I've Had It With Coated Paper. Alternatives?

[TheDutchGuy]

They didn't have coated paper in 1959 (or did they?) so what _did_ folks use back then? The coating bothers me sometimes. Quite a few modern pens have nibs so smooth that coated paper may lead to occasional skipping, especially if you don't put something under your hand when writing (which is a bother). And it doesn't always feel right. I prefer the texture of normal paper.

 

Yesterday I was in a hotel and there's always some paper in hotel rooms. This paper was quite good. It was uncoated, so the paper absorbed the ink. This led to a certain increase in line width (i.e. spread) bit not to feathering. There was no show- or bleedthrough, nothing. Worked great with a few different F or EF nibs. I loved the old-school texture of this paper under the nib.

 

So, are there alternatives to coated paper? Just good, old-fashioned paper that doesn't cost an arm and a leg? So far the only thing I've found is Belgian company Brepols, who makes a really good faux-leather bound A5 journal that sells for appr. 10 euros. While that's twice the cost of Oxford, it sure is nice paper.

 

Any suggestions? Price and availability info would also be appreciated. Thanx!

[OCArt]

1959 certainly wasn't the dark ages and coated papers were around. What was different is that most of the writing and school papers then sold were fp friendly although I'm not sure what ingredient was present that is missing today.

[Tweel]

If you were in the U.S. and looking for loose-leaf paper, I'd suggest Strathmore Writing, a very nice 25% cotton paper that's probably just what you're looking for. It has a wove finish that's definitely not coated -- it's somewhat absorbent, so you won't get much shading, but it doesn't feather or bleed. I found Google results somewhat confusing, but Strathmore may sell that paper, or something similar, bound into A5 journals in the E.U.

 

OCArt, the missing ingredient may be alum-rosin sizing, which is good sizing but makes the paper acidic and accelerates its breakdown. It used to be widely used, but was phased out in the 1980s.

[rafapa]

They didn't have coated paper in 1959 (or did they?) so what _did_ folks use back then? The coating bothers me sometimes. Quite a few modern pens have nibs so smooth that coated paper may lead to occasional skipping, especially if you don't put something under your hand when writing (which is a bother). And it doesn't always feel right. I prefer the texture of normal paper.

 

Yesterday I was in a hotel and there's always some paper in hotel rooms. This paper was quite good. It was uncoated, so the paper absorbed the ink. This led to a certain increase in line width (i.e. spread) bit not to feathering. There was no show- or bleedthrough, nothing. Worked great with a few different F or EF nibs. I loved the old-school texture of this paper under the nib.

 

So, are there alternatives to coated paper? Just good, old-fashioned paper that doesn't cost an arm and a leg? So far the only thing I've found is Belgian company Brepols, who makes a really good faux-leather bound A5 journal that sells for appr. 10 euros. While that's twice the cost of Oxford, it sure is nice paper.

 

Any suggestions? Price and availability info would also be appreciated. Thanx!

I have good experiences with Clairefontaine Dune. I have tried the 80gsm and 100gsm.

[TheDutchGuy]

Thanks for the suggestions!

[gmax]

Monokaki, Midori and Smythson papers all offer a pleasant writing experience, with just a whisper of tactile "tooth" under the nib, zero line spread, and zero feathering

[OMASsimo]

The making of paper is a complex process involving a lot of chemistry and mechanics. You cannot single out just one factor that makes a paper more or less FP friendly. The coating is only one of many aspects and it has been around for a long time, much longer than just 1959. Other factors are fiber composition, bonding, sizing, pressing, fillers, brighteners, stabilizers, and buffers. In my experience it's pretty much a toss up whether a paper is FP friendly or not because this aspect is mostly negligible in the product design nowadays. I think this is the only relevant difference to paper production 60 years ago. Well, there probably is one more aspect to it. Many vintage papers were not acid free and thus deteriorate over time. Today, most quality papers do not have the same problem except cheap recycling paper.

[Honeybadgers]

One thing to consider is blank pages often lack that extra coating that I find causes the skippiness. A Rhodia dot pad feels a lot more slippery from a blank pad. I am actually really starting to get into blank pages.

 

But cotton added paper tends to be more resiliant.

[Bo Bo Olson]

About 1980''s The Golden Age of Paper ....died. I was there for the funeral and didn't know!!!!

Golden age of Fountain pen @ 1970.....I had a single pen....why have two?

We are living in the Golden Age of Inks.

 

Typewriter paper is only coated/sized on the front side....in they were saving money even then, and now. M&K makes a nice 95g typewriter paper...the other two M&K's are also good.

Most paper has.had a A and B side.

 

I always had a bit of the better paper stuck away....I didn't use Zander's Bankpost/bond paper for my daisy wheel printer. It was too good....for in case I ever wrote a letter, which I didn't.

Stuck in the middle of some 3-4 inches of papers along with some Easton's Corrosable 16 pound 25 % rag paper, was the remains of a cheap paper pad from when I was a ball point barbarian and would never have dreamed of wasting beer money on paper.

Perfect paper. 12 sheets............now only 8.

No watermark so I'll never know who made it and where to get its cousin.

 

Many posters recommend buying all the old paper on your local Ebay....stuff that is '80's and before.

 

I don't understand the problem with a coated or sized sheet of paper....that's what I'm supposed to be looking for...from some of my reading.

 

M&K a once stand alone brand mark is made by Brunnier....the only paper they make that's worth a dam.

Rossiler is also not good..............the 100g 100% cotton is sinfully good to write on......but feathers a lot....has bead through ....and Lesser Rosslier is also not worth buying. My B&M once carried lots of Rossler paper, so I was able to try it out for E 0.75/85 a sheet.

 

For good spiral bound economical paper I like Oxford Optic 90g (same paper that is in the Red&Black Notebook) & Clairefontaine Velout`90g. They are ..........both even....one did one ink a tad better than the other, the other did a different ink a tad better....both close and in the end dead even.

[pen2paper]

Whitelines

[welch]

They didn't have coated paper in 1959 (or did they?) so what _did_ folks use back then? The coating bothers me sometimes. Quite a few modern pens have nibs so smooth that coated paper may lead to occasional skipping, especially if you don't put something under your hand when writing (which is a bother). And it doesn't always feel right. I prefer the texture of normal paper.

 

Yesterday I was in a hotel and there's always some paper in hotel rooms. This paper was quite good. It was uncoated, so the paper absorbed the ink. This led to a certain increase in line width (i.e. spread) bit not to feathering. There was no show- or bleedthrough, nothing. Worked great with a few different F or EF nibs. I loved the old-school texture of this paper under the nib.

 

So, are there alternatives to coated paper? Just good, old-fashioned paper that doesn't cost an arm and a leg? So far the only thing I've found is Belgian company Brepols, who makes a really good faux-leather bound A5 journal that sells for appr. 10 euros. While that's twice the cost of Oxford, it sure is nice paper.

 

Any suggestions? Price and availability info would also be appreciated. Thanx!

 

I used National Paper 20-pound three-hole notebook paper. National offered a 16-pound paper, but I could write on both sides of the 20-pound. It was available in the "school and office supply" section of drug stores -- a strange conglomeration in the US of pharmacy plus paperback books plus needle & thread plus magazines plus a lunch counter. Not sure if the UK has an equivalent. But the point is that it was easy to find paper that handled fountain pen ink...because, of course, that's what everyone used.

 

My hunch: as fewer people used fountain pens as a routine writing instrument, paper slipped downward. Our office paper at GE -- the huge conglomerate with centrally sourced office supplies -- was good with pencil, ballpoint, and Sanford Expresso fiber tipped pens, but slightly feathery with a fountain pen. I worked there from the early '80s, so my hunch suggests that paper lost fp-friendliness in the '70s.

[Intensity]

Fabriano Bioprima (EcoQua notebooks). Good amount of gentle “tooth”. I don’t think that paper is coated—doesn’t look or feel like it.

[pen2paper]

Sorry to be repetitive, but when Whitelines SE selected a USA manufacturer, its interesting features included nib contact rather than slippery-slick (which some of us prefer). The historic US paper company also improved quality including two side use. Wide Metallic Sharpie doesn't bleed through, no feathering.

 

All of us have preferences. I was happy with bagasse, except for its wrinkling. Black & Red.

Cranes rag content. Apica.

 

But Whitelines offered subtle nib-paper grip yet smooth that works nicely with a great variety of nibs, & inks. Kept passing over smooth slick quality papers, realizing smooth with slight control grip-feel aided my writing. It's a worthy product. Aside from easy on eyes color, lines disappearing when copied + app to store notes.

 

It should be available in college uni stores, since this paper co supplies those locations.

[txomsy]

Look up "laid paper" in Wikipedia.

 

There have been excellent papers for centuries, and you can still get them. Laid paper is usually more expensive (around here, about twice/four times the price of copy paper -I just bought some a week ago), but there is a large number of middle qualities that do behave very well.

 

Vellum paper. Parchemin. Quality cotton paper. Whatnot... There simply are way too many good qualities, and it all reduces to going to a good art shop and asking. I must say I'm luckier: around here, almost any stationary/bookstore sells a large variety of paper qualities, even cheap Chinese shops do carry many of these arts papers. YMMV but any decent arts shop should carry a large variety of papers and be able to inform you.

 

Again, I'm at an advantage here: having grown with pens and through the "golden ages" of papers, I can often tell by simply feeling the tact of paper how will it behave. ~50 years writing with fountain pens gives a little advantage.

[TheDutchGuy]

Thanks for your input, everyone! Much appreciated! Now apart from pens and inks, I can start sampling paper as well.

[eerestis]

One thing to consider is blank pages often lack that extra coating that I find causes the skippiness. A Rhodia dot pad feels a lot more slippery from a blank pad. I am actually really starting to get into blank pages.

 

But cotton added paper tends to be more resiliant.

Thank you very much for posting this! I had given up on Rhodia based on my experiences with the dot pad. My pens skipped on this paper all the time no matter how carefully I was preventing oils etc. from my skin to get on the paper. It was so bad I couldn't believe people recommended this paper.

 

But because of your message I gave Rhodia another shot, and I must say that the blank Rhodia paper is excellent. It's a completely different experience.

[DrDebG]

I have heard from our own Tom Kellie that this is fantastic paper - the best he has used.

 

https://www.fritz-schimpf.de/en/Stationery/Fritz-Schimpf-Briefblock-Feinpost-DIN-A5.html

[TheDutchGuy]

Found this today at the Dutch pen show in a booth selling Galen pen pouches. Galen is a Turkish brand of leather goods. There were some notebooks as well and I bought one. Appears to contain Tomoe River paper. Very, very nice. 62 pages, 10 Euros.

 

Edited June 16, 2019 by TheDutchGuy

[A Smug Dill]

My pens skipped on this paper all the time no matter how carefully I was preventing oils etc. from my skin to get on the paper.

I'd be keen to hear which inks you were using when you observed the frequent skipping on Rhodia Dotpad.

 

Since the hypothesis(?) is that the coating on the paper is causing the skipping, then the pen or nib doesn't matter as far as I'm concerned; it's just a matter of whether the paper will allow the particular ink to be drawn out of any fountain pen nib to then sit on top of the page and dry. If I have the some of the same inks you were using, I can test with both a dip pen and a desk (fountain) pen on Rhodia Dotpad to see if I observe any skipping.

[Thymen]

TheDutchGuy;

 

Just like you I am looking for every-day, affordable, preferably non-coated paper. But I have not found one yet that satisfies. I have some college pads made by Sigma, that are not too bad and quite cheap. But it is not consistent, between type (ruled/squared) and also between batches.

 

Rhodia is not too expensive, I buy it at Appelboom. But what ticks me off a bit is that behaviour is not consistent over the page, and it also makes a difference what side of the sheet is being written on. The back side seems to be less coated and draws more ink. Especially annoying when using both sides in a spiral-bound notebook.

 

I notice a difference in how Rhodia coated paper 'accepts' the ink when, before starting to write, I gently rub the surface with a clean, dry, rough piece of cloth. It's as if the coating becomes somewhat less smooth, a little more absorbing and also more consistent over the entire page. You could try that too.

Edited July 9, 2019 by Thymen