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Nine Pigment Inks Tested For Waterproofness

sailor platinum pelikan waterproof water resistant

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29 replies to this topic

#1 A Smug Dill

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Posted 11 August 2019 - 05:41

Given the assertion often made by others that Sailor kiwaguro pigment ink is (totally, utterly, 100%, or some other adjective meaning absolutely) waterproof, which I know is not factually true, and the assertion I've often made about Sailor souboku and seiboku being completely waterproof (which I now know is also not factually true), I decided to put the nine pigment inks I have to the test. They are:

  • Pelikan Fount India black ink
  • Platinum Black Carbon Ink
  • Platinum Brun Sepia Pigment Ink
  • Sailor kiwaguro black ink
  • Sailor souboku blue-black ink
  • Sailor seiboku blue-black ink
  • Sailor STORiA Night Blue ink
  • Sailor STORiA Magic Purple ink
  • Sailor STORiA Lion Light Brown ink

fpn_1565500659__nine_pigment_inks_put_to

These inks shed colour observably while the page was being soaked in a bath of clean water:

fpn_1565500640__these_pigment_inks_shed_

and this photo of the page after drying attests that the three blue-black and blue inks are in fact not completely waterproof, even though they fared much better Pelikan Fount India and Sailor kiwaguro:

fpn_1565500621__blue_pigment_inks_on_pag

Out of the black inks, only Platinum Black Carbon Ink is completely waterproof. I cannot see any colour come off either Sailor STORiA Lion Light Brown or Platinum Brun Sepia Pigment Ink with my naked eye during or after soaking, and it may take a new test with a full page of writing with one of those inks individually for me to know for sure, but for now I'll also assume that they're completely waterproof.

Of course, writing in all of the pigment inks tested remained very legible. Here's the full page after drying. (Click to bring up a larger image.)

fpn_1565500605__pigment_inks_on_page_aft


Let's give each other due respect, and approach discussion rigorously. We're all peers and equals here as fellow hobbyists, with common interests in the acquisition and use of fountain pens, but not necessarily any shared values, and no obligation to offer each other moral support for one's narrative or position.
 

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#2 Billy1878

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Posted 11 August 2019 - 07:24

Thank you for your time and trouble.
I'm just starting my pen collection and ink is next on the list.
I will need to use waterproof inks for work purposes.

#3 Bobje

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Posted 11 August 2019 - 10:52

Impressive testing and results. Thank you for this research. I would have never expected a color like Sailor magic purple to perform so well.

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#4 peroride

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 05:38

Thank you @A Smug Dill  :thumbup: awesome work and appreciative of your testing method, looks like all the inks got a fair shake. Now I just have to figure out what pen to dedicate to Platinum Carbon Black



#5 A Smug Dill

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 08:36

Thank you @A Smug Dill


You're quite welcome.
 

Now I just have to figure out what pen to dedicate to Platinum Carbon Black


It lives permanently in my gunmetal Platinum Plaisir (with a 02/EF nib swapped over from a Preppy), but (even so) writes rather too broadly for my taste, such is the characteristic of that ink. However, I really love how it writes in my (¥100,000!) Pilot 'Hannya Shingyo' — which is arguably my most loved fountain pen out of 200 or so — so perhaps foolishly I also keep that pen continuously inked with Platinum Black Carbon ink. It hasn't caused any trouble yet, and I haven't actually flushed that pen in several months since first trying out that combination of pen and ink.


Let's give each other due respect, and approach discussion rigorously. We're all peers and equals here as fellow hobbyists, with common interests in the acquisition and use of fountain pens, but not necessarily any shared values, and no obligation to offer each other moral support for one's narrative or position.
 

Don't think 'cos I understand, I care
Don't think 'cos I'm talking, we're friends

—'6 Underground' by Sneaker Pimps


#6 Tas

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 09:25

I need another black like aother verrucca. Thanks to you, Platinum Carbon Black is now calling out like a siren for me . . . B)

Excellent comparison.

(Sou Boku on my Mnemosyne Word Cards has shown me it is absolutely waterproof so am guessing as always there is a paper ink factor to take into consideration)



#7 A Smug Dill

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 10:12

Sou Boku on my Mnemosyne Word Cards has shown me it is absolutely waterproof

 
I always thought it was, too, but then I admit I didn't look that closely ever. After all, if even the sheen component survived a sixty-minute bath, why would I question the ink's waterproofness? However, this time I did see the slightest wist of colour come off the page after about ten minutes' soaking, and I believe the point of participation of on FPN (or any other online discussion forum) is not to build credibility or "save face", but simply tell it like it is as I've observed it (preferably in a repeatable and falsifiable manner), and point out a mistaken assumption or conclusion whenever I see one, whether it was me or someone else who made that statement or claim in the first place. (My feelings and my community standing are not of concern or something to be protected — and neither is anyone else's — in the context of open discussion with faceless strangers.)


Let's give each other due respect, and approach discussion rigorously. We're all peers and equals here as fellow hobbyists, with common interests in the acquisition and use of fountain pens, but not necessarily any shared values, and no obligation to offer each other moral support for one's narrative or position.
 

Don't think 'cos I understand, I care
Don't think 'cos I'm talking, we're friends

—'6 Underground' by Sneaker Pimps


#8 Tas

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 13:07

 
I always thought it was, too, but then I admit I didn't look that closely ever. After all, if even the sheen component survived a sixty-minute bath, why would I question the ink's waterproofness? However, this time I did see the slightest wist of colour come off the page after about ten minutes' soaking, and I believe the point of participation of on FPN (or any other online discussion forum) is not to build credibility or "save face", but simply tell it like it is as I've observed it (preferably in a repeatable and falsifiable manner), and point out a mistaken assumption or conclusion whenever I see one, whether it was me or someone else who made that statement or claim in the first place. (My feelings and my community standing are not of concern or something to be protected — and neither is anyone else's — in the context of open discussion with faceless strangers.)

 

Well said.

(I've been scribbling Sou Boku vases on all kinds of paper this morning and then washing over it with a water brush. Some hold it well, none, apart form the Mnemosyne Word cards, hold it completely - your findings I would say are accurate)



#9 Lgsoltek

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 13:39

 

Well said.

(I've been scribbling Sou Boku vases on all kinds of paper this morning and then washing over it with a water brush. Some hold it well, none, apart form the Mnemosyne Word cards, hold it completely - your findings I would say are accurate)

 

So will you be showing us your famous vases?



#10 Tas

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 13:43

 

So will you be showing us your famous vases?

 

No. :unsure:

They're the ones on top of all my swatches:

fpn_sailor_souboku_swatch.jpeg

Note no budge from the ink when washed over on wither vase or rectangle on the Mnemosyne Word Cards by maruman



#11 Lgsoltek

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 13:50

 

No. :unsure:

They're the ones on top of all my swatches:

fpn_sailor_souboku_swatch.jpeg

Note no budge from the ink when washed over on wither vase or rectangle on the Mnemosyne Word Cards by maruman

 

 

:wub:  I've heard you sing the praises of Sou-Boku so many times. I can't wait to try mine. (I've had it for months but it's in my stash in another country...)



#12 Tas

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 14:02

Happy to send a sample to your current location.
Let me know.
🤗

#13 Lgsoltek

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 15:37

Happy to send a sample to your current location.
Let me know.

 

Nah, that's okay. I can be patient.  :)



#14 inkstainedruth

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Posted 13 August 2019 - 16:15

Thanks for doing the comparison, A Smug Dill.  Very informative.  I have a bottle of the Pelikan Fount India but haven't tried it.  I have recently gotten a bottle of Sailor Souboku, after trying a sample, and found it waterproof enough for my purposes.

I had been curious about the Sailor Storia inks, but didn't like a lot of the colors; I was hesitant to try them after my experience with trying to use Kiwa-guro in a Preppy set up as a rollerball a few years ago (I got very bad flow; it may do better in a regular fountain pen, but I was doing an experiment with various black inks in rollerballs in humid conditions on bad paper a few years ago, for stuff like smudging, erasability (inking over pencil drawings) and how well the ink took whiteout).

Have not tried the other inks in your comparison either.  I don't use black inks enough to getting a bottle of the Carbon Black (Noodler's Heart of Darkness being good enough for my purposes) but I can see that if I was doing a lot of archival drawing it would have its uses.

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#15 Bobje

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 01:52

“I believe the point of participation of on FPN (or any other online discussion forum) is not to build credibility or "save face", but simply tell it like it is ... “

Building credibility, definitely. A labor- and skill-intensive test of nine waterproof inks like yours does tend to do something like building credibility. Thank you, Dill, for this research.

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CHINA, JAPAN, AND INDIA

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#16 5Cavaliers

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 02:32

Thank you so much for the effort and time that you put into this!  I really appreciate the approach that you took.  I have been considering Souboku for some time, but haven't.  I am having trouble justifying another ink when I have so much.  

 

This may not be relevant, but how long did you let the ink dry before immersing in water?  


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#17 A Smug Dill

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 04:42

This may not be relevant, but how long did you let the ink dry before immersing in water?


It is a good question, and in fact one I did consider relevant at the time of the test. I waited roughly half an hour after the last pieces of writing was done on the page. No idea about the ambient temperature or humidity in my 'study' on that afternoon, though.

It's easy to make a loose assessment of whether ink has 'dried' on the page by a quick rub with one's finger, but in terms of whether the ink has had sufficient time to react with the paper to form the most permanent chemical bond they could possibly achieve, I wouldn't have the first clue; it probably wouldn't model any user story (and mishap) I have in mind anyway.

Context:while writing on the page with inkreviewing written content some days, weeks, months or years later
unintentional contact with a nominally dry and clean skin
unintentional contact with a wet finger
'wet' sneeze (or mist from ocean breeze falling) on page
light rain falling on page
spilling beverage on page
long soaking in a large body of water following a maritime disaster

N/A


Let's give each other due respect, and approach discussion rigorously. We're all peers and equals here as fellow hobbyists, with common interests in the acquisition and use of fountain pens, but not necessarily any shared values, and no obligation to offer each other moral support for one's narrative or position.
 

Don't think 'cos I understand, I care
Don't think 'cos I'm talking, we're friends

—'6 Underground' by Sneaker Pimps


#18 A Smug Dill

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 04:43

A labor- and skill-intensive test of nine waterproof inks like yours does tend to do something like building credibility. Thank you, Dill, for this research.


Thank you very much for your kind words!
Let's give each other due respect, and approach discussion rigorously. We're all peers and equals here as fellow hobbyists, with common interests in the acquisition and use of fountain pens, but not necessarily any shared values, and no obligation to offer each other moral support for one's narrative or position.
 

Don't think 'cos I understand, I care
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—'6 Underground' by Sneaker Pimps


#19 migo984

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Posted 15 August 2019 - 05:35

When sketching with fountain pens, at home or en plein air, I use nothing but Carbon Black. It is the only black ink I’ve used that never budges when used on watercolour paper (cotton or wood pulp), washed over with paint.
(Overall I still prefer the pigment ink in Pigma Micron pens though......).

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#20 Chaos-incarnate

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 10:46

The only other totally waterproof ink I've used is DeAtrementis document black, however I've only tested that with drops of water and under multiple layers of watercolour washes. I haven't soaked it.
What kind of paper did you use? And you soaked it about ten minutes? I could replicate to test it for sure.





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