I Don't Understand This Practice By "professional" Vintage Pen Sellers

[Ron Z]

 

 

he'll be doing a lot of it by feel, while he's having conversations with random people at the same time...

 

There's a lot more going on in that little brain than you think! Partly by nature, partly by training, I'm used to doing more than one thing at a time. I worked in radio, on air back in the days when the "DJ" (I hate that word) was also the engineer/board operator, and the person who answered the phone. I was the "evening host," and we weren't automated in the least. Everything that went over the air was cued by the board op, and started only with the push of a button, and sometimes loading the program material had to be done while your lips were moving. Multitasking was a necessary skill.

[JonSzanto]

 

I don't know, I haven't bought that many pens from such sellers, and I didn't keep track. I think one is too many*, especially when it's clear from the way the ink came out that I wasn't dealing with a little left-over ink from test-writing, but with old dried out ink in the feed. (To be fair, these days anything coming from overseas takes so long, a little residual ink might have dried out completely in the time it took to get here.)

 

*But there have been more than one.

 

That is sort of what I thought. It might seem worth a rant for an event that happened only one, two, possibly three times, but putting it the way you did certainly gave the impression that "professionals" do this with some regularity. That isn't something I've encountered and I don't think it is common at all. From professional pen restorers.

[Paul-in-SF]

 

That is sort of what I thought. It might seem worth a rant for an event that happened only one, two, possibly three times, but putting it the way you did certainly gave the impression that "professionals" do this with some regularity. That isn't something I've encountered and I don't think it is common at all. From professional pen restorers.

 

Not from restorers, certainly.

 

Again, I apologize for the broad brush, and not making it clear that I was referring to some such sellers, not all.

[Ron Z]

Apologies accepted. I would agree - it would be frustrating.

[JonSzanto]

Not from restorers, certainly.

 

Again, I apologize for the broad brush, and not making it clear that I was referring to some such sellers, not all.

 

No worries. I've certainly had my share of pens with old ink in them, but virtually all were just used pens that hadn't been in action for decades. In that particular situation, it's often kinda interesting to see if it will fill with water, reconstitute the ink, and write a little bit before doing a clean and restore.

[Seney724]

 

Not from restorers, certainly.

 

Again, I apologize for the broad brush, and not making it clear that I was referring to some such sellers, not all.

I'm sorry but I do not agree with your apology. Your comments were well justified. You never said or even remotely implied that all sellers did so...... If any sellers took umbrage for some reason that is their issue, not yours.

 

The same has happened to me on more than infrequent occasion and, for sure, my experience validates your rant. And, yes, I am talking about professionals. People who should know better and all too often after sales at price points that deserved better.

 

The reasons, I think, are a simple combination of: 1) The Internet transaction is faceless and impersonal 2) They are in a rush. My proof is anecdotal, at best, but is based upon the fact that it rarely occurs with a seller with whom I have a personal, ongoing relationship or when the transaction was face-to-face at a Show or a "bricks & mortar" establishment.

 

Old pens that haven't been used for decades..... and are sold "as is"....... are a completely different story. I expect it and quite frankly I enjoy the challenge it adds to the restoration.

Edited August 1, 2020 by Seney724

[JonSzanto]

You never said or even remotely implied that all sellers did so.....

 

In fact, no one has said or implied that. And no one has given any percentage of total personal purchases that were so remarkably blighted with ink remains. Again, I doubt anyone would suggest that it never happens, but that it is not a common occurrence when dealing with a reputable seller. Which is what I consider part of being professional.

 

Since you seem to have been burned repeatedly, what is your personal definition of a "professional seller", and how to you choose to purchase from a given source?

[Paul-in-SF]

 

... no one has given any percentage of total personal purchases that were so remarkably blighted with ink remains. ...

 

(Ellipses intended to indicate additional content not relevant to my reply)

 

Sir: by insisting in chapter and verse of percentages, and using language like "remarkably blighted," you seem to me to be elevating this discussion into a dispute, almost a personal one. Speaking only for myself, of course, I wish all parties could step back and take a breath and refrain from being contentious. Of course I have no power to enforce this wish. The thread will go where it goes, but it will go there without my further participation.

Edited August 1, 2020 by Paul-in-SF

[Seney724]

 

(Ellipses intended to indicate additional content not relevant to my reply)

 

Sir: by insisting in chapter and verse of percentages, and using language like "remarkably blighted," you seem to me to be elevating this discussion into a dispute, almost a personal one. Speaking only for myself, of course, I wish all parties could step back and take a breath and refrain from being contentious. Of course I have no power to enforce this wish. The thread will go where it goes, but it will go there without my further participation.

+1

[JonSzanto]

Sir: by insisting in chapter and verse of percentages, and using language like "remarkably blighted," you seem to me to be elevating this discussion into a dispute, almost a personal one. Speaking only for myself, of course, I wish all parties could step back and take a breath and refrain from being contentious. Of course I have no power to enforce this wish. The thread will go where it goes, but it will go there without my further participation.

 

Indeed. My bad, and breath-taking has commenced. There is more than enough rancor in the world, and I shouldn't add even a jot more.

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

+1 each.

Edited August 1, 2020 by IThinkIHaveAProblem

[Estycollector]

+1

+2

 

The op owes no one either an apology or explaination beyond what was given.

 

I sent a '42 Parker 51 out to be restored and didn't consider rinsing it out, never thought about it. The restorer didn't complain or threaten to charge me an extra $25 for my forgetfullness. However, I will take this into consideration when choosing someone in the future.

[Ron Z]

+2

 

The op owes no one either an apology or explaination beyond what was given.

 

I sent a '42 Parker 51 out to be restored and didn't consider rinsing it out, never thought about it. The restorer didn't complain or threaten to charge me an extra $25 for my forgetfullness. However, I will take this into consideration when choosing someone in the future.

I've never charged anyone extra for cleaning out a pen sent with ink in it, though sometimes I'd really like to. How would you feel if it happened to you? Imagine opening a pen full of a Noodlers red ink and having it go all over the table, your hands, papers.... It's happened, and sometimes the stains don't come out of clothing even with Amodex.

 

The standard email reply with instructions on where to send a pen and all that says, "Please make sure that any pen sent to us is empty!" Sometimes it isn't possible because the filler is broken, but otherwise it's just common courtesy.

[FarmBoy]

Though it seems irrelevant at the moment...

 

A trend I have observed at shows is buyers asking can I ink this to test the nib.

 

After three days and a few hundred pens I can see where a seller might forget to clean a pen. Some sellers politely say no to dipping or filling requests and Ive seen complaints about it when it happens. I personally had caps cracked when posted, twist caps pulled off and broken, mechanisms damaged, nibs sprung or bent and once a nib smashed into a sink while cleaning out the ink.

 

With a few exceptions, I generally let people test drive pens at shows restored or not. Im certain Ive missed cleaning or rerestoring a pen or two that Ive later sold.

 

When I buy pens I always take into account that Ill likely need to restore it and factor that into the price. Same with selling, I factor in if a pen has been restored.

Edited August 1, 2020 by FarmBoy

[Seney724]

+1

This all makes good sense; I do the same when I make a purchase.

[corniche]

I've never charged anyone extra for cleaning out a pen sent with ink in it, though sometimes I'd really like to. How would you feel if it happened to you? Imagine opening a pen full of a Noodlers red ink and having it go all over the table, your hands, papers.... It's happened, and sometimes the stains don't come out of clothing even with Amodex.

 

The standard email reply with instructions on where to send a pen and all that says, "Please make sure that any pen sent to us is empty!" Sometimes it isn't possible because the filler is broken, but otherwise it's just common courtesy.

Hi Ron,

 

The "common courtesy" argument is a valid one; but OTOH, I would consider this an occupational hazard to be expected and prepared for.

 

Always assume the pen is loaded.

 

 

- Sean

[Fermata]

I would appreciate a note from the seller or repairer or the person wanting work done telling me if the pen is loaded with ink and perhaps the reason why?

 

Also for the pen to be within a sealed bag inside the packaging.

 

Especially a problem when you don't expect it. Went to one of the last pen shows and there was a well known pen repairer with a sales table. He had a 1950s Pelikan, I picked it up, opened the cap and it was full of ink which went over my hands and jacket, over the rest of his pens, the table cloth. What a mess.

 

He went into a rage, but then he is known for that.

[eachan]

All the pens I buy are in need of restoration so this issue does not arise. However, from time to time I see a seller in eBay advertising that his restored pens "will be sent filled with ink, ready for you to write..."

 

I can only imagine the mess that the poor buyer has to deal with when he or she opens the package. I expect that those sellers who think the ink-filled pen in the post is a good idea, rapidly learn better from their feedback!

[IThinkIHaveAProblem]

I would appreciate a note from the seller or repairer or the person wanting work done telling me if the pen is loaded with ink and perhaps the reason why?

 

Also for the pen to be within a sealed bag inside the packaging.

 

Especially a problem when you don't expect it. Went to one of the last pen shows and there was a well known pen repairer with a sales table. He had a 1950s Pelikan, I picked it up, opened the cap and it was full of ink which went over my hands and jacket, over the rest of his pens, the table cloth. What a mess.

 

He went into a rage, but then he is known for that.

sounds more like HE owed YOU an apology!

 

As to "professional restorers" (aka people with websites) sending pens with crusty old ink in the pen... sounds like if these ones didn't even bother CLEANING the old ink out of the pens, you basically could assume they did NOT "restore" the pen! I mean, step one for me when I get an "as found" from ebay is CLEAN the pen! I would be looking to return it, assuming you had paid "restored" prices and not "as found/ebay" prices!

[Estycollector]

sounds more like HE owed YOU an apology!

 

As to "professional restorers" (aka people with websites) sending pens with crusty old ink in the pen... sounds like if these ones didn't even bother CLEANING the old ink out of the pens, you basically could assume they did NOT "restore" the pen! I mean, step one for me when I get an "as found" from ebay is CLEAN the pen! I would be looking to return it, assuming you had paid "restored" prices and not "as found/ebay" prices!

 

As has been already stated, I tended to find estate sale Esterbrooks which had been stationary for a few life times. Often I wished a bit of liquid had been present...LOL!!. THis would have prevented the use of a perfectly good mandolin e string to unclog.