enough water and/or surfactant to allow the ink to adhere to the dip nib, then writing with the dip nib gives a very dark, saturated line of whatever width I want within the capabilities of the nib. It's like a totally different ink.

 

When it flows through my various fountain pens, however, I believe the reason that it is laying down such a desaturated line is that it's not writing very wet, despite a lubricated feeling. The surface tension of the ink seems off. Thus, the ink seems to "chase" the nib, without leaving enough of the ink behind to become that dark, saturated black that I see with the dip nib. I also notice this in the bottle, where the surface tension is a lot different than my other inks, and it seems to be much closer to oil than to water. This is not how my other bottles of Noodler's ink behave, nor how any of the other bottles of ink that I have behave either. This ink doesn't cling to the glass surface in nearly the way that the rest do, and it generates zero bubbles, which is not true for any of the other inks I have, when shaken vigorously.

 

This seems to suggest to me that there is something off in either the surfactants or the water content or both. Ideas?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That's a good idea, but I am not sure I would feel good about giving someone a bottle of ink that clearly doesn't seem to be a good example or representation of that ink.

 

Nevertheless, it's ink that writes, and in @Arkanabar's scenario, makes the main course of a giveaway — the fountain pen — a functional and ready writing instrument. (Just to be clear, I don't mean to tell you you ought to feel better or feel differently about the act of giving; how you feel is entirely your prerogative.)

 

There's a reason why an ink would be on someone's "discard list". I was obviously intrigued enough, many years ago when I first dived into the hobby, by Noodler's supposedly good reputation in the community (but now I know I'd mistaken a biased few hobbyists' and fans' opinions for actual regard in the industry), and bought a fair few ink colours — some in multiple bottles — on their purported ink qualities. Seven bottles ended up in the Aussie FPN pass-around box to be given away to whoever fancies one ink or another. I couldn't stand the feathering of Prime of the Commons and the Polar inks, or Baystate Concord Grape's propensity to stain everything it touches, but apparently there are others who don't mind. Furthermore, I'm not exactly trying to introduce new/fellow users to Noodler's Ink and broaden Nathan's customer base per se, so I'm not at all concerned whether the selected inks are fairly representative of the brand.

 

It is a good representation of the brand, though...

 

Do I think Noodler's inks are apt to be inconsistent between production batches, have characteristics delightful to some and disappointing or even dreadful to other ink users, are not always "safe" to use in pens or ink reservoirs one would rather not stain, and can be prone to feathering, spreading and bleeding through all sorts of paper where certain colours' express selling point is being bulletproof (but with no mention of being otherwise well-behaved)? Yes, I do. So I don't think it'd be fair representation to only give someone Noodler's Ink examples that are well-behaved, either.

 

I'm not giving my friends any Noodler's Ink to use with the new-in-box Pelikan and Aurora pens I give them as presents to introduce them to the joy of fountain pens, that's for sure.

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A long time ago I purchased a nice big bottle of Noodler's Black to have in my collection, but I was instantly disappointed with the color significantly more than I thought possible, because it was writing extremely desaturated with excessive shading; it basically wrote like a warm grey/brown ink than a Black ink. I was really shocked by this, but saw that a few people have had similar results. I did try to shake the bottle, and didn't see any improvements. My conclusion was, and after testing some more today with a variety of different pens on a variety of papers, still is that I must have received a bad color batch or something went wrong with this bottle, because it's not doing what I would expect Noodler's Black to do.

 

The question I have though, is that I hate the idea of just dumping the ink. Is there any way to figure out what's wrong and "fix it?"

 

I recommend put the bottle of noodler black ink in a drawer and revisit it in a year or two. Early in my fountain pen journey I hated shading and exclusively went for super saturated inks that looked most like the ballpoint and gel inks that I was used to. Gradually I came to appreciate inks that had shading. At first they looked washed out and watery but after a while I learned to get a handle on the shading and incorporating it into my writing style. Now I find I hate saturated inks and love inks that shade. Ive come to appreciate that these types of inks add a third dimension to the appearance of your writing and they shout out to everyone that this was written with a fountain pen not a ball point or gel pen. Maybe with time you might realize this too!
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nevertheless, it's ink that writes, and in @Arkanabar's scenario, makes the main course of a giveaway — the fountain pen — a functional and ready writing instrument. (Just to be clear, I don't mean to tell you you ought to feel better or feel differently about the act of giving; how you feel is entirely your prerogative.)

 

There's a reason why an ink would be on someone's "discard list". I was obviously intrigued enough, many years ago when I first dived into the hobby, by Noodler's supposedly good reputation in the community (but now I know I'd mistaken a biased few hobbyists' and fans' opinions for actual regard in the industry), and bought a fair few ink colours — some in multiple bottles — on their purported ink qualities. Seven bottles ended up in the Aussie FPN pass-around box to be given away to whoever fancies one ink or another. I couldn't stand the feathering of Prime of the Commons and the Polar inks, or Baystate Concord Grape's propensity to stain everything it touches, but apparently there are others who don't mind. Furthermore, I'm not exactly trying to introduce new/fellow users to Noodler's Ink and broaden Nathan's customer base per se, so I'm not at all concerned whether the selected inks are fairly representative of the brand.

 

 

 

Do I think Noodler's inks are apt to be inconsistent between production batches, have characteristics delightful to some and disappointing or even dreadful to other ink users, are not always "safe" to use in pens or ink reservoirs one would rather not stain, and can be prone to feathering, spreading and bleeding through all sorts of paper where certain colours' express selling point is being bulletproof (but with no mention of being otherwise well-behaved)? Yes, I do. So I don't think it'd be fair representation to only give someone Noodler's Ink examples that are well-behaved, either.

 

I'm not giving my friends any Noodler's Ink to use with the new-in-box Pelikan and Aurora pens I give them as presents to introduce them to the joy of fountain pens, that's for sure.

Agree with you dil, I’m not into the noodlers inks either for all the reasons you mention

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I recommend put the bottle of noodler black ink in a drawer and revisit it in a year or two. Early in my fountain pen journey I hated shading and exclusively went for super saturated inks that looked most like the ballpoint and gel inks that I was used to. Gradually I came to appreciate inks that had shading. At first they looked washed out and watery but after a while I learned to get a handle on the shading and incorporating it into my writing style. Now I find I hate saturated inks and love inks that shade. Ive come to appreciate that these types of inks add a third dimension to the appearance of your writing and they shout out to everyone that this was written with a fountain pen not a ball point or gel pen. Maybe with time you might realize this too!

 

I've already appreciated shading inks. My daily ink right now is Platinum Blue Black, which is very shade heavy with my Music nib. It's also been probably a year or longer since I visited this bottle of ink already. In that time I've gone through MB Permanent Black, Platinum Blue Black, Kon Peki, Tsuki-yo, Take-sumi, as well as Platinum Carbon black. I appreciate a good shading ink as much as the next fellow (maybe a little less, if I'm honest).

 

But it's not the shading that gets me, but that the ink doesn't appear to be accurately behaving like I see Noodler's black typically behaving. Additionally, if I want a good shading ink, it's definitely going to have to lean towards the cooler side of the color spectrum. A heavily saturated warm black is okay for me, but a warm, brown shading ink? Well, I fell out of love for that a while back after I was done with my MB Sepia, probably a decade or more ago. I'd be fine if I felt that the ink was behaving like it should, but the ink just feels like it's objectively not what it is supposed to be, rather than just having properties that I don't particularly care for.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

... but the ink just feels like it's objectively not what it is supposed to be, rather than just having properties that I don't particularly care for.

 

So how do you expect to "salvage" that ink by modifying it and making it even less of what you were expected Noodler's to supply you with in the first place, when you didn't buy the ink as a "raw" ingredient for whatever tinkering you had in mind?

Edited by A Smug Dill

I endeavour to be frank and truthful in what I write, show or otherwise present, when I relate my first-hand experiences that are not independently verifiable; and link to third-party content where I can, when I make a claim or refute a statement of fact in a thread. If there is something you can verify for yourself, I entreat you to do so, and judge for yourself what is right, correct, and valid. I may be wrong, and my position or say-so is no more authoritative and carries no more weight than anyone else's here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

So how do you expect to "salvage" that ink by modifying it and making it even less of what you were expected Noodler's to supply you with in the first place, when you didn't buy the ink as a "raw" ingredient for whatever tinkering you had in mind?

 

The goal was to figure out what is "wrong" with the ink and somehow restore or change it in order to have it behave more in line with what it seems it ought to do.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Have a look at the Pilot Blue Black 200% thread.

 

Maybe the ink is too diluted and if you concentrate it, it may improve.

If you are to be ephemeral, leave a good scent.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've already appreciated shading inks. My daily ink right now is Platinum Blue Black, which is very shade heavy with my Music nib. It's also been probably a year or longer since I visited this bottle of ink already. In that time I've gone through MB Permanent Black, Platinum Blue Black, Kon Peki, Tsuki-yo, Take-sumi, as well as Platinum Carbon black. I appreciate a good shading ink as much as the next fellow (maybe a little less, if I'm honest).

 

But it's not the shading that gets me, but that the ink doesn't appear to be accurately behaving like I see Noodler's black typically behaving. Additionally, if I want a good shading ink, it's definitely going to have to lean towards the cooler side of the color spectrum. A heavily saturated warm black is okay for me, but a warm, brown shading ink? Well, I fell out of love for that a while back after I was done with my MB Sepia, probably a decade or more ago. I'd be fine if I felt that the ink was behaving like it should, but the ink just feels like it's objectively not what it is supposed to be, rather than just having properties that I don't particularly care for.

Thanks for clarifying and sorry to get way off tangent, I apologize. Finding warm brown colored stuff in a bottle of black ink sounds gross to me and I would throw it out - who knows what's in there? This just reinforces my poor opinion of Noodlers inks. Currently I'm using montblanc midnight blue as a daily almost black slightly blue somewhat water resistant ink. If you ever have a chance - check it out its a great ink - or if you pm me Ill send you a sample. Cheers! :thumbup:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for clarifying and sorry to get way off tangent, I apologize. Finding warm brown colored stuff in a bottle of black ink sounds gross to me and I would throw it out - who knows what's in there? This just reinforces my poor opinion of Noodlers inks. Currently I'm using montblanc midnight blue as a daily almost black slightly blue somewhat water resistant ink. If you ever have a chance - check it out its a great ink - or if you pm me Ill send you a sample. Cheers! :thumbup:

Thanks for the offer. I actually have a mostly empty bottle of MB Permanent Black that is extremely good, hence why it is nearly empty. I've also used up about half of my Carbon Black bottle, which is another terrific black. I'd just like to be able to add Noodler's Black to that stable because of its unique characteristics. I've got another bottle on order to do a more object in person comparison, which should give me more information.

 

At the moment I'm heavily enamored of Platinum Blue Black because of its character, behavior, and water resistance, and it's unlikely that it will be completely displaced by some other inks any time soon, but I still like to have some other ones laying around.

 

I have someone who likes gray inks, and when dried, the brownish nature of this bottle of Noodler's black becomes less obvious and it moves a little more towards a neutral dark grey, which might just be enough for someone who likes a gray ink but doesn't have a permanent option yet. So I can probably still find a use for the ink even if I fail to fix the ink.

 

Don't worry about the tangent. ;-) I do think shading inks can be under appreciated by some people, but on the other hand, there are some people who are so in love with various colors and shades and "properties" that they forget there was a reason that a crisp, clean black or blue ink was admired for so long. The clean lines and full character of a crisp black or blue ink are a joy unto themselves, particularly if paired with an excellent hand for calligraphy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Have a look at the Pilot Blue Black 200% thread.

 

Maybe the ink is too diluted and if you concentrate it, it may improve.

Thanks for the lead. I'll look into it!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pour the (bleep) out. You obviously don't need it or want it or even value it enough to give away. This is a no-brainer to me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

At the moment I'm heavily enamored of Platinum Blue Black because of its character, behavior, and water resistance, and it's unlikely that it will be completely displaced by some other inks any time soon, but I still like to have some other ones laying around.

I've used a lot of platinum blue black over the years. Even though some here try to dismiss it as 'not bulletproof!' whatever that means, its always been permanent enough for my needs and its a nice ink.

I do think shading inks can be under appreciated by some people, but on the other hand, there are some people who are so in love with various colors and shades and "properties"

Totally agree properties alone do not make an ink. I'm definitely a 'less is more' type of person when it comes to shading but it is true that inks that do not shade at all, are boring and do not interest me anymore.

there was a reason that a crisp, clean black or blue ink was admired for so long. The clean lines and full character of a crisp black or blue ink are a joy unto themselves, particularly if paired with an excellent hand for calligraphy.

IMG_0275.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

I've used a lot of platinum blue black over the years. Even though some here try to dismiss it as 'not bulletproof!' whatever that means, its always been permanent enough for my needs and its a nice ink.

Totally agree properties alone do not make an ink. I'm definitely a 'less is more' type of person when it comes to shading but it is true that inks that do not shade at all, are boring and do not interest me anymore.

 

[iron Galls are some of the oldest and best shading inks.]

 

Platinum Blue Black definitely isn't bulletproof, but I agree that it's permanent enough for most purposes. The big attraction, for me, in terms of trying to make Noodler's inks work is that they are one of the few truly permanent, Ph-neutral archival inks. Iron Gall is great, and I have actually had a tendency to prefer Iron Gall inks throughout my pen hobby (MB's Iron Gall, Encre Authentique for dip pens, and so forth), but the idea of having an equally permanent or better ink that achieves this without the acidity is a pretty neat trick, especially given how relatively easy to maintain Noodler's is compared to something like Carbon Black.

 

But one thing Noodler's just doesn't capture for me, is the unique color shifting oxidation of Iron Gall. I've come to appreciate that aspect of the ink a little more lately with Platinum's Blue Black. Being able to write with a vibrant color, and then later on read a more muted, darker color, is really nice on my psyche and eyes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Most Contributions

    1. amberleadavis
      amberleadavis
      43844
    2. PAKMAN
      PAKMAN
      33501
    3. Ghost Plane
      Ghost Plane
      28220
    4. inkstainedruth
      inkstainedruth
      26627
    5. jar
      jar
      26101
  • Upcoming Events

  • Blog Comments

    • Shanghai Knife Dude
      I have the Sailor Naginata and some fancy blade nibs coming after 2022 by a number of new workshop from China.  With all my respect, IMHO, they are all (bleep) in doing chinese characters.  Go use a bush, or at least a bush pen. 
    • A Smug Dill
      It is the reason why I'm so keen on the idea of a personal library — of pens, nibs, inks, paper products, etc. — and spent so much money, as well as time and effort, to “build” it for myself (because I can't simply remember everything, especially as I'm getting older fast) and my wife, so that we can “know”; and, instead of just disposing of what displeased us, or even just not good enough to be “given the time of day” against competition from >500 other pens and >500 other inks for our at
    • adamselene
      Agreed.  And I think it’s good to be aware of this early on and think about at the point of buying rather than rationalizing a purchase..
    • A Smug Dill
      Alas, one cannot know “good” without some idea of “bad” against which to contrast; and, as one of my former bosses (back when I was in my twenties) used to say, “on the scale of good to bad…”, it's a spectrum, not a dichotomy. Whereas subjectively acceptable (or tolerable) and unacceptable may well be a dichotomy to someone, and finding whether the threshold or cusp between them lies takes experiencing many degrees of less-than-ideal, especially if the decision is somehow influenced by factors o
    • adamselene
      I got my first real fountain pen on my 60th birthday and many hundreds of pens later I’ve often thought of what I should’ve known in the beginning. I have many pens, the majority of which have some objectionable feature. If they are too delicate, or can’t be posted, or they are too precious to face losing , still they are users, but only in very limited environments..  I have a big disliking for pens that have the cap jump into the air and fly off. I object to Pens that dry out, or leave blobs o
  • Chatbox

    You don't have permission to chat.
    Load More
  • Files






×
×
  • Create New...