Giving It All Up? Will I Regret It?

[sirgilbert357]

My opinion, same as someone else in an earlier reply, is to read Marie Kondo's book. Popular media just reduces her book to "throw everything out." But they neglect an important aspect before throwing said items out: to deal with regret with forgiveness and compassion. Your pens gave you joy, if only for a few moments, and have fulfilled their purpose. That joy is personal to you alone, be it wining the ebay bid, writing with it, gifting it, looking at it, disassembling it, grinding the nib to nothingness, et cetera. With this understanding, thank them for their service and you can let them go.

 

Did you drink any coffee this morning? Well, it's gone now, do you regret it?

 

 

 

 

This "fulfillment of purpose" would have to align with our expectations of said item during the purchasing phase and before receiving it. Some pens I've bought have failed to live up to expectations. One ought to ask if one's own expectations were reasonable or contrived. If you literally buy a pen just to disassemble it and you accomplish that, then yes, I could agree with this characterization. But regret can be driven by a myriad of things or situations that cannot easily be dismissed. And we don't expect everything we own to pass through our lives as quickly as a cup of coffee.

 

Well now I'm genuinely intrigued. How can you show gratitude to the inanimate? Or is this a head game that is knowingly played with the intention of relieving the psychological stress of the regret? I guess I'd need to read this book by Marie Kondo?

 

I'd regret the choice of coffee this morning if it gave me heartburn or tasted terrible. I'd never once think to "thank" the coffee though. It's done nothing of service to or for me of its own free will...

Edited September 16, 2019 by sirgilbert357

[wallylynn]

Conversely, if the pen failed to live up to expectations and is not serving their purpose, then why does one keep it? There should be zero regrets to tossing it.

And we don't expect everything we own to pass through our lives as quickly as a cup of coffee.

Why not? Maybe we should. A hurricane through the Bahamas caused exactly just that, both animate and inanimate.

 

How can you show gratitude to the inanimate?

The same way you show regret towards the inanimate. It's not "How can you", but rather "I do or don't want to".

You call your pen pretty. You call your pen ugly. It's easy. It's also illogical. The pen just looks the way it looks. But you've been taught to put a positive/negative spin on it.

Do you ascribe sentimental value to any of your inanimate posessions? Isn't that illogical? Gratitude is a feeling. Like happy or sad. And that you can have feelings towards said inanimate object.

I'd regret the choice of coffee this morning if it gave me heartburn or tasted terrible. I'd never once think to "thank" the coffee though.

You'd never once think to praise, but denouncing the coffee is acceptable? Why are you saying it tasted terrible? It just tasted the way it tasted. It's inanimate, neither good nor bad. It didn't give you heartburn, it's inanimate, it can't do anything. But you anthropomorphized it without even trying. You can do the same with gratitude. Gratitude is "Thank you for being caffinated."

 

[sirgilbert357]

Conversely, if the pen failed to live up to expectations and is not serving their purpose, then why does one keep it? There should be zero regrets to tossing it.

 

The regret isn't necessarily tied to the action of tossing it -- it could be due to the failure of that object to live up to expectations and the desire to somehow redeem the situation instead of "giving up". I'm not the OP, so I don't know how to best answer that one.

 

Why not? Maybe we should. A hurricane through the Bahamas caused exactly just that, both animate and inanimate.

 

Why *should* we? You don't buy a car expecting to use it for only one day. You don't get a job expecting to work there only 8 hours and you don't buy a house expecting to live there less time than it even takes to move all the way in. This is a ridiculous line of reasoning that doesn't align with our expectations of reality at all. I can't tell if you are serious or just being combative now.

 

 

 

The same way you show regret towards the inanimate. It's not "How can you", but rather "I do or don't want to".

 

The feeling of regret is internal, not something "shown" towards an item.

 

You call your pen pretty. You call your pen ugly. It's easy. It's also illogical. The pen just looks the way it looks. But you've been taught to put a positive/negative spin on it.

 

Yes, we have observations that are subjective in nature. It's not illogical at all. Its quite natural. Even babies have been shown to have a preference for people who are largely deemed "attractive". There is no "taught" here. Same with flavors. I like the taste of coffee, some people don't. I haven't been taught that, I just like it. In your example, the way the pen looks is indeed *just* the way it looks, but those looks have subjective value. This hasn't a thing to do with expressing gratitude to an inanimate object than cannot even receive or acknowledge your expression of emotion.

 

Do you ascribe sentimental value to any of your inanimate posessions? Isn't that illogical? Gratitude is a feeling. Like happy or sad. And that you can have feelings towards said inanimate object.

 

Being sentimental is byproduct of having feelings. How is that illogical? We are humans that have emotions and memories. Sometimes a particular feeling is enjoyable and something that triggers a memory can bring happiness. What would be illogical is denying this is all normal. You're free to define gratitude as a "feeling", but the moment you suggest we should *express it* towards an inanimate object you've moved past just "having a feeling". I can feel great about my new Diplomat Aero and think it is beautiful and a wonderful writer. But to *express* my gratitude for those qualities, I'd have to contact Goulet, who commissioned the color, and tell them how much I like it -- or reach out to Diplomat customer service and write a glowing letter expressing my joy. Just telling the pen "Thanks for being pretty" isn't communicating anything to anyone -- because the pen isn't a "someone", it is a "something". And things are inanimate.

 

 

You'd never once think to praise, but denouncing the coffee is acceptable? Why are you saying it tasted terrible? It just tasted the way it tasted. It's inanimate, neither good nor bad. It didn't give you heartburn, it's inanimate, it can't do anything. But you anthropomorphized it without even trying. You can do the same with gratitude. Gratitude is "Thank you for being caffinated."

 

Who said I'd never once think to praise it? I had an amazing cup of Guatemalan coffee from a roasting studio in downtown Dallas called "Full City Rooster". It was expertly roasted and I thought it was delicious. I told the man, named Michael Wyatt (the owner) as much. Why would I tell the coffee? Michael is the one who roasted the beans, and his talent in doing so is what produced the exceptional flavor. I could go further back and thank the farmers for their work too, but would I walk up to the coffee plant and thank it? That would be silly. If I say the coffee is terrible, that could either be my personal take on it, or there could be another reason (the beans were spoiled or roasted MUCH too long, causing them to taste burnt, which wouldn't be my expectation for the cup of coffee). Inanimate things certainly can *cause* things. If you mix ammonia and bleach and inhale the vapors, you'll die. That's called cause and effect, and the chemical caused your death. I think you are confusing cause with agency - or free will. I don't think we're going to get anywhere here and this has already derailed the thread enough. I'll let you have the last reply here. Others can judge for themselves what sounds most logical...

 

[Tonhao5]

I've been writing down parts of Marcus Aurelius lately and he certainly has lots to say about personal possessions...

 

I am definitely in the user camp and what I am not using has little value to me. I find that setting a hard limit by buying a case/container helps. Because I have a 5-watch roll and a 5-pen case, those keep me from impulsive purchases because a new pen or watch cannot be stored properly.

 

It goes without saying that this only works if you vow not to buy a bigger container...

[wallylynn]

 

Why *should* we? You don't buy a car expecting to use it for only one day.

some old saying : hope for the best, prepare for the worst. Eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow we die. It's not an expectation that some tragedy will happen, but that some tragedy can happen. The ancient Greco-Romans can answer more clearly than I can. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memento_mori

[wallylynn]

"Thanks for being pretty" isn't communicating anything to anyone -- because the pen isn't a "someone", it is a "something". And things are inanimate.

That doesn't mean you can't do it. You just don't want to. Hang out with some kids. They talk with inanimate objects all the time.

There's no logic in any of this. It's all subjective and arbitrary. Trying to to find logic is a fools errand.

[sirgilbert357]

That doesn't mean you can't do it. You just don't want to. Hang out with some kids. They talk with inanimate objects all the time.

There's no logic in any of this. It's all subjective and arbitrary. Trying to to find logic is a fools errand.

 

We weren't talking about what you "can" do. You're changing the direction/subject of the conversation. I can do all kinds of ridiculous things that have literally zero worth or accomplish nothing. I could jump off a bridge screaming to the onlookers that "Gravity ain't gonna get me down!!!"

 

I just don't "want" to??? Is that a thinly veiled ad hominem or something?

 

I have three kids under the age of 9, I know full well what kids do. Don't assume you know me or how I spend my time.

 

Thank goodness mathematicians and scientists the world over and all throughout history have disagreed with your statement that finding logic is a fools errand. How foolish of them to pursue things that help make more sense of the world and explain the reality that we live in.

 

Since you don't "get" logic, it's clear we are done here. Goodbye.

[sirgilbert357]

I've been writing down parts of Marcus Aurelius lately and he certainly has lots to say about personal possessions...

 

I am definitely in the user camp and what I am not using has little value to me. I find that setting a hard limit by buying a case/container helps. Because I have a 5-watch roll and a 5-pen case, those keep me from impulsive purchases because a new pen or watch cannot be stored properly.

 

It goes without saying that this only works if you vow not to buy a bigger container...

 

Heh...I was into watches pretty bad for awhile. I went from an 8 slot watchbox to a 4 slot watchbox, then to a 10 slot (plus the 4 slot) watchbox...finally, something changed and now the 4 slot box sits empty and the 10 slot box only has 6 in it.

 

I should sell the 10 slot box and just use the 4 slot. The remaining watches sitting around outside the box might bug me enough that I sell them off -- which would mean more pen money!

[wallylynn]

 

We weren't talking about what you "can" do.

 

Well now I'm genuinely intrigued. How can you show gratitude to the inanimate?

 

I now realize those were rhetorical questions. My bad.

[Arkanabar]

If I may get all Catholic on y'all, you show your gratitude to God for the inanimate thing, as this whole world -- life, the universe, and everything -- is His gift to us.

 

IIRC, the original question was, "Do any of you have regrets over selling pens? And after paring down, did you wind up building back up again?"

 

Now, I've never sold any of my pens (except some Heros out of a 10-pack of 616s my wife gave me), but some have been lost, and others given away. I have reached a place of contentment with the pens I now have. One of the pens I'd given away was a Waterman Phileas, and when I saw one being PIFfed, I asked for and got it. And I asked for and got a Jinhao X750 from the Pay It Forward forum, a few years after my own fell apart. And I occasionally wonder what happened to my Mandarin Yellow Ahab, which wrote well, even though I can't write comfortably with an Ahab. But at this time I have no expectation of building up my collection, and really only minimal expectations of paring it down.

[challer61]

You will not regret it. An idle collection in a box is joyless. Now, if you were an active trader, that's different. I went from 30 high to eight (4 Canid Bulkfiller, 2 Aurora Optima, 2 Sailor 1911 Full) and looking to down size even further. I have six "travel" pens that I also put to use. Much happier with a lightened load. Also down to three inks.

[Tseg]

Good luck figuring it all out. I went down the camera equipment rabbit hole first, then watches, then vacuums, then pens, then knives.... I’ve not sold any pens but keep my dozen best inked all the time, write with some of them nearly daily, but have not bought a new one in what may be a year. My out-of-favor pens are all <$75 each and just see it as a hassle trying to sell them off for pennies on the dollar.

 

The nice result is I have an appreciation for a number of hobbies and have some nice samples and memories from each hobby, I’m glad I’ve not “gotten out” of any hobby and sold everything off. I definitely revisit each periodically. I think the photography equipment hobby depreciates most since it is so technology driven, yet my decade old equipment still takes beautiful pictures, only I can’t transfer them to someone else on the spot like can be done with newer cameras.

 

I did consolidate watches and camera equipment to the ones I use the most.

[sirgilbert357]

Good luck figuring it all out. I went down the camera equipment rabbit hole first, then watches, then vacuums, then pens, then knives.... I’ve not sold any pens but keep my dozen best inked all the time, write with some of them nearly daily, but have not bought a new one in what may be a year. My out-of-favor pens are all <$75 each and just see it as a hassle trying to sell them off for pennies on the dollar.

 

The nice result is I have an appreciation for a number of hobbies and have some nice samples and memories from each hobby, I’m glad I’ve not “gotten out” of any hobby and sold everything off. I definitely revisit each periodically. I think the photography equipment hobby depreciates most since it is so technology driven, yet my decade old equipment still takes beautiful pictures, only I can’t transfer them to someone else on the spot like can be done with newer cameras.

 

I did consolidate watches and camera equipment to the ones I use the most.

 

 

I've been down the camera equipment, watches and knives rabbit holes -- all of them. Ugh. Don't even get me started on car mods and motorcycles. Pens as a "hobby" is, by comparison, less stressful, less cost to maintain, and far less deadly (thinking specifically of motorcycles, lol) than my other past hobbies. Oh, forgot remote control helicopters...yeah, those are ridiculous. Extremely difficult to fly well and crashes are expensive...

[sirgilbert357]

You will not regret it. An idle collection in a box is joyless. Now, if you were an active trader, that's different. I went from 30 high to eight (4 Canid Bulkfiller, 2 Aurora Optima, 2 Sailor 1911 Full) and looking to down size even further. I have six "travel" pens that I also put to use. Much happier with a lightened load. Also down to three inks.

 

It seems like folks with Conids are quite content to have fewer pens. I wonder if there's a correlation there? Like, the Conid is just so good that it quenches the thirst for more pens? If that's an actual thing, then I need a Conid, lol.

[como]

Well I think Conid naturally attracts engineer- and minimalist- minded people. This type may not want a lot of pens to begin with. Others, like myself, bought a Conid or two to add to their collection because of its uniqueness and don’t necessarily care to permanently reduce number of their pens.

It seems like folks with Conids are quite content to have fewer pens. I wonder if there's a correlation there? Like, the Conid is just so good that it quenches the thirst for more pens? If that's an actual thing, then I need a Conid, lol.

[noddle]

 

It seems like folks with Conids are quite content to have fewer pens. I wonder if there's a correlation there? Like, the Conid is just so good that it quenches the thirst for more pens? If that's an actual thing, then I need a Conid, lol.

 

The 'Conid Supremacy' may be a thing. After a lot of buying and selling I now have just the two Conid Kingsizes; they're all the pen I need. Great size, comfort, engineering, can switch nibs easily, disassemble for easy home maintenance, large ink capacity... I never get tired of using them and I don't thirst for any more pens - not even another Conid (unless Francis makes one in Arco Green ). I have a streamline version which I use with KWZ Dark Brown ink for most of my writing, and a flat top version with three different inks for editing and note taking.

[como]

noddle: I've always said that it was incredible thing that you did, finally keeping just two pens. I've occasionally thought about if I would ever end up doing the same. I can't imagine it, at least not yet. It would mean that I would have to give up all the beautiful Italian celluloids, all the iconic models, all the unique and intriguing... And I thought about why you picked Conid out of all the pens in the world. Come to think of it, Conid is kind of a mental disconnect from all other pens. It's not directly competing in the classic (MB 149 etc), or in the beautiful (Omas Arco etc), and whatever else. It is cleanness. Among all the benefits and pains of this hobby, cleanness in all aspects is just what we need sometimes, a break. I still can't abandon all for this feeling alone as I do enjoy the many facets of pen using and collecting.

 

Though I must say that are you sure about getting a Conid in Arco Verde? Seems to me a slippery slope down the rabbit hole. And how about an Arco Brown, Burkina, Pearl Grey... The list is long Maybe you will climb back up again? Anyway, congrats!

 

The 'Conid Supremacy' may be a thing. After a lot of buying and selling I now have just the two Conid Kingsizes; they're all the pen I need. Great size, comfort, engineering, can switch nibs easily, disassemble for easy home maintenance, large ink capacity... I never get tired of using them and I don't thirst for any more pens - not even another Conid (unless Francis makes one in Arco Green ). I have a streamline version which I use with KWZ Dark Brown ink for most of my writing, and a flat top version with three different inks for editing and note taking.

[sirgilbert357]

Well I think Conid naturally attracts engineer- and minimalist- minded people. This type may not want a lot of pens to begin with. Others, like myself, bought a Conid or two to add to their collection because of its uniqueness and don’t necessarily care to permanently reduce number of their pens.

 

 

A good observation. The engineering of the pen is one thing that makes Conids so attractive to me. I could see this kind of pen appealing to a different kind of pen enthusiast.

[sirgilbert357]

 

The 'Conid Supremacy' may be a thing. After a lot of buying and selling I now have just the two Conid Kingsizes; they're all the pen I need. Great size, comfort, engineering, can switch nibs easily, disassemble for easy home maintenance, large ink capacity... I never get tired of using them and I don't thirst for any more pens - not even another Conid (unless Francis makes one in Arco Green ). I have a streamline version which I use with KWZ Dark Brown ink for most of my writing, and a flat top version with three different inks for editing and note taking.

 

I LOVE the look of that flat top version. I wish I had your mindset. I think it would be liberating to have only 2 pens, but at this point, I don't think I can go back. I have 12 total (but three of them don't "count" because they are cheap Wing Sungs, lol) with two Nemosine Singularity pens on the way (supposedly anyway...never got the tracking number email, hmmm). And I have plans to buy at least two more now.

 

I love and write with all of them, sometimes every pen in a single day. I think a mini consolidation is in my future, but it will probably only affect the "cheap" pens.

[A Smug Dill]

I think it would be liberating to have only 2 pens, but at this point, I don't think I can go back.

I cannot even begin to imagine that.

 

If we lived in a different period and place, and folks had to live or die by their 'tools', then it would make sense to have a primary set of trusted tools with which one can count on knowing like the back of his hand, and through their use nearly every day one would be aware of every nuance and every change that is developing over time; that is of critical importance to one's survival.

 

Even so, while one may have his trusty katana and wakizashi, or spear and shield, or set of kitchen knives, it is still beneficial to be able to operate competently with other similar tools in a pinch — tools which may vary in length, weight, balance, curvature, material and so on, or simply be functional alternatives that look nothing like what one prefers to use. That takes training (oneself, as the case may be) on a variety of tools, and in the absence of a school or a library from which one can just borrow from a selection of different tools when required, acquiring and keeping multiple sets of tools — some of which one would seldom use in core everyday applications — is not in itself a bad idea if one can afford it.

Edited September 18, 2019 by A Smug Dill