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Rohrer & Klingner Dokumentus Schwarz Handwritten Review

rohrer & klingner black archival waterproof

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#1 Enkida

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 11:54

This is my first review here.  It was also unplanned, I just wanted to make a scan for another thread I was replying to, and it exploded into this handwritten review.  Which is admittedly not the best, but I hope it is helpful to somebody at least because damn, it took a long time to scan in and resize all my pigeon scratch.

 

There are scans, there are potato camera photos.  I didn't bother with photographing all the pages I wrote because I think you guys can get the idea of what my terrible camera can bring across, and the scans are more readable.  No colour adjustments anywhere for anything whatsoever.  I bought this ink to do watercolour drawings and fill out my tax forms, and it's serving its purpose well so far.  It does smell rather strongly of "chemicals" when you open the bottle, not in the rotting way, just in the "don't sniff the glue, kids, it's bad for your brain" way.  Obviously I have no idea what I am doing here.  Enjoy!

 

Oxford Optik Paper.  Left: scan, Right: photo

 

RK-black1.jpg

 

 

"Conceptum" notebook paper, AKA the cheap stuff that doesn't like fountain pens.  Front and back.  Front edited because of a very lazy token desire for privacy.

 

RK-black2.jpg

 

 

 

Everything else is Leuchtturm paper.  Water test with actual beads of water on the paper:
 

RK-black-watertest.jpg

 

 

 

Left scan, right photo.  This is POST water-test.

RK-black3.jpg

 

Left: back of page above, right, start of mandatory review topics:

 

RK-black4.jpg

 

RK-black5.jpg

 

RK-black6.jpg

 

Poor quality nib creep picture, but the creep is bad enough that you can still see it anyhow:

 

RK-black7.jpg

 

 bottle pic from Seitz Kreuznach:

 

IMG-2141b.JPG

 

 

That's all she wrote!

 

EDIT:  Very important caveat:  I have never left this ink in my pen long enough to see what the long-term effects might be (long enough, like, "overnight".)  There are warnings all over the label to not let this ink dry out in your pen, so I usually ink it up for a targetted use, write a little afterwards (like this review), then de-ink the pen because I'm done with it.


Edited by Enkida, 06 June 2019 - 14:06.

sig2.jpgsig1.jpg

 

Events may be horrible or inescapable. Men always have a choice - if not whether, then how they endure.

- Lois McMaster Bujold


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#2 sakib

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 12:24

Was looking for a review of this ink specially on cheap paper. Terrific review.can u compare it's performance with kiwa guro. Thanks again.

Edited by sakib, 06 June 2019 - 12:24.


#3 Enkida

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 12:32

Sorry, I don't own Kiwa Guro!  It does seem to perform pretty well on cheap paper, though the ink spreads a lot.  It's because it gushes out of the pen so wetly, not really because I noticed any feathering, though.  On absorbant cheap paper shown above, it turns a bit grey and ghosts, but it didn't bleed through.

 

This is definitely not my favourite ink (too wet), but it seems to get the job done if you need to do your taxes or sign your bank forms or whatnot.

 

Also, one further pic from a flex pen (FPR Himalaya Ultra Flex) when it was gushing out of the pen, on Leuchtturm.  Left is Diamine Eclipse, right is R&K Documentus Black, but the Diamine Eclipse side is also the "back side" of more flex writing with Documentus Black, so you can see the bleed-through when using a gushing flex pen.

 

documentus-b.jpg


sig2.jpgsig1.jpg

 

Events may be horrible or inescapable. Men always have a choice - if not whether, then how they endure.

- Lois McMaster Bujold


#4 Sailor Kenshin

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 14:51

Excellent review. Enjoyed looking at it for the writing and sketches and comparisons.

#5 TSherbs

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 16:40

Awesome review, thanks. Not an ink I am interested in, but thank you for
"documenting" your experience. :)

#6 lapis

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 19:03

Nice review and keep up the good work for all up and coming jobs!

It looks like it is waterproof but the smearing (even prior to the water test) due to the highlighting seems to indicate that it's not highlighter-smearproof. Or... ?


Life is too short to drink bad wine (Goethe)


#7 Enkida

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 19:05

More than normal inks but not highlighter fool proof, I'd say.  You can give it one quick pass and still read your stuff, but if you go over it multiple times (like I started to do with the box bit) you start to see ink lifting up and colouring your highlighter tip, too.


sig2.jpgsig1.jpg

 

Events may be horrible or inescapable. Men always have a choice - if not whether, then how they endure.

- Lois McMaster Bujold


#8 Tas

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 19:05

So pleased to see first reviews, especially one of this calibre. Thank you for taking the time to share your findings. We look forward to more soon.
🤗

#9 MsRedpen

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 19:14

Super informative and super fun review to read! Thank you :)

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#10 sakib

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 19:26

Sorry, I don't own Kiwa Guro!  It does seem to perform pretty well on cheap paper, though the ink spreads a lot.  It's because it gushes out of the pen so wetly, not really because I noticed any feathering, though.  On absorbant cheap paper shown above, it turns a bit grey and ghosts, but it didn't bleed through.
 
This is definitely not my favourite ink (too wet), but it seems to get the job done if you need to do your taxes or sign your bank forms or whatnot.
 
Also, one further pic from a flex pen (FPR Himalaya Ultra Flex) when it was gushing out of the pen, on Leuchtturm.  Left is Diamine Eclipse, right is R&K Documentus Black, but the Diamine Eclipse side is also the "back side" of more flex writing with Documentus Black, so you can see the bleed-through when using a gushing flex pen.
 
documentus-b.jpg



#11 sakib

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 19:29

Thank you for such an in depth reply.Kiwa guro is my go to as I have to use cheap paper a lot. Was looking for cheaper alternative so that it lasts longer

#12 inkstainedruth

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 19:33

Thanks for the review.  

I haven't tried this because for my purposes Noodler's HoD is permanent enough (and I don't use black inks much anyway) but I did like Documentus Helblau enough get a full bottle of that.


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#13 lapis

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Posted 06 June 2019 - 19:37

... Was looking for cheaper alternative so that it lasts longer

 

... I'd say you should be looking for an unbelievably  expensive  alternative so that it lasts longer (unused in the bottle)....

 

har, har


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#14 sakib

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 02:49

 
... I'd say you should be looking for an unbelievably  expensive  alternative so that it lasts longer (unused in the bottle)....
 
har, har



#15 sakib

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 02:51

Ha ha.
I just wish black inks would just be that- BLACK. Unlike most, I love black inks as weird as that may sound. Still searching for that all time fav- kiwa guro is the closest so far.

#16 Enkida

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 06:21

One more pic for you guys:  while I may be paranoid enough to clean my pens out of this ink immediately, not so with my converters.  This is a picture of the converter I emptied, but did not thoroughly clean, after I left it sitting overnight with a load of tap water, just to make sure nothing dried out inside.  Definitely a pigment ink, I'd be leery of letting this sit in any pen you couldn't fully (easily) disassemble to clean, like a Lamy Safari.

 

documentus-converter.jpg


sig2.jpgsig1.jpg

 

Events may be horrible or inescapable. Men always have a choice - if not whether, then how they endure.

- Lois McMaster Bujold


#17 Eclipse157

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 08:10

Thanks for your very nice review! I love your handwriting btw :) keep 'em coming!



#18 A Smug Dill

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 07:54

Fantastic review! Thanks for all the work you've put into it.
A discussion about objects, techniques and applications should not be a contest of personal values. Your values mean nothing to me and require naught from me, and I'll gladly assume my values equally mean nothing to you and do not impose on you in any way; my dissenting views do not oppress your personal views, when neither of us can claim to represent the majority position or consensus, or speak on behalf of the community of fountain pen hobbyists worldwide. Let's treat each other with due respect prescribed by some entity bigger than either of us without our input and just offer our sentimental opinions of no particular standing with anyone else, without trying to control the narrative, or demand moral support and/or solidarity from others as consumers and users.

#19 Enkida

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 09:22

Thanks all!  Another image I dug up while scanning stuff - sketch I made with the dregs in my pen on Clairfontaine paper.  When it started to run out I dipped the nib in water, so there were some parts that greyed out (the text "are complicated dogs" as an example), but in general, this ink looked not very trueblack and more grey soft charcoal.  It only looks dark here because I fixed the levels for posting the image elsewhere.   So for you clairefontaine users, this is not a dark black ink, sorry!

 

schipperkes.jpg


sig2.jpgsig1.jpg

 

Events may be horrible or inescapable. Men always have a choice - if not whether, then how they endure.

- Lois McMaster Bujold


#20 Enkida

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Posted 26 June 2019 - 09:30

Just popping back in to say I have significantly downgraded my opinion of this ink because it is so incredibly hard to clean out of fountain pens that you can't disassemble.  I used it in a cheap little Online Campus II F-nibbed fountain pen with no problems and certainly didn't let it dry out, but 2 days later in a water soak it's not only still ejecting black ink, the particles that came out of the pen formed an outline on the border of the water and the glass jar that I could only remove by extreme scrubbing with a rough brush / my fingernails.

If that's what it did to a large dilution in water to a glass jar, I can only imagine what it did to the feed of my pen!

 

If you're ok with using dip pens, this ink is still very good, but at that point, my question is "why not just use india ink!"  right?


sig2.jpgsig1.jpg

 

Events may be horrible or inescapable. Men always have a choice - if not whether, then how they endure.

- Lois McMaster Bujold






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