What Is The Greatest Lie In The Fountain Pen Industry?

[TSherbs]

18kgp

 

word

[A Smug Dill]

Limited Editions????

This is SOOOOOO rare because...

I find that manufacturers are generally^† not the ones who make mention to rarity of limited editions: if it decides to put out a limited edition pen model with "only" 100, 365 or 1919 numbered units available for distribution, or unnumbered units that will be produced only until the end of the run (scheduled for a particular date, which is possibly undisclosed outside the company, or until its stock of the barrel material runs out permanently, whichever comes earlier), then it's just that. It's up to the individual to gauge — often without valid basis or research — the level of consumer demand (and thus "competition") for the particular limited edition, and infer the degree of relative rarity.

 

However, since this thread refers to the fountain pen industry in general, I do see some retailers and sellers making a habit of flogging the rarity aspect.

 

With inks, though, I'm under the impression it's usually consumers who keep agitating for extending or reinstating production of "limited edition" ink colours.

 

Personally, I think everything in retail is finite and therefore inherently limited in some respect; it's just a question of whether there's a published hard limit that will be upheld strictly. Oh, and I like rarity, even for items I may be interested in but missed out on buying; so I definitely won't be agitating for doing away with "limited editions" or making ongoing consumer demand the only deciding factor.

 

....pleasing feedback......

I mean, come on. Who are you trying to kid?

That's ... legit to me.

 

I understand that it will be personal preference, but I can't stand pens that just glide all over the paper without any resistance and like when I can sort of feel the paper surface as I write.

 

I agree with katerchen there. To me, some types of kinaesthetic feedback in the act of handwriting are displeasing, e.g. sharp scratchiness or dull drag against the paper surface, but there is also kinaesthetic feedback that is pleasing and desirable. Whereas I see "buttery smooth" or "writing on glass" as a problem (but not a manufacturing defect), and something I have to then spend effort to correct in order to make a pen usable and enjoyable to me; I had to do that to a new pen just last night.

 

^† There are exceptions, of course. See https://thepelikansperch.com/2016/11/05/pelikan-m900-toledo-controversy/ for one.

Edited February 20, 2020 by A Smug Dill

[corgicoupe]

Fountain pens will improve your handwriting.

 

 

 

Flexible nibs make everyone's handwriting better.

Susan Wirth was of the opinion that Italic nibs would make your handwriting look better, but not necessarily improve your handwriting.

Edited February 20, 2020 by corgicoupe

[txomsy]

"Collectible" or "Highly collectible" for any pen more than 5 years old.

 

"Vintage" used for even last-year model pen. And also for newly made pens that look "classic-y".

 

OK, that's mainly seen in Chinese and eBay sellers of all persuasions, but sellers are also a part of the "Industry", aren't they?

 

On the issue of feedback, I also prefer to have it over glassy sliding.

 

And on "beauty"... very long ago I noticed how everybody sees their own child as a wonder no matter how the baby looks. It's only natural, even if it is due to familiarity. I suspect it is the same for hand writing: we all consider ours "beautiful" and "readable". From that point of view, an italic or stub, a pen with flex or some character that gives any line variation will make any writing look "better" from the writer's point of view, even if only as a subjective improvement due to self-suggestion. It's a self-filling prophecy. Like price: if it did cost you more it "must" be better, ain't it, mate? When better is defined in terms of "subjective personal appreciation", it usually works because you want it to. Same goes for "precious" resin, "limited edition", and all the rest.

 

What's really rare is self-criticism. Which is why most marketing "lies" (objectively speaking) aren't so (subjectively speaking).

Edited February 20, 2020 by txomsy

[Uncial]

Ebay must be the greatest source of fountain pen lies:

Things like....rare.....in perfect writing order........recently re-sacked,,,,,,mint condition....... genuine.......and of course, the greatest lie of all.... flexible nib. Sometimes there seems to be more flexible nibbed fountain pens on ebay than normal ones. Amazingly, some manufacturers in the past even labelled their nibs as 'manifold' and then on ebay they turned out to be flexible. Who would have thought!

 

I get the 'kinaesthetic feedback' thing but I sometimes wonder why I just don't use a biro or a pencil if I really want that experience. For me personally, the greatest pleasure of fountain pen use is precisely 'the glide'. At least Platinum are honest about their nibs with feedback. They call them 'coarse' here and that's exactly my experience of it - rude, ill-mannered and crude. At least it's well described.

[Estycollector]

The thread as degraded into a marketing bash. What is a seller to post ? As a buyer are we not asking for information? There is a sign on a old motel that says "cheaper than many, cleaner than most". Is this really what a people want to hear? Because it is self deprecating does not mean it's true.

 

It is a common thread title that says someone has bought something and is now asking what they have. Whose fault is it they don't do their homework before spending their money?

 

I find that using this forum and doing some additional research, I can make good buying decisions. That said, there is an element of trust. I read the reviews and seller rankings to determine who I can trust.

[sandy101]

It writes...

 

(it doesn't, always...)

[NumberSix]

Not a lie so much as a word game, but it amuses me:

 

Ferris Wheel Press feels like they're all about local artists, hipster attitudes, etc. So when they rolled out their pens, you would expect "Made in Canada". But no.

 

Their pens are advertised as "Designed in Canada".

[bemon]

Not a lie so much as a word game, but it amuses me:

 

Ferris Wheel Press feels like they're all about local artists, hipster attitudes, etc. So when they rolled out their pens, you would expect "Made in Canada". But no.

 

Their pens are advertised as "Designed in Canada".

Yeah. I hate that. And Canadian manufacturers wonder why Canadians buy American or European goods. If you make it, we will come. If it comes from China and you try to trick us with Marketing, we'll buy elsewhere.

[A Smug Dill]

The thread as degraded into a marketing bash. What is a seller to post ? As a buyer are we not asking for information?

 

Preferably objective, factual information that is independently verifiable — even if it requires having access to the physical item, which may only come after the item has been ordered and received — and leave the individual prospective purchaser to infer and come to his/her own conclusions, to which the seller does not need to offer any guidance or assurance, about the value or worth of the product or item, in his/her subjective framework and/or relative to other offerings in the market.

 

There is a sign on a old motel that says "cheaper than many, cleaner than most". Is this really what a people want to hear? Because it is self deprecating does not mean it's true.

I don't care what strangers "want to hear" — which seems to be more about their subjective feelings and less about what is legally and commercially proper — unless and until I have the intent of influencing and manipulating them in ways that serve my interests and purposes ahead of theirs.

 

Funnily, a significant proportion of people feel duped when, in retrospect, they discover that agreements and/or transactions they entered into willingly turned out to be to other parties' advantage far more than their own, as if such things are meant to to serve all parties at least "equally" well in their subjective perception... but very acceptable when the shoe is on the other foot and they feel they outsmarted, bested or outright exploited other parties' mistakes, shortcomings and/or circumstances, and secured an advantage for themselves in a deal.

 

I much prefer that individuals acquire two (or more) objects, and only then conclude by themselves that some quality or characteristic is subjectively superior, because they have also now experienced (or even continue to possess) at their (financial and/or other) cost what is subjectively inferior. That applies to myself, too, and that's why I bought >200 fountain pens and >200 different inks to try, "test" and use; I don't like all of them equally, or feel that every purchase was money well spent. Of course, it doesn't have to be a zero-sum thing; an owner could like dissimilar pens (or inks) for different reasons, and find more utility and/or value in one or the other depending on the particular use case.

[praxim]

The thread [h]as degraded ...

 

Considering its genesis, it hardly had that opportunity.

[KBeezie]

Not a lie per se because I don't think sellers or retailers themselves would say this.

 

But I would say the most common peer-shared misinformation for whatever reason is that...

 

Gold nib = smoother, softer, and/or flexier.

 

Despite a lot of us being able to quickly dispel the myth (going into how tipping isn't either etc etc), that implication still seems to get spouted daily especially when suggesting pens to new users.

[corniche]

Not a lie per se because I don't think sellers or retailers themselves would say this.

 

But I would say the most common peer-shared misinformation for whatever reason is that...

 

Gold nib = smoother, softer, and/or flexier.

 

Despite a lot of us being able to quickly dispel the myth (going into how tipping isn't either etc etc), that implication still seems to get spouted daily especially when suggesting pens to new users.

I don't know... gold is softer than steel and because it is, it does flex easier... and gold is definitely "wetter" than steel. Comparing my humble Eversharp flex pen to ANY of my modern "flex" pens with steel nibs; I don't have to tell you which one is the best.

 

I've had some really smooth steel nibs, but I still think in the general equation; gold is superior to steel. Our forefathers weren't dopes; there's several reasons why most vintage pens had gold nibs... and pens would still be made with them today, if gold wasn't selling for $1,500 an ounce.

 

Sean

[KBeezie]

I don't know... gold is softer than steel and because it is, it does flex easier... and gold is definitely "wetter" than steel. Comparing my humble Eversharp flex pen to ANY of my modern "flex" pens with steel nibs; I don't have to tell you which one is the best.

 

I've had some really smooth steel nibs, but I still think in the general equation; gold is superior to steel. Our forefathers weren't dopes; there's several reasons why most vintage pens had gold nibs... and pens would still be made with them today, if gold wasn't selling for $1,500 an ounce.

 

Sean

 

At the risk that you're just being sarcastic

 

Gold isn't smoother because, it's the tipping that writes on the paper, not the gold or steel material.

Gold isn't inherently softer/flexier as that depends on how the alloy as made, as you've seen steel nibs that are both firm and flexy, gold nibs can be firm or flexy. (even with many of our modern 18K nibs on the market being firm nails)

 

And the reason for many vintages to be made with gold nibs, was not be cause of smoothness, flexiness, softness, or wetness.

 

It was because gold is a noble metal, and isn't going to corrode from ink, especially inks with more acidic particulates. The only other purpose functional/practical/otherwise besides that is because it's got luxery/status attached. Otherwise, a steel nib is going to be able to have the same desired smooth writing, wet flow, be either bouncy or firm, etc etc. Our forefathers didn't like having to chuck away steel nibs so often (which formulas were still being perfected), as they got corroded and pitted.

Edited February 21, 2020 by KBeezie

[sidthecat]

"You'll end the day with clean hands."

[Paul-in-SF]

I'm perfectly able to discount marketing and hype for what it is, whether it's an online amateur seller or a prestigious manufacturer. There are, however, some online reviewers whose objectivity is suspect. Those who will review every new finish of the exact same model pen as if it were the second coming, for example. Or those whose reviews consist of facetime only and we never see the pen (well, that's less a lie than it is ego).

 

I am glad for sites like this where, although opinions differ, there is wide access to general knowledge, experience and expertise, and where people who have little experience, like me, generally admit to that when they are giving advice or feedback.

 

The biggest lie I can think of in any arena is "this object is (or is not) worth xxx." Everything for sale is worth precisely what someone is willing to pay for it.

[A Smug Dill]

Everything for sale is worth precisely what someone is willing to pay for it.

 

 

That comment is worth its weight in gold!

[inkstainedruth]

"You'll end the day with clean hands."

 

That was the hype about Sheaffer Snorkels -- that the only part of the pen that got into the ink was the breather tube. Apparently Sheaffer forgot to think that people might occasionally need to FLUSH their pens out (and of course there's just as much ink a Snorkel feed as the feed in any other type of fill system....

Mind you, I really like my Snorkels; and in fact I wanted one as soon as I saw the old -- and incredibly sexist, I might add -- TV ad that someone posted a link to a number of years ago about the PFM: "Buy your husband a PFM for Christmas -- you know he wants one!" Part of the ad showed the fill system (which is the same as a standard Snorkel) and I said "Oh, KEWL! I want one!" But I still think that Sheaffer's answer to the incroachment of BPs on the writing instrument market was the Snorkel -- with possibly the most convoluted fill system on the planet -- while Parker's answer was the capillary filler Parker 61... the simplest fill system on the planet (even easier than cartridges). Yeah, I have some of those, too.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[AoKiu]

DELTA Fusion Nib and how they described what it does to the ink flow!

[Mongoosey]

"Don't let anyone else use your pen. It will alter the nib."

 

Of course, I will say that too if I don't trust the person I'm giving the pen to. So maybe it was deliberately started as a lie so we can hand someone a Bic ballpoint instead. Hmm....

 

I use this lie to fend off inexperienced fountain pen users, and also for new fountain pen users to adhere to so inexperienced users don't mess up their nib, which I've seen happen lol.

 

 

 

That's ... legit to me.

 

I understand that it will be personal preference, but I can't stand pens that just glide all over the paper without any resistance.

 

I actually like when I can sort of feel the paper surface as I write. For instance (and that's not a perfect analogy) when writing with a soft pencil. With a quality core, mind, not a cheap POS where you hit clay particles every now and then.

 

Any scratchiness is a big no-no of course. Be it the edge of an Italic or the insides of the tines catching on the paper.

 

-k

 

I agree. There's definitely positive feedback; like a nib tuned with some resistance.

 

I love European Fines or Japanese Mediums tuned with some resistance; enough to let you know you're writing.

 

If a nib doesn't have that I find myself requiring more effort to write, pressing down on the nib to get some feedback, and/or having to go to finer nibs that have more of a toothiness I don't usually prefer.

 

I agree: I get unpleasant feedback from Edginess of tines (badly cut or separated to wide) or excessive toothiness from Finer nibs.

Edited February 22, 2020 by Mongoosey