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How To Regrind A Penbbs Waverley Nib To A Round One?


15 replies to this topic

#1 by_a_Lady

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Posted 22 October 2019 - 08:42

I really like my PenBBS pens, but their upturned/Waverley style nibs are just a desaster for my writing angle. I did try to fit some of the regular Jinhao #6 nibs instead, but it's hit and miss - some of them will fit nicely, some of them are quite loose or leave a gap between the nib and feed. So I'd like to regrind the Waverley nibs but don't quite know how. Does anyone have a tutorial or just tips in general for how to go about it?

 

 

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#2 welch

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Posted 23 October 2019 - 01:00

It might cost more to de-waverly the nib than it cost to buy the pen. 

 

You probably want more to bend the nib straight rather than to grind it. "Bending" a nib is delicate work...something a speciialist could do.


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#3 Honeybadgers

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Posted 23 October 2019 - 02:44

you could just grind the top off by flipping the pen upside down, but this would be relatively major surgery that I wouldn't do without a rotary tool.

 

I find bock and JoWo nibs to fit the PenBBS feed quite nicely. I have a bock titanium in my 355 (bock steel fits well as well), and a custom JoWo XXF PO nib in my 380.

 

I've also made custom jinhao nibs for them, and find them to be good beds if you're willing to tweak the nibs a bit.

 

You could also just by a replacement psnBBS F or M nib in the non-waverly style.


Edited by Honeybadgers, 23 October 2019 - 02:45.

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#4 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 23 October 2019 - 06:54

The Waverly style is/was quite well admired.

I'm a bit behind the info curve, not knowing there was a PenBBS, much less they did a Waverly style.

 

I have no idea why I don't have a Waverly....other than Richard charged a bit for one, and it was hard to find a vintage one.

I do know certain Japanese nibs do go in that direction, but are not quite Waverly.

 

So how do you hold a fountain pen?

Behind the big index knuckle, even with it or before like a ball point?

 

Trying to remember, but think, a Waverly could be held normal or high, just like a German '50-70's Kugel nib (ball on top, which though were stubbed on the bottom).....of some of the specialty Japanese nibs.


German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

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#5 by_a_Lady

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Posted 23 October 2019 - 07:55

The Waverly style is/was quite well admired.

I'm a bit behind the info curve, not knowing there was a PenBBS, much less they did a Waverly style.

 

I have no idea why I don't have a Waverly....other than Richard charged a bit for one, and it was hard to find a vintage one.

I do know certain Japanese nibs do go in that direction, but are not quite Waverly.

 

So how do you hold a fountain pen?

Behind the big index knuckle, even with it or before like a ball point?

 

Trying to remember, but think, a Waverly could be held normal or high, just like a German '50-70's Kugel nib (ball on top, which though were stubbed on the bottom).....of some of the specialty Japanese nibs.

 

I hold the pen quite low, meaning the angle between the pen and writing surface is quite sharp. The tail of the pen rests on the soft tissue between my thumb and index finger, not on the knuckle of the index finger, which is how I would need to hold the pen to make these Waverley nibs work. I've tried, and it feels... not right, but I can't pin down whether that's because of lack of practice or because that position is just inherently incompatible with my hand.

I also tend to rotate the pen to the right, funnily enough, because I'm right-handed, and apparently we're more likely to rotate to the left? But that might be because I tend to rotate the whole hand sideways, so that when I write it's not the back of my hand that faces the ceiling but the plane between thumb and index finger.

So all in all, my trouble with Waverley nibs is that I can't get the whole foot of the nib to touch the paper, resulting in skipping, scratchiness, just overall frustration. It's as though they had a tiny sweet spot that I just gradually keep moving out of as I write, even if I adjust my angle and grip. I didn't realise that the "bent" in their name was meant to be taken literal! That, of course, complicates things. I might try doctoring one of the PenBBS nibs as though they had been accidentally bent.

 

 

Dominique


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currently learning EO, JP, NL)


#6 A Smug Dill

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Posted 23 October 2019 - 12:25

I did try to fit some of the regular Jinhao #6 nibs instead, but it's hit and miss

 

 

As Honeybadgers has intimated, try a JoWo #6, and a Nemosine #6, Bock #6, Goulet #6, etc. There is no need to limit yourself to Jinhao or even more broadly Chinese #6 nibs when looking for possible replacements, and you only need one that fits and works perfectly to make your PenBBS useful again in addition to being pretty.


Let's give each other due respect, and approach discussion rigorously. We're all peers and equals here as fellow hobbyists, with common interests in the acquisition and use of fountain pens, but not necessarily any shared values, and no obligation to offer each other moral support for one's narrative or position.
 

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#7 by_a_Lady

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Posted 23 October 2019 - 15:30

 

 

As Honeybadgers has intimated, try a JoWo #6, and a Nemosine #6, Bock #6, Goulet #6, etc. There is no need to limit yourself to Jinhao or even more broadly Chinese #6 nibs when looking for possible replacements, and you only need one that fits and works perfectly to make your PenBBS useful again in addition to being pretty.

 

I just used what I had. I have a couple of Jinhaos floating around so I decomissioned those, but JoWo, Bock, etc. I'd have to order from fpnibs.com. That's why I considered regrinding the existing nibs, because I don't really want to spend any extra money on this. It's not a question of life and death, I do have other pens I can use in the meantime :) Or at least until my patience runs thin enough to cave in and order something after all. Any suggestions, perhaps? By default I'd go for an inexpensive steel B or even BB - love gushers -, but if there's something more interesting... ?

 

 

Dominique


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currently learning EO, JP, NL)


#8 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 24 October 2019 - 10:16

Normally right handers rotate to the left.....there are rare 1950-60's obliques that rotate to the left.

IMO the only oblique (unless a left handed over writer) worth having is the German '50-70 semi-flex stubbed ones. Anything else is too stiff to give a decent line variation.

I've had the rest....... :headsmack: :doh: :gaah:  :wallbash: ...we are missing the kicking boot smilie....the big kicking boot one.

 

In you might have to have it re-corked...OFC probably not .....the price of Osmia is at a decade low...They can be gotten for @E60 if you don't Idiot buy.

 

An Osmia/Osmia-Faber-Castel would be easiest to find with a right oblique....semi-flex if the nib has a small diamond....often with the number size of nib in it.....or the maxi-semi-flex with the large diamond, often with Supra, sometimes just Supra.....are maxi-semi-flex. The grand gold nib is as good as the great steel nib. :notworthy1: :thumbup:

 

Osmia is the only pen company I know of that tells you if it is a left (L such as BL) or right oblique (R.- BR) Like I have two BBL obliques. I could have gotten an ?R but had no need for for a right oblique.

This is a regular maxi-semi-flex, Supra nib. (gold)

o2PJXYR.jpg

 

Neither picture is mine....I have a similar but slightly larger pen, but use this picture to show a semi-flex Osmia nib. This picture shows a gold plated Osmia nib. I have them in steel and gold; both are great....so if you go looking; don't be a dumb gold snob....like I was.. :doh: :rolleyes: I have some 7 Osmia/OFC pens is steel and gold, had I not been a dumb Gold snob, I'd have three or four more.....

 

The nibs were made by Degussa since 1932 when the gold and silver producer took over Osmia's nib factory for debt.Continuing to make the great Osmia nibs for Osmi and others as normal in those days, Osmia made for others MB did also.

... Unlike Soennecken, MB, Pelikan and later Geha, Osmia didn't have a office supply company to hold them over water. Osmia was one of the top German pens.

The pen below comes from 1952. Faber Castel hadn't started erasing Osmia from the pen.

HBMiI0r.jpg

 

In German Ebay.....stay away from the Buy Now Idiot button....you can pay the same high price in the states..........the Cartel has started putting the pens they offer in the Buy Now Idiot section for a start bid of 10 Euros less than Idiot searching.....to drive up the price so folks will save time by spending too much money.

First the regular 'civilian' seller has to take Pay Pal (we use bank wire transfer in the EU, where it is as cheap as checks........Bank Wire from the States costs $35), many won't, and he has to ship outside of Germany.....many won't. Paranoia about the worlds second class, thieving postal services.


Edited by Bo Bo Olson, 24 October 2019 - 10:18.

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#9 LobsterRoll

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Posted 24 October 2019 - 12:51

I'm not sure this would be recommended, but I ended up not liking the upturned PenBBS nib style and modified mine with some micromesh. I had spare nibs #6 handy, though, in case I messed up. I wanted to be able to keep the PenBBS nib on the pen because it has a nice fireworks pattern on it.

I didn't go quite so far as to make it a rounded nib, but I took a bit off, and I'm guessing you could do whatever you wanted with some patience. I started with coarse grit (1500) and moved up gradually (4000, 8000, 12000) until I liked how it felt. So if you have some micromesh available, you could try that.

On my other PenBBS, I replaced the nib with a Nemosine #6 and was easy and worked great.



#10 sansenri

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Posted 24 October 2019 - 20:17

 

I just used what I had. I have a couple of Jinhaos floating around so I decomissioned those, but JoWo, Bock, etc. I'd have to order from fpnibs.com. That's why I considered regrinding the existing nibs, because I don't really want to spend any extra money on this. It's not a question of life and death, I do have other pens I can use in the meantime :) Or at least until my patience runs thin enough to cave in and order something after all. Any suggestions, perhaps? By default I'd go for an inexpensive steel B or even BB - love gushers -, but if there's something more interesting... ?

 

 

Dominique

 

the nib is like the turntable in your hifi (ok, I'm talking old stuff)

essentially your pen is as good as your nib is...

swapping the nib that you already have to an "inexpensive nib" is not such a good idea...

if you want to improve your experience your move should be "upgrade".

upgrade to a 'good' nib, it does not need to be expensive, but at least steel Jowo, Bock, Schmidt quality

you will feel the difference

in the worst case having a spare Jowo, Bock, Schmidt nib lying around will never be a bad investment



#11 Honeybadgers

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Posted 25 October 2019 - 09:08

Honestly, I find the penBBS line to actually be a very worthwhile pen for a "premium" nib upgrade. The fit and finish on their pens is superb and a good nib makes me want to use them all the more. The titanium M in my 355 makes it feel like a $500 pen, and the JoWo PO made by pablo in my 380 spiral is just amazing. I even use the 508/whichever the name for the cheap injection molded vac filler as a base for my custom flex nibs.

 

Drop $10-20 on a BB bock stainless steel?

 

It feels weird dropping what the pen cost on a nib, but in reality, the body of a penbbs pen is damn near comparable to a $200 edison.


Selling a boatload of restored, fairly rare, vintage Japanese gold nib pens, click here to see (more added as I finish restoring them)


#12 by_a_Lady

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Posted 25 October 2019 - 14:35

the nib is like the turntable in your hifi (ok, I'm talking old stuff)

essentially your pen is as good as your nib is...

swapping the nib that you already have to an "inexpensive nib" is not such a good idea...

if you want to improve your experience your move should be "upgrade".

upgrade to a 'good' nib, it does not need to be expensive, but at least steel Jowo, Bock, Schmidt quality

you will feel the difference

in the worst case having a spare Jowo, Bock, Schmidt nib lying around will never be a bad investment

 

Sorry, I don't agree with your argument inasmuch as you're correlating price with quality. However, you do add yourself that a good nib need not be expensive, so I'm not quite sure what your bottom line is.

In my case, I found the Jinhao nibs to be very much to my (personal) taste while they were arming their original pen bodies. Compared to the PenBBS nibs they seemed (again, to me subjectively) to be an upgrade, as you say (and which I heartily agree with). When I tried them they did not fit consistently, unfortunately, but I still consider them to be good nibs in their own right.

 

Honestly, I find the penBBS line to actually be a very worthwhile pen for a "premium" nib upgrade. The fit and finish on their pens is superb and a good nib makes me want to use them all the more. The titanium M in my 355 makes it feel like a $500 pen, and the JoWo PO made by pablo in my 380 spiral is just amazing. I even use the 508/whichever the name for the cheap injection molded vac filler as a base for my custom flex nibs.

 

Drop $10-20 on a BB bock stainless steel?

 

It feels weird dropping what the pen cost on a nib, but in reality, the body of a penbbs pen is damn near comparable to a $200 edison.

 

I absolutely agree. With the super-cheap Wing Sung vacuum fillers that have been coming out recently they did slide into a higher price category by comparison, but when you intend to buy one of them as an alternative to a, say, Pilot Custom 823, then PenBBS definitely comes closer in terms of quality. (The same with the 355 model as a substitute for a Conid.) I'll gladly pay 40€ for a PenBBS in a gorgeous acrylic, even if I have to fiddle around with their nibs.

Admittedly, in recent times I've been a bit put off by PenBBS executive (?) Beini Zheng flaunting her political views on her Instagram account, but that is a whole different bucket of fish. That account has always been a weird blend of personal and business content.

 

 

Dominique


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currently learning EO, JP, NL)


#13 Mech-for-i

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Posted 25 October 2019 - 16:55

I think the answer is quite straight forward , go buy a PenBBS F round grind nib unit instead , too much work that likely aien't going to work since the up turn tip had much of the tipping on the up turned part and grinding likely will create more problem .. its better to just replace the nib / nib unit right out



#14 A Smug Dill

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Posted 25 October 2019 - 22:10

Any suggestions, perhaps? By default I'd go for an inexpensive steel B or even BB - love gushers -, but if there's something more interesting... ?


I prefer ink flow to be controlled and the edges of shapes put down by the nib precise. Not only does wet tend to cause more feathering and bleedthrough, but it also overwhelms an ink's ability to exhibit shading on the page.

Originally, I wanted to put the Nemosine #6 EF, 0.6mm Stub and 0.8mm Stub nibs from my Fission pens -- which I really don't like holding -- in the Lorelei 019 (which is basically the same as a PenBBS 308, but with gold trim and different acrylic colours/patterns) pens I recently bought, but I discovered I can't pull the Lorelei nibs out without crushing the fins on the feeds. I did a search, and saw similar reports with regard to swapping nibs on the PenBBS 308. So for now I don't know how well the Nemosine #6 nibs will fit or work on the Lorelei/PenBBS pens.

However, if you like gushers and don't want ink flow to be controlled and controllable, then don't just look to the nib, but do some tinkering to irreversibly widen the ink channel in the feed.
Let's give each other due respect, and approach discussion rigorously. We're all peers and equals here as fellow hobbyists, with common interests in the acquisition and use of fountain pens, but not necessarily any shared values, and no obligation to offer each other moral support for one's narrative or position.
 

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#15 Honeybadgers

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Posted 26 October 2019 - 00:34

 

Admittedly, in recent times I've been a bit put off by PenBBS executive (?) Beini Zheng flaunting her political views on her Instagram account, but that is a whole different bucket of fish. That account has always been a weird blend of personal and business content.

Dominique

 

I found your problem.

 

You use instagram.


Selling a boatload of restored, fairly rare, vintage Japanese gold nib pens, click here to see (more added as I finish restoring them)


#16 Honeybadgers

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Posted 26 October 2019 - 00:44

I prefer ink flow to be controlled and the edges of shapes put down by the nib precise. Not only does wet tend to cause more feathering and bleedthrough, but it also overwhelms an ink's ability to exhibit shading on the page.

Originally, I wanted to put the Nemosine #6 EF, 0.6mm Stub and 0.8mm Stub nibs from my Fission pens -- which I really don't like holding -- in the Lorelei 019 (which is basically the same as a PenBBS 308, but with gold trim and different acrylic colours/patterns) pens I recently bought, but I discovered I can't pull the Lorelei nibs out without crushing the fins on the feeds. I did a search, and saw similar reports with regard to swapping nibs on the PenBBS 308. So for now I don't know how well the Nemosine #6 nibs will fit or work on the Lorelei/PenBBS pens.

However, if you like gushers and don't want ink flow to be controlled and controllable, then don't just look to the nib, but do some tinkering to irreversibly widen the ink channel in the feed.

 

 

the penbbs nib unit swap requires you grip the nib by its very, very square and hard shoulders and wiggle it as you go. Dunking the whole end in near boiling water for a couple minutes to loosen them up helps too (or heating it with a hair dryer around the section) 

 

It's a little counterintuitive, but holding the nib by the sides with a piece of rubber tube (nib grippers) and just pulling straight and wiggling without touching the feed is the way to go if you get one of the occasional penBBS models with the super sticky feed. After you get the nib out, the feed comes easily (if it doesn't come with the nib) and subsequent removals are easy.


Selling a boatload of restored, fairly rare, vintage Japanese gold nib pens, click here to see (more added as I finish restoring them)




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