Does Anyone Use Red Ink Anymore?

[Bilbo_Swaggins]

So I am a teacher and I do not use red ink at all. This is due to a significant number of my students coming from Asian cultures where red writing is used in funeral documents (specifically their names) and I try to be accommodating as I have had two students comment on how they find it weird. Now this is only two out of dozens but enough to make me wonder if other students felt equally awkward and just did not speak up. It was serious enough that they didn't read the documents with red.

 

These days I typically use a brown (MB Toffee Brown atm) for general stuff and a nice green or light blue (MB Emerald Green or maybe Diamine Prussian Blue) for marking my students work. It is still eye catching enough, though my other western coworkers have not caught on yet I have noticed some others doing the same independent of myself.

[MBDostoevsky]

So I am a teacher and I do not use red ink at all. This is due to a significant number of my students coming from Asian cultures where red writing is used in funeral documents (specifically their names) and I try to be accommodating as I have had two students comment on how they find it weird. Now this is only two out of dozens but enough to make me wonder if other students felt equally awkward and just did not speak up. It was serious enough that they didn't read the documents with red.

 

These days I typically use a brown (MB Toffee Brown atm) for general stuff and a nice green or light blue (MB Emerald Green or maybe Diamine Prussian Blue) for marking my students work. It is still eye catching enough, though my other western coworkers have not caught on yet I have noticed some others doing the same independent of myself.

 

An interesting observation you make... i don't know which Asian countries have red ink used in funeral documents but I certainly grew up getting my assignments, homework and report cards all written in non-erasable (Yes! I tried to erase it many times :-D) red ink... in fact teachers used red ball points for marking and then we got stars in green or blue depending on how good we were...

 

I however appreciate that you think like this... I can't help recommending Diamine Ancient Copper...

[txomsy]

I find it somewhat disturbing. Inclusive action, yes. Tolerance, yes. I'm all for it.But it should work both ways, and the same you understand that they have cultural associations, they should understand yours as well. Specially, in something that otherwise has no real bearing in your (generic your) life.

 

I mean, changing the colour that you have traditionally used in your culture to highlight some marks because in a different culture it has a different meaning may be a little too much; for the sake of comparison it would be as asking them to change burial document color because here it is associated with bad marks. Or changing the way one part of the world identifies people (Family Name, Given Name vs. Given Name, Family name; using only the father's or both father's and mother's names; or having an "inherited" and an "assigned" name...) because the rest does it in a different way and it sounds awkward to them.

 

Certainly, if we can All (as in Everybody in the World) sit down together and agree on a new, single, universal color code, then by al means that may be a win for every one, for communication and mutual understanding. Absent that universal agreement, I think that good conviviality consists in acknowledging others may have characteristics that may initially seem awkward but are as valid as ours, and since both are equally valid there is no reason (absent that agreement) for anyone to change his ways to please the other, at least to the extent one can tolerate each other and nobody's harmed.

 

I know, and have at times adapted to the preferences of a single person in similar settings. But then I realized that I had sacrificed consistency, I was treating different people differently by reasons of culture (which sometimes also means other conditions) and was seeding the possibility that less considerate people might see it as discrimination and that these less considerate ones might take it one step forward into apartheid or worse.

 

I'm not implying it is bad by any means or that it shouldn't be done. But I see no reason for changing some harmless habits when doing so might hypothetically lead some extremists towards potentially undesirable conducts. Personally, I think it is better to educate people in tolerance and celebration of diversity than trying to find a way to do things without stepping on anyone's toes (which I think is impossible).

 

Shortly, I see no reason why anybody should not use red ink if they so wish or why anybody should not accept it.

 

Barring daltonism, of course. Which might make the choice of red and green a suboptimal one.

[Karmachanic]

I find it somewhat disturbing. Inclusive action, yes. Tolerance, yes. I'm all for it.But it should work both ways, and the same you understand that they have cultural associations, they should understand yours as well. Specially, in something that otherwise has no real bearing in your (generic your) life.

 

I mean, changing the colour that you have traditionally used in your culture to highlight some marks because in a different culture it has a different meaning may be a little too much; for the sake of comparison it would be as asking them to change burial document color because here it is associated with bad marks. Or changing the way one part of the world identifies people (Family Name, Given Name vs. Given Name, Family name; using only the father's or both father's and mother's names; or having an "inherited" and an "assigned" name...) because the rest does it in a different way and it sounds awkward to them.

 

Certainly, if we can All (as in Everybody in the World) sit down together and agree on a new, single, universal color code, then by al means that may be a win for every one, for communication and mutual understanding. Absent that universal agreement, I think that good conviviality consists in acknowledging others may have characteristics that may initially seem awkward but are as valid as ours, and since both are equally valid there is no reason (absent that agreement) for anyone to change his ways to please the other, at least to the extent one can tolerate each other and nobody's harmed.

 

I know, and have at times adapted to the preferences of a single person in similar settings. But then I realized that I had sacrificed consistency, I was treating different people differently by reasons of culture (which sometimes also means other conditions) and was seeding the possibility that less considerate people might see it as discrimination and that these less considerate ones might take it one step forward into apartheid or worse.

 

I'm not implying it is bad by any means or that it shouldn't be done. But I see no reason for changing some harmless habits when doing so might hypothetically lead some extremists towards potentially undesirable conducts. Personally, I think it is better to educate people in tolerance and celebration of diversity than trying to find a way to do things without stepping on anyone's toes (which I think is impossible).

 

Shortly, I see no reason why anybody should not use red ink if they so wish or why anybody should not accept it.

 

Barring daltonism, of course. Which might make the choice of red and green a suboptimal one.

 

TL:DNR - When in Rome ..........

Edited September 13, 2020 by Karmachanic

[Bilbo_Swaggins]

I find it somewhat disturbing. Inclusive action, yes. Tolerance, yes. I'm all for it.But it should work both ways, and the same you understand that they have cultural associations, they should understand yours as well. Specially, in something that otherwise has no real bearing in your (generic your) life.

The thing is that I pay it no mind, whereas others very much do. I care little for the ink but much for my students.

 

As a side note, I encourage appropriate table manners when needed. Its give/give.

[txomsy]

Exactly, and that's the whole point.

 

When I was in Sri Lanka, good manners were to eat with your hands. In Hong Kong and China, to eat with chopsticks, here in Europe, it is using cutlery... If I were to eat with my hands here (besides a few specific dishes and circumstances) it would be "bad manners" and for some, "weird", "striking", "shocking" or even "offensive". For loving, caring, understanding people it would just be "fun". In some environments it is "good manners" to drink and appreciate a good wine at the table, and yet in Mauritania it would carry you a death penalty. When I am abroad I eat with my hands or chopsticks or whatever, restrict from alcohol, etc... depending on where I am. Indeed, for me it is lots of fun learning about all the ways things can be done.

 

I do also teach my kids "good manners" at the table. But besides using cutlery, I also teach them to eat with chopsticks or any other cultural differences as I discover them, so they can learn to appreciate, live with them and know when to use each, and avoid risking them believing there is only one true way which is the one they got used to when they grew.

 

I think it is more enriching to everybody (and useful in life, for each of us and for society at large) to help each know, get used to, and appreciate diversity, new conventions and contrasts, than to hide them for their/our ease (so they/we do not perceive any deviation from their/our preconceived expectations). But that's me. I prefer to explain tactfully to foreign students how we do things here and encourage them to appreciate our way without giving up or undervaluing their own.

 

Oh! And most important, I forgot to thank you for letting me know another use for red ink I wasn't aware of: funeral documenting. So, a big thanks.

[inkstainedruth]

I was surprised to read that red ink = funeral stuff. Because I'd heard that the color red was for celebration in some colors. A friend of ours (my husband's old housemate) wore a red dress with a really spectacular white sleeveless Russian-style coat). Several of the other guests were also co-workers of theirs, and they were Japanese. And not one of them freaked out at red at a wedding. Or is the restriction just related to ink?

My parents took a trip to mainland China in 1980 (not that long after it had been opened back up to Westerners. My mom learned to eat with chopsticks while there (she said the food was good almost everywhere they went -- unlike the "tourist dinner" in Manila the group was taken to their last night, where they may have gotten a touch of food poisoning ). I figured that if my MOM could learn to eat with chopsticks, I could too....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[ParramattaPaul]

'I was surprised to read that red ink = funeral stuff.'

 

I was as well. I've spent a number of years in Southeast Asia, and travelled through Japan a number of times. The colour red seemed to be ubiquitous -- signage, flags, furnishing, etc.

 

My experience has been that white is the appropriate clothing colour amongst Buddhists for funerals.

[inkstainedruth]

My experience has been that white is the appropriate clothing colour amongst Buddhists for funerals.

Yes, I had heard that as well.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[bunnspecial]

I suppose it really is cultural differences.

 

I have worked with and become good friends with quite a few folks from India and surrounding countries. I have never explicitly asked, but have noticed that women in particular often wear red(or rather red and gold) on formal celebratory occasions. For banquets and things at work(that had a celebratory nature) I'd frequently-not always-see folks from those countries wearing red gowns elaborately decorated in gold. I've also seen similar at weddings.

 

Of course I wouldn't pretend to say that's universal for such a huge and populous country, but there again my general observation is that red seems to be treated as a celebratory color at least among the folks I've known from that part of the world.

[Karmachanic]

Spending some time with Monteverde Copper Noir, a lovely coppery brick red, in a wet M1005 with an F CI nib.

[HalloweenHJB]

I love RED —it’s my favorite color—, and I use red ink as much as I can.

 

A few years ago, a department chair told us that he did not think that any teacher should ever use red ink to correct student papers because, as he put it, “it looks like someone bled all over the paper”. Apparently there are still people who can only connect the color red with blood.

 

And believe it or not, academics have published research on the effects of “the red pen” on student perceptions of the class, and their likelihood of taking more classes in the field. For world language faculty, any displeasure on the part of students is viewed as a catastrophe.

 

My reds currently loaded in pens:

• Krishna Sakthy
• Sailor Irori
• Diamine Wild Strawberry
• Iroshizuku Momiji
• Herbin Rouge Hématite (de-sparkled)
• Krishna Jungle Volcano
• Akkerman Scharlaken
• MB Shakespeare Red Velvet
• Sailor Yodaki

[RJS]

I like the colour red, and for personal writing I enjoy extremely dark reds. I rarely use red for work purposes, as it has such negative connotations if you use it to annotate/correct someone's work- green is the safe (but visible) colour there. I'm currently using Diamine Deep Dark Red in one pen, and it's very nice.

[MBDostoevsky]

I like the colour red, and for personal writing I enjoy extremely dark reds. I rarely use red for work purposes, as it has such negative connotations if you use it to annotate/correct someone's work- green is the safe (but visible) colour there. I'm currently using Diamine Deep Dark Red in one pen, and it's very nice.

Have you tried Oxblood and Red Dragon...?

[max dog]

Red is my favourite color. All my cars have been red over the years, so naturally I like the red shade inks, on the darker side. Montblanc Burgundy Red looks like my fave red wines, and enjoy it. In wet pens, it shades nicely and I like the saturated burgundy red shade. It has an antiquated look to it that I like.

Edited September 24, 2020 by max dog

[arcfide]

Most of my family (kids and wife) actually prefers a red, pink, or a red lavender ink (currently a colorverse pink and Platinum Lavender Black) for their main "work" ink. I personally have a hard time fitting a red ink into my workflow, despite liking them for what they are.

 

On the other hand, if I handed off a document to someone else to mark up, I would definitely *prefer* for them to use a nice red ink to make corrections, because it doesn't carry any connotations that are emotionally troubling to me, but it does help to distinguish the ink from blue or black, and it is easy on my eyes for corrections. I've seen people markup with lighter colors, or darker, and it's never as nice. But I was raised in the US, where red is a correction color, and I find it helpful to lean into that, rather than trying to avoid it, as it helps with annotation.

[RJS]

Have you tried Oxblood and Red Dragon...?

I've bought Oxblood but can't even remember what I thought of it. I haven't tried Red Dragon yet.

[MBDostoevsky]

I've bought Oxblood but can't even remember what I thought of it. I haven't tried Red Dragon yet.

Oxblood is like coagulated blood. Very nice shade of red

[tleek]

I do. I have sheaffer red and diamine oxblood.

I teach elementary school and use different colors under my document camera all the time. Sheaffer red is a go to.

[mke]

If you want something (positive answer, service, good relationship) from someone, you better adapt to their thinking. If they find red aggressive, then don't use red.

Knowing that the addressee will not like it, "who cares" is not a good way to get what you want.

 

I usually use red (Gutenberg Red or Sailor's red cartridges) for marking MY mistakes or additional information in my notes, because the contrast is high with blue.

As usually the blue text is the bigger part, red is used less.

 

Many people I know prefer a violet-red over pure red.