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Waterman 50, W2, W3 Or W5


Redpanda

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Hello :D

 

I am looking into buying my first vintage pen. I found some different Watermans in slightly different price ranges all with 14ct nibs.

 

I was wondering if anyone had any experiences with these pens and could offer some insight as to which model could make the best purchase and writing experience. I know that is also boils down to the individual pen. Having never held a Waterman before I would appreciate any sort of advice or info.

 

As listed in the title I am looking at the Waterman 50, W2, W3, and W5 models!

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I could be wrong, but would suggest that a digit is missing/worn on the barrel imprint, and this pen may will have left the factory as either a 502 or a 503 - I'm unsure as to the difference between these two models.

I'd agree that I don't think there was a model 50.

 

P.S. unbelievably I seem not to have a 502 - I've a couple of 503s - so can't immediately tell you what the difference between them should be.

As for the W models, it seems that the higher the No. then the larger and more ornate the models tends to be, but this brand was a quality production across the whole range generally, and my humble suggestion might be that your decision as to which model you buy is based on the type of nib you prefer rather than size etc. of pen.

Other things being equal, the nib is the most important part of the pen - it's what hits the paper and does the business. :)

Edited by PaulS
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That "50" has all text missing to the right of what appears to be a repaired crack or break across the barrel.

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I could be wrong, but would suggest that a digit is missing/worn on the barrel imprint, and this pen may will have left the factory as either a 502 or a 503 - I'm unsure as to the difference between these two models.

I'd agree that I don't think there was a model 50.

 

 

 

 

Nice guess ! :)

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I also concur a digit missing. As the seller has the pen in hand he/she should be able to tell wear from repair.

 

According to Tommys Vintage Pens the 502 is very slightly slimmer than the 503 and has just one cap band. They both sport a 2A nib.

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I could be wrong, but would suggest that a digit is missing/worn on the barrel imprint, and this pen may will have left the factory as either a 502 or a 503 - I'm unsure as to the difference between these two models.

I'd agree that I don't think there was a model 50.

 

P.S. unbelievably I seem not to have a 502 - I've a couple of 503s - so can't immediately tell you what the difference between them should be.

As for the W models, it seems that the higher the No. then the larger and more ornate the models tends to be, but this brand was a quality production across the whole range generally, and my humble suggestion might be that your decision as to which model you buy is based on the type of nib you prefer rather than size etc. of pen.

Other things being equal, the nib is the most important part of the pen - it's what hits the paper and does the business. :)

 

Thank you so much before I got myself into trouble! You should be a pen detective :ninja: It is nice to know what you buy. It is a really nice pen though. How much should a 502 or 502 cost?

 

That "50" has all text missing to the right of what appears to be a repaired crack or break across the barrel.

 

I had not noticed that at all! Maybe I should stay clear of it then?

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according to Davis & Lehrer "Waterman Past And Present - The First Six Decades", the 502 was available with both one and two cap bands, apparently.

 

People here tend to steer clear of giving firm advice on how much you should pay for XYZ model - not that they're trying to be unhelpful, but pens are all things to all men/women and value/cost/price are such subjective things that I dare say if you asked a dozen people you'd probably get a dozen different answers. Scan all available examples of the pen you want, for a week or so and try to assess what the mean or average appears to be, and then hope that you get it right - often we don't, but that's part of the learning curve. :) We all pay over the odds occasionally, whether through ignorance or greed getting the better of our desires. Incidentally, black is the least valuable colour, commercially - marbled colours and striations (of which W. made many) are more desirable with red ripples and lizards and snakes near the top.

So a black examples should not stretch the budget. I'm unaware of problems with the particular pen you mention, but if comments to that effect have been made, then be cautious and perhaps avoid this one.

 

I'd suggest again that you concentrate on getting a nib that suits you rather than the pen itself - maybe you prefer a fine point or perhaps a broad or maybe something with flex - though have to say I had a vague probably unsubstantiated thought that Waterman didn't make as many flexes as other brands - expect I will now be told I'm very wrong :D

Edited by PaulS
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I had not noticed that at all! Maybe I should stay clear of it then?

To extend my earlier comment, all text is abruptly missing, chopping letters off Waterman, France, and 50[n]. Why, and why so completely, even when one expands the image? From that point I believe I see a slightly ragged diagonal line. Given the entire loss of text I think it was a break with epoxy repair spilling to the right of the line. These are suppositions which would lead me not to buy that pen, leading at once to points PaulS just made: what is it you are trying to buy? Nib? Aesthetics? Condition?

 

With a little practice and the odd mistake, we have all learned our own mix of value.

 

edit:editing error

Edited by praxim

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To extend my earlier comment, all text is abruptly missing, chopping letters off Waterman, France, and 50[n]. Why, and why so completely, even when one expands the image? From that point I believe I see a slightly ragged diagonal line. Given the entire loss of text I think it was a break with epoxy repair spilling to the right of the line. These are suppositions which would lead me not to buy that pen, leading at once to points PaulS just made: what is it you are trying to buy? Nib? Aesthetics? Condition?

 

With a little practice and the odd mistake, we have all learned our own mix of value.

 

edit:editing error

The importance to me is the nib and of course the condition is important, but if there is an error that the seller is trying (knowingly or unnowingly) to cover up and sell the pen as a different model then it seems risky to me.

I don't knwow where to go from here. I feel that the world of vintage pens is one of trial and error. It is difficult to navigate in when you are new to it.

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sorry if we've made the world of pens sound like a minelfield - it can be, but using some common sense and help from folk here it shouldn't be a disaster.

If your heart is set on a Waterman - then try to get the nib type you most desire, and perhaps some members might recommend where best that you will be able to buy with confidence from regular FPN dealers. Buying from places such as ebay is less risky as and when you have more experience, though of course there are many very reliable and trustworthy sellers on ebay, but likewise fingers can be burned if you don't know what to look for or to avoid.

Not sure where you are - but hopefully some of the guys here will be able to offer guidance as to dependable sellers.

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sorry if we've made the world of pens sound like a minelfield - it can be, but using some common sense and help from folk here it shouldn't be a disaster.

If your heart is set on a Waterman - then try to get the nib type you most desire, and perhaps some members might recommend where best that you will be able to buy with confidence from regular FPN dealers. Buying from places such as ebay is less risky as and when you have more experience, though of course there are many very reliable and trustworthy sellers on ebay, but likewise fingers can be burned if you don't know what to look for or to avoid.

Not sure where you are - but hopefully some of the guys here will be able to offer guidance as to dependable sellers.

I think it becomes a minefield when one doesnt have a whole lot of funds to play around with if it goes wrong. It becomes easier when you know what to look for and when you have no experience this forum proves invaluable. I am in love with old Waterman pens (the 52 especially) and I dream of having one with a flex nib one day, but I would rather be overcautious than getting burned and be too scared to try again.

 

Is the writing experience different with the different nibs of the W range and the 502 and 503? Or are they just more ornate? Forgive my stupidity I have never held any of these pens.

Edited by Redpanda
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from an obvious point of view - though I don't write with W. pens - this brand like others offered a wide selection of nib types, and you simply asked the dealer to change the nib on whatever model you wanted. Now of course you can't do that, and you either wait for a suitable nib/body to surface or spend time looking for the right nib amongst the spares columns, but the answer is most of this brand will accept alternative nibs with varying tips to suit however you wish to write - fine to stub.

 

In the early C20 Waterman were responsible for the sale of seven out of every ten f.ps. sold, apparently, so they were very big, although they eventually lost out to others, but they made some of the most desirable and attractive pens you will ever see. The W range and the 502/503 series from the 1940s are perhaps the lesser lights, but with the right nib and a good 'hand' they will no doubt perform as well as pens from other major brands. Why as individuals we favour any given brand is no doubt a very deep Freudian subject, but there's no denying that W., perhaps, have a tad more cache in the way of romance or visual appeal than Parker or Sheaffer.

 

The Davis & Lehrer book mentioned is sadly very short on text and information, but very good if you want good pix of the various models to get an idea of looks.

 

Not that I'd have known otherwise, but apparently the W. 52 in red ripple or wood grain Vulcanite was one of their most common models from the whole of the 52 series - fingers crossed you find one, though these reds do tend to cost big ish bucks. :)

Edited by PaulS
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