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Ebay Seller Deceptive Ad - Pen Leaks Badly - Advice?

ebay deception

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58 replies to this topic

#1 GreenMountain

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 15:46

Hi Folks,

I just bought a used pen on eBay that had the description "works very well".  After cleaning it, I tried to ink it up with both a converter and a cartridge.  Neither would seat in the pen and the ink leaked out all over.

The seller offered me less than half the value of the pen + shipping, without return shipping.  I refused the offer and told them that I would be opening a case with eBay and also leaving them a bad review.

Any advice, other than to buy only from known sellers going forward?

Out them by name here?   Is there a thread in FPN where complaints and praise is found?


Edited by GreenMountain, 22 June 2020 - 15:49.


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#2 silverlifter

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 16:05

Don't out them. From the Rules & Guidelines:

 

"Likewise, "naming and shaming" is prohibited on The Fountain Pen Network. Naming and shaming can be construed as defamation, libel, and/or slander. All threads and posts found to be in violation of this rule will be closed or removed without further discussion."

 

Pursue the claim with ebay and chalk it up as a lesson learned.


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#3 Doug1426

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 16:23

Don't out them. From the Rules & Guidelines:

 

"Likewise, "naming and shaming" is prohibited on The Fountain Pen Network. Naming and shaming can be construed as defamation, libel, and/or slander. All threads and posts found to be in violation of this rule will be closed or removed without further discussion."

 

Pursue the claim with ebay and chalk it up as a lesson learned.

I second that advice. 

 

Wondering though, is the seller someone who specializes in/sells lots of pens?  If not, they may have made an unintentional/uninformed mistake by saying it worked well.  But offering only a partial refund seems a bit shady.

 

Good luck with your claim.


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#4 Parkette

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 16:40

This type of issue has come up before and I am not sure that the advice give above is correct, or at least is incomplete.

 

Naming and shaming amongst FPN members is not permitted for sure, and I don't think is regarded as acceptable even  in the wider community on the basis that an accusation is made and the members only here one side of it, as in 'I sent my Parker 51 to Dodgy Repair Man and he did a terrible job, don't use him.'

 

In the past there have been badly described ebay ads and even ads that have been intent on deception and further information on the seller and the ad was permitted and, presumably, within the rules of FPN.

 

I recall that one Moderator even invited an unscrupulous ebay seller to respond to comments made about her ad on ebay, what followed was abuse, (abuse isn't actually the correct word, threats would be closer), to all concerned. I was promised a visit from her boxer son because I had questionned the idea that a Parker 51 with a broken clip was not a rare Military cap.

 

As a halfway house, you could post a link to the ad perhaps, as I have done with ebay ads for pens which claim to be Parkers, they may have flown over the Parker factory on their way from China but that is about all.

 

With regard to your final question 'Is there a thread in FPN where complaints and praise is found?', there is no appropriate thread and it sounds like a potential minefield, best left alone.


Edited by Parkette, 22 June 2020 - 16:42.


#5 GreenMountain

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 16:50

Thanks very much for the answers.  Glad I didn't say "xxxx is a scumbag liar and cheat"!

With respect to posting a link to the add, the pics wouldn't show anything.  Per the guidelines I couldn't say "leaks badly" is not equal to "works very well".

 

I'll just see what eBay will do.  Seems to me I should get a full refund for an unusable pen.


Edited by GreenMountain, 22 June 2020 - 16:51.


#6 I-am-not-really-here

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 16:52

For unknown sellers,

 

1. check prior sales history - do they regularly sell pens or is this a one-off? 
2. ask what steps were taken to reach their conclusion of working condition.  If the response is unsatisfactory, move on.

 

 


 



#7 Parkette

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 16:56

Thanks very much for the answers.  Glad I didn't say "xxxx is a scumbag liar and cheat"!

With respect to posting a link to the add, the pics wouldn't show anything.  Per the guidelines I couldn't say "leaks badly" is not equal to "works very well".

 

I'll just see what eBay will do.  Seems to me I should get a full refund for an unusable pen.

 

 

Good idea GM.

 

I don't know your pen knowledge, please don't take offence if I suggest that you post a thread in the repair section asking for comments on - what is wrong with this pen.



#8 Force

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 18:05

Open a case. Arm the case with pictures.

 

Ask the seller for their return details and stipulate it is not as described so the return cost should be met by them.

 

Thence request that they cover the return cost.

 

Leave it at that.

 

If they do not state they will cover the cost leave it to ebay and Paypal to refund you.



#9 Paul-in-SF

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 18:24

My only question would be whether you are sure you are using the proper type of cartridge and converter? Might this pen have a proprietary type, and you are trying the wrong ones? I hope this isn't an offensive question, I ask it only because I don't know how experienced you are, nor anything about the pen.

 

As for advice: I would hold up on your feedback until the issue is resolved. You may change your mind, one way or the other, as the issue process unfolds.

 

Once you open an issue, your purchase on your Purchase History list will move to the bottom in an area by itself. 

 

There are further complications if the seller is in another country, but I assume that is not the case here since you didn't mention it. 

 

I recommend on your issue description not to use any inflammatory language, just state your case as simply and clearly as possible, with as much detail as you can. Best of luck to you. 



#10 inkstainedruth

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 20:18

Additionally, be advised that if you do open a dispute and it is resolved in your favor, you may not be allowed by eBay to post feedback.  That happened to me several years ago with a seller with literally tens of thousands of transactions.  I got my money back and was allowed to keep the pens (in my case it was that the seller did not included the promised cartridges and the "refill" was the one *in* the pen...).  But I was NOT allowed to provide feedback -- which left me wondering who else had been in my shoes....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth


"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

#11 Uncial

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Posted 22 June 2020 - 22:37

My only question would be whether you are sure you are using the proper type of cartridge and converter? Might this pen have a proprietary type, and you are trying the wrong ones? I hope this isn't an offensive question, I ask it only because I don't know how experienced you are, nor anything about the pen.
 
As for advice: I would hold up on your feedback until the issue is resolved. You may change your mind, one way or the other, as the issue process unfolds.
 
Once you open an issue, your purchase on your Purchase History list will move to the bottom in an area by itself. 
 
There are further complications if the seller is in another country, but I assume that is not the case here since you didn't mention it. 
 
I recommend on your issue description not to use any inflammatory language, just state your case as simply and clearly as possible, with as much detail as you can. Best of luck to you.


+1
You haven't mentioned what pen it is, or did I miss the info?

#12 Seney724

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 00:06

Don't out them. From the Rules & Guidelines:

 

"Likewise, "naming and shaming" is prohibited on The Fountain Pen Network. Naming and shaming can be construed as defamation, libel, and/or slander. All threads and posts found to be in violation of this rule will be closed or removed without further discussion."

 

Pursue the claim with ebay and chalk it up as a lesson learned.

Where does one find the Rules & Guidelines?



#13 Force

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 04:34

Where does one find the Rules & Guidelines?

At the very top of all FPN pages.



#14 Estycollector

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 11:29

This is the second such thread in recent weeks where the OP does not provide enough information, whether intentional or not, it makes any attempt to help impossible. 


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#15 Seney724

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 15:23

At the very top of all FPN pages.

Thanks for taking the time to try and help me. 

 

I did look there before posting my question so I was quite chagrined to think I had apparently missed it which I assumed was the case when I read your response.

 

So, now, I am sitting here look at the top of the FPN landing page.... and also the top of the Forum main page. I do not see it.  Is it possible that it does not appear in all the many countries where FPN members are located?

 

Are you able to provide me with a screen shot so I can see where it is on the top of the FPN pages as you view them?

 

Thanks again.


Edited by Seney724, 25 June 2020 - 15:24.


#16 Aysedasi

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 15:54

Additionally, be advised that if you do open a dispute and it is resolved in your favor, you may not be allowed by eBay to post feedback.  That happened to me several years ago with a seller with literally tens of thousands of transactions.  I got my money back and was allowed to keep the pens (in my case it was that the seller did not included the promised cartridges and the "refill" was the one *in* the pen...).  But I was NOT allowed to provide feedback -- which left me wondering who else had been in my shoes....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

Happened to me very recently Ruth.  Not a pen but some hair trimmers sold to me as new which had clearly been used!  (There were still hairs on the scissors).  I had no problem from the seller in getting my money back including postage, but the listing was removed and I couldn't leave any feedback.  



#17 Seney724

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 16:19

 

Happened to me very recently Ruth.  Not a pen but some hair trimmers sold to me as new which had clearly been used!  (There were still hairs on the scissors).  I had no problem from the seller in getting my money back including postage, but the listing was removed and I couldn't leave any feedback.  

It is hard to believe but over time eBay has actually gotten worse & worse. 

 

Yes, the buyer protection guarantees have been helpful but they have also given unethical buyers the opportunity to run roughshod over honest, good sellers. 

Moreover, they are more tolerant now of sleazy sellers who have shills bid up the prices on their auction items than ever before. 

And, the number of non-paying buyers who disrupt the sales of good sellers is absurd.

Within the USA, eBay's policy of charging sales tax on shipping costs is unconscionable.  Yes, of course they should collect State taxes for the item(s) purchased, but there are very few States which require the additional collection of sales tax on shipping costs, too.  No other large e-retailer does this yet eBay sees fit to do it thousands of times per day. Presumably thinking that buyers will not notice.

 

One is best advised to just stay away................



#18 Beechwood

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 16:46

Thanks for taking the time to try and help me. 

 

I did look there before posting my question so I was quite chagrined to think I had apparently missed it which I assumed was the case when I read your response.

 

So, now, I am sitting here look at the top of the FPN landing page.... and also the top of the Forum main page. I do not see it.  Is it possible that it does not appear in all the many countries where FPN members are located?

 

Are you able to provide me with a screen shot so I can see where it is on the top of the FPN pages as you view them?

 

Thanks again.

 

 

Try this link

 

http://www.fountainp...s-terms-of-use/

 

Its a bit clunky to find, the connection to the Rules and Guidelines does not always work, IMHE.


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#19 BaronWulfraed

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 17:16


Are you able to provide me with a screen shot so I can see where it is on the top of the FPN pages as you view them?

 

Thanks again.

fpn_1593105303__top-fpn.jpg



#20 inkstainedruth

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Posted 25 June 2020 - 19:10

Within the USA, eBay's policy of charging sales tax on shipping costs is unconscionable.  Yes, of course they should collect State taxes for the item(s) purchased, but there are very few States which require the additional collection of sales tax on shipping costs, too.  No other large e-retailer does this yet eBay sees fit to do it thousands of times per day. Presumably thinking that buyers will not notice.

 

I just bought something on eBay yesterday.  I did not see this.  In fact, I was surprised at how LITTLE sales tax was being collected.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

ETA: A couple of years ago I got outbid on a listing for a Parker Vector -- seller had five, you were bidding on your choice of color.  A couple of days after the listing ended I got a notice of a "Second Chance" offer (apparently the high bidder thought the listing was for all five pens (even though it said that right there in the listing that the price was for ONE of the pens).  I wanted several (and was quite willing to pay X price times N number of pens.  Only I couldn't make it work.  Spent most of the day back and forth with the poor seller (who was in the Netherlands).  Finally, about 5 PM Eastern time (which meant the guy had probably been up most of the night  :() he pulled the listing and re-did it as "buy it now" (at my price per pen) so I could get the three colors I wanted.  Because it never OCCURRED to the IT people at eBay that this could possibly be a case (i.e., a "second chance" offer when the buyer wanted more than one of the items when it was your choice....  The poor seller probably thought I was a lunatic, because the messages I sent were increasingly hysterical.  And of course, it wasn't HIS fault at all.  It was eBay's pisspoor IT.  

More recently I got the very silly Shrek "Puss in Boots" Vector from the same seller (this wasn't an auction, IIRC -- just a "for sale" listing).  The listing said the seller was away for a few days.  But I think because he saw it was me trying to buy the pen he hurried back.....  :D  (Yes, he's one of the GOOD sellers on eBay, and I would happily buy yet another pen from the guy if he happened to have something I wanted.)


Edited by inkstainedruth, 25 June 2020 - 19:23.

"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."





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