Caring For Piston Filler Pens - Lubrication, Ink Choice?

[Intensity]

I am now up to 3 piston filler pens (a vintage Montblanc 252, an Omas Paragon, and a Montegrappa Cosmopolitan), and I'm increasingly worried that I'm not taking proper care of these pens.

 

Specifically--none of these pens have visible filling mechanisms and no easy way (that I'm aware of) to check on the condition of all the moving parts.

 

What are some of the symptoms that a piston filler (the kind you fill by twisting a movable part at the top of the pen) needs servicing?

 

Are there some "do it at home" recommendations for maintenance?

 

Are there particular kinds of inks I should avoid, such as more acidic or more alkaline, or brand/ink name specifics that are known to be bad for piston fillers?

 

When you clean out a piston filler, it can take MANY fills to finally get water to run clear, and I always worry about the wear that's causing for the moving parts.

[praxim]

I take a more sanguine view.

 

If the piston mechanism does not feel as smooth as others of the same brand, I will find out why, and fix it.

 

I use well-known ink brands, and avoid deep reds / purples in pens with ink windows (not your problem here).

 

If the water does not have much colour in it that that is fine; just a few rinses. If I were refilling with the same or a similar ink rather than storing the pen or significantly changing colour, (e.g. to a lighter one) I would not bother cleaning at all.

[Intensity]

I have no point of reference for relative smoothness of other pens of the same brand. I think that all 3 pens have somewhat tight-feeling piston filling mechanism that's the easiest in the Montblanc and the toughest in the Montegrappa pen. Overall, all 3 feel like the turning periodically gets tough to keep turning and I have to apply a bit extra force, and then overcoming that the piston moves easier again. It's not like any of the converters I've used where rotating the tip of the converter is always easy and smooth.

[A Smug Dill]

Are there some "do it at home" recommendations for maintenance?

An ink such as Sailor Shikiori doyou will give your pen's ink reservoir a reasonably good clean-out, if you allow the ink to reach where some other ink in the pen has reached previously.

 

Are there particular kinds of inks I should avoid, such as more acidic or more alkaline, or brand/ink name specifics that are known to be bad for piston fillers?

There are piston-fill pens, and then there are other piston-fill pens. I can easily (and I think safely) disassemble my Wing Sung 3008 pens fully, and therefore I'm happy to put any sort of ink in them – including but not limited to pigment inks, shimmer inks, iron-gall inks, and even writing inks (such as Rubinato inchiostri) that are not explicitly marketed as designed/suitable/safe for use with fountain pens.

 

When you clean out a piston filler, it can take MANY fills to finally get water to run clear, and I always worry about the wear that's causing for the moving parts.

Firstly, if it wears out, it wears out – just as converters can wear out too. Piston-fill does not automatically mean 'better', more precious or more expensive (than cartridge/converter-as-filling-mechanism) to me, and therefore piston-fillers do not automatically warrant more 'respect', caution or 'kid glove' handling from me. Nothing lasts forever.

 

That said, the thing that is hardest to clean out on my Pelikan M600 is actually the feed, which seems to retain an unholy amount of ink. The way I've now learnt to deal with it is to unscrew the nib unit for flushing separately; that makes cleaning the piston-fill barrel a whole lot easier. Whether handling of the nib – which, in my case, would cost more than half my pen's effective price if I need to replace it – requires special caution on account of its 'value' is a different question.

 

It's not like any of the converters I've used where rotating the tip of the converter is always easy and smooth.

Converters can get somewhat stuck if ink somehow dried on the walls of the clear tube, especially where they touch the business end of the piston shaft inside. I've had to disassemble old (Sailor, Platinum and Delike) converters before to give them 'servicing' and apply a tiny amount of silicon grease, to get them moving smoothly again after a thorough cleaning.

[Honeybadgers]

I've never found "lubricated" inks or "cleaning" inks to actually do squat to my pens. I just use good old silicon grease and don't take the pen apart any more than barely required. I apply grease to the backside of the rod on my homosapiens, I've greased my vintage M120 mertz once because it was getting very stiff. I've greased my Lamy 2000 once in the two years I've had it and it probably didn't need it. I grease the rod on my vintage japanese eyedropper because the seal is getting old and it leaks if I don't put a little grease on the rod a couple times a year.

 

Long story short - pens rarely need grease, maybe once every 1-3 years. Eyedroppers obviously need greased threads every 1-3 fills.

 

I've also just come to accept that my demonstrators will become stained and decided to not buy any clear demo's worth more than about 80 bucks

 

Also, water doesn't need to run insanely clear unless you are switching from iron gall or noodlers baystate inks to normal inks. If it's a hair blue tinted, nothing will be hurt switching to a red or green or even yellow ink.

Edited February 20, 2019 by Honeybadgers

[Intensity]

I understand about disassembling and/or not caring so much for more budget pens, but 2 out of my 3 piston fillers are very expensive pens I received as gifts, so I definitely don’t want their filling mechanisms to wear out. One of those is my favorite pen and has a Binder-ground cursive italic nib point I asked him to do at a pen show. This is why I made this thread—I want to do more right than wrong by those pens to help them stay in good operating condition for a long time.

 

Sailor Doyu: I’m very curious about that ink for cleaning purpose and have almost gotten a bittle a few times. But I don’t care for the hue, and I keep wondering if there’s not something equivalent I can use that’s a straight up cleaner, not an ink. Also it won’t help with piston mechanism lubrication.

 

I should try to find out how my pens can be taken apart for checks/cleaning.

[Honeybadgers]

You need to weigh the wear and tear of disassembly against the wear and tear caused by only occasional greasing.

 

Generally speaking, the best way to ensure a pen lasts a long time is to use it regularly with normal inks (I keep my 3776 UEF inked with diamine iron gall at all times and I can tell it's not good for the pen after about a year, I have to brush it with a toothbrush every couple months to clean the feed - stick to non-hypersaturated inks and avoid shimmer and iron gall in pens you truly treasure - saturated inks like noodlers are safe, they can just be residue prone due to their saturation - so dilute them 25-50% with distilled water for use in pens that you value a lot. I dilute black swan in aussie roses 25% in my mom's old waterman and it's been trouble free) and only disassemble it for lubrication when it feels stiff.

 

But if you want to just never have a problem, use waterman, quink, sailor, platinum, pilot, or pelikan blue, black, or BB inks. Red inks are known to be problematic in the long term, shortening ink sac and latex rubber lifespans by half or more.

Edited February 20, 2019 by Honeybadgers

[A Smug Dill]

One of those is my favorite pen and has a Binder-ground cursive italic nib point I asked him to do at a pen show. This is why I made this thread—I want to do more right than wrong by those pens to help them stay in good operating condition for a long time.

 

 

I only have one customised nib – modified expertly by Dan Smith to my specifications, on my one-and-only Pelikan M600 (which is the Vibrant Orange limited edition model) – with which I love writing. I can't get it for nearly the same price again, even if I was to ask Dan to sell me another one. However, even if I completely destroy the barrel of the (still expensive) M600 piston-filler, I can still transplant the nib into another Pelikan M60x, so that is not really a compelling reason for me to treat the Vibrant Orange pen's filling mechanism with kid gloves.

[Intensity]

In my case the pen itself is also valuable (a silver Omas), somewhere close to $1000 originally. I very much want to keep it in good shape.

Edited February 20, 2019 by Intensity

[Honeybadgers]

Value has nothing to do with incentive to maintain. My mom's old waterman was worth maybe $15 before I dropped an $80 18k nib into it. I treasure that thing. But I don't disassemble it any more than is barely necessary.

 

Especially italian things tend to be handmade, and that means they were usually hammered together by someone to tolerances, not precision machined. A lamy can come apart almost as often as you want. You don't dare disassemble an old wahl doric vac filler. A part made to fit a pen that will not fit another is one that you don't mess with.

 

I highly recommend just using a simple, easy to flush ink like waterman or pilot blue, and not taking it apart until it gets stiff.

[Intensity]

I’d rather not use a fountain pen than use those inks with it... I have a strong prejudice against bland washable blues and BBs (and fading Waterman blues. Though I do like Waterman Absolute Brown). Non-shimmer J. Herbin inks might be a safe bet. I wonder if Lamy inks would be as well. Iroshizuku line? (Gray and black, because I already have and like those).

 

P.S.: I've also remembered about Pelikan Edelstein inks -- the few that have been measured in pH tests I've found are close to neutral, and also Pelikan makes a lot of piston filler pens.

 

Curious about Papier Plume inks as well. They are made from French inks/ingredients and their saturation is on the low end, more like J. Herbin. I have 3 of their inks and like them a lot.

Edited February 20, 2019 by Intensity

[Charles Skinner]

One of my pens developed a noise at a certain point when moving the "piston" up and down. I put a Noodler's lubricating ink in it, and that solved the problem. The ink might have been what solved that problem, or it could be something else. I don't know.

 

C. Skinner

[Bo Bo Olson]

I had hopes about the Eel inks when they first came out, but other reports kept me away from them (You wouldn't believe how much it cost to mail Noodler inks then or now)..........someone needs to make a thread on that....perhaps has.

xxxxxxxx

 

Twsbi and Ahab are made to be taken apart, I don't know anything about Wing Sung 3008.

But seeing you yank yours apart six times a week, then either they are made to be taken apart or are so cheap that it don't matter.

 

To some I imagine, a E100 Pelikan '50's 400 Pelikan is a cheap pen....or a E400 modern one. They were not made to be taken apart. They then wear out or break.....and are then sold.****

 

The new modern 800&1000 have brass screw gadget in them so they can be taken apart. I have no desire nor need to take apart my 1005........works fine, will last a long time. If it needs to be lubed, I can screw out the nib. I am so old fashioned....I see no reason to take it apart even if I can......I have an idea what it looks like inside. Lots of pictures here. The pen works fine and I gave up Ghost Dancing ...well never even started.

IMO repair by re-corking with properly prepared cork or renewing the 2.0 plastic gasket is the only reason to yank apart a piston pen.

 

There are piston pens with out screw out nibs, so easy lube is not possible....perhaps if one was to boil a bit of water and silicon grease it could be sucked up and out....doing the job.

 

 

****I would now never buy a used Wing Sung 3008, nor Twsbi or Ahab...don't know how many times one can be taken apart before it too has worn out...........but those are cheap pens.

I can understand your not caring if they wear out or not.

 

Pelikan, MB, Geha, Kaweco, Soennecken and Osmia were/are not cheap pens (even at 'cheaper vintage' prices), and were not designed to be yanked apart every Sunday in a Ghost Ink Hunt. There are piston pens designed to work for generations, and modern cheap ones designed for a couple years of work. Wing Sung 3008, Twsbi, Ahab.

 

Noobies will believe the strangest things...........I remember the anti-MB rants of a decade ago....and I went to my B&M just to buy a MB ink shoe.....in MB was so hated....was going to toss the ink down the sink as 'everyone' said...the only good thing MB made was it's ink bottle..................they were wrong. I kept the ink.

Got many more MB inks later.....now no longer in I think E19 for a regular ink shoe is robbery.

 

I really don't want some 'noobie' gaily yanking apart his Pelikan140, thinking he should, in you do....or you advocate yanking apart piston pens......one has to read the small print to know it's a cheap Wing Sung 3008.

 

Others make me wince also....yanking pens apart because there might be a ghost of ink behind their piston..........well condensation and a haze of ink can build behind a demonstrator's piston.

 

Where I would say, that is part of the normal use,; it's not leaking.... others go ape on that. It's a demonstrator and haze is part of it. But that leads to chasing the thought of invisible ink hidden in a regular 'colored' piston pen...............and aging and ruining one, because folks don't say Hard Enough, Often Enough....NO! NO!...NO!!!!.

Don't yank your pen apart.....there was an old song, 'Don't take your love to town'....that would go good here.

 

Yes it is their pen....then they will sell it, and some 'noobie' will grumble, vintage pens are no good, or piston pens are no good, the one he bought leaks out the end, that wiggles.

The next thing you know that poor 'nooble' has his hybred re-fill ball point out.....

Because pens that don't need to be taken apart, are, and are ruined!

Edited February 20, 2019 by Bo Bo Olson

[Intensity]

To some I imagine, a E100 Pelikan '50's 400 Pelikan is a cheap pen....or a E400 modern one. They were not made to be taken apart. They then wear out or break.....and are then sold.****

 

. . .

 

Yes it is their pen....then they will sell it, and some 'noobie' will grumble, vintage pens are no good, or piston pens are no good, the one he bought leaks out the end, that wiggles.

The next thing you know that poor 'nooble' has his hybred re-fill ball point out.....

Because pens that don't need to be taken apart, are, and are ruined!

 

Yes, sadly it's also the case with cracked or sprung nibs from overflexing or falling damage.

 

. . .

I've decided to bring in my pens to a local pen shop which employs a pen repair guy and ask for his opinion on my piston pen servicing and maintenance.

[sirgilbert357]

 

Yes, sadly it's also the case with cracked or sprung nibs from overflexing or falling damage.

 

. . .

I've decided to bring in my pens to a local pen shop which employs a pen repair guy and ask for his opinion on my piston pen servicing and maintenance.

 

 

I would also ask him how your pens come apart, or you could google that detail. If you can easily unscrew the nib unit (like Pelikan, Aurora, etc), then grease the piston once every year or when it gets a little harder to turn the piston knob. If you cannot easily gain access to the ink chamber though, then having a pro do it is probably your best bet.

 

As far as which inks are safe for your piston fillers, there are many opinions on that, and I encourage you to do your own research. My two cents: pen manufacturers' inks are usually safe for modern piston fillers. I have no worries about the seals on my Pelikans or my Lamy 2000 ever wearing out because of what ink I put in them. And if they do, seals can be replaced.

[sciumbasci]

I had hopes about the Eel inks when they first came out, but other reports kept me away from them (You wouldn't believe how much it cost to mail Noodler inks then or now)..........someone needs to make a thread on that....perhaps has.

xxxxxxxx

 

Twsbi and Ahab are made to be taken apart, I don't know anything about Wing Sung 3008.

But seeing you yank yours apart six times a week, then either they are made to be taken apart or are so cheap that it don't matter.

 

To some I imagine, a E100 Pelikan '50's 400 Pelikan is a cheap pen....or a E400 modern one. They were not made to be taken apart. They then wear out or break.....and are then sold.****

 

The new modern 800&1000 have brass screw gadget in them so they can be taken apart. I have no desire nor need to take apart my 1005........works fine, will last a long time. If it needs to be lubed, I can screw out the nib. I am so old fashioned....I see no reason to take it apart even if I can......I have an idea what it looks like inside. Lots of pictures here. The pen works fine and I gave up Ghost Dancing ...well never even started.

IMO repair by re-corking with properly prepared cork or renewing the 2.0 plastic gasket is the only reason to yank apart a piston pen.

 

There are piston pens with out screw out nibs, so easy lube is not possible....perhaps if one was to boil a bit of water and silicon grease it could be sucked up and out....doing the job.

 

 

****I would now never buy a used Wing Sung 3008, nor Twsbi or Ahab...don't know how many times one can be taken apart before it too has worn out...........but those are cheap pens.

I can understand your not caring if they wear out or not.

 

Pelikan, MB, Geha, Kaweco, Soennecken and Osmia were/are not cheap pens (even at 'cheaper vintage' prices), and were not designed to be yanked apart every Sunday in a Ghost Ink Hunt. There are piston pens designed to work for generations, and modern cheap ones designed for a couple years of work. Wing Sung 3008, Twsbi, Ahab.

 

Noobies will believe the strangest things...........I remember the anti-MB rants of a decade ago....and I went to my B&M just to buy a MB ink shoe.....in MB was so hated....was going to toss the ink down the sink as 'everyone' said...the only good thing MB made was it's ink bottle..................they were wrong. I kept the ink.

Got many more MB inks later.....now no longer in I think E19 for a regular ink shoe is robbery.

 

I really don't want some 'noobie' gaily yanking apart his Pelikan140, thinking he should, in you do....or you advocate yanking apart piston pens......one has to read the small print to know it's a cheap Wing Sung 3008.

 

Others make me wince also....yanking pens apart because there might be a ghost of ink behind their piston..........well condensation and a haze of ink can build behind a demonstrator's piston.

 

Where I would say, that is part of the normal use,; it's not leaking.... others go ape on that. It's a demonstrator and haze is part of it. But that leads to chasing the thought of invisible ink hidden in a regular 'colored' piston pen...............and aging and ruining one, because folks don't say Hard Enough, Often Enough....NO! NO!...NO!!!!.

Don't yank your pen apart.....there was an old song, 'Don't take your love to town'....that would go good here.

 

Yes it is their pen....then they will sell it, and some 'noobie' will grumble, vintage pens are no good, or piston pens are no good, the one he bought leaks out the end, that wiggles.

The next thing you know that poor 'nooble' has his hybred re-fill ball point out.....

Because pens that don't need to be taken apart, are, and are ruined!

 

Needs to be put in a sticky somewhere.

[Bibliophage]

Wing Sung 3008's are designed to be taken apart. Its a bit twee, but you turn the piston knob, then turn the bottom seal ring which tightens the piston knob, and eventually the ring comes off, and you just pull the syringe section out. It looks JUST like a syringe

 

you can lube it, clean the barrel, whatever, and reassemble. The feed comes out as well - it's keyed, so you won't have a problem lining it back up again. You end up with a plastic barrel and section that you can blow spit wads out of - so it's easy to clean.

 

The Wing Sung 3003, on the other hand... well, I have some bits and chunks from one for spare parts

[Bo Bo Olson]

I have a lot of screw out nibbed piston pens, and a lot that are not. MB has a big song and dance with some sort of pine tare glue to hold the nib and feed in.

Others I have if friction fit, can have the nib and feed removed and the piston wiped with a 1/2 a rice corn of silicon grease on a Q-tip.

 

I have not done this, but thought about it especially for MB which often needs a special tool.....take a bit of silicon grease in a bit of water....in a small tin, boil or heat it until the grease is dissolved. Then fill and empty the pen a few times with silicon water. That should be near enough to a twist out piston unit.

 

The good thing is at least with a Pelikan one only has to re-lube perhaps every three years....or more. Rick recommends the three or more years, instead of often.

 

Consider your self lucky, that first you have a pen shop near by....and second it has a repair man.

[Intensity]

That's very interesting advice, Bo Bo Olson! I might try that. Isn't silicone grease not water soluble? I was going to try this silicone grease at some point: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00X7JXM4C/

 

I have a sample vial of Noodler's Eel Black and decided to try it out on the Montegrappa piston filler I'm currently flushing. Anecdotal evidence, I know, but the ink sat in the pen for a few hours, and then I've moved the piston up and down with the ink and rinsed with water again. The piston twist-cap is noticeably easier to turn now and and the movement is smoother.

Edited February 20, 2019 by Intensity

[senzen]

I would just think twice with inks that are known to produce gunk and nib / feed units that are not as easy to disassemble. With Rouge Hématite I need to clean a Lamy Vista every couple of weeks, which is easy enough, but not something I would want to be doing with my Pelikans.

 

The pistons may just require a bit of silicone, never had a need for this myself.