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Hr Flat Top Id - Help Me Roger W, You're My Only Hope!

JonSzanto

By JonSzanto
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JonSzanto Antique

JonSzanto

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The title is a bit tongue-in-cheek, as I'll take input from anyone, but if Roger Wooten weighs in I'll be happy!

 

I purchased a Sheaffer BCHR flat top, photo below, in an auction. I received the pen and am very happy with condition. I'd like to ball park the date era (currently believing between 1920-24) but mostly wondering what the catalog code would have been. PCA website is down and the only pdfs I have from that period of Sheaffer catalogs are too unclear to show the chasing.

 

Basic description: an 8C type flat top, no WD, 1/4" gf band, chasing is a series of straight lines (4-5, then a smooth area, repeated). Nib marked as follows:

 

Sheaffer's

Lifetime

Reg. U.S. Patent

If it is pertinent I can supply the imprint as well. Clip is "Sheaffer'S" (not Sheaffer-Clip). If anyone can supply the catalog code and anything that narrows down the year(s) of manufacture, that would be lovely.

 

s-l1600.jpg

"When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick; and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

~ Benjamin Franklin

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Roger W. Antique

Roger W.

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Well, it is more or less a B85C. Probably around '23 or '24 as it doesn't have the white dot yet and they didn't use ribbon until '23. There are lined models with the white dot. In the catalog these have 14K furniture but, there doesn't seem to be a real distinction with furniture not so marked as I've a few 85's that are gold filled.

 

Roger W.

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JonSzanto Antique

JonSzanto

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Well, it is more or less a B85C. Probably around '23 or '24 as it doesn't have the white dot yet and they didn't use ribbon until '23. There are lined models with the white dot. In the catalog these have 14K furniture but, there doesn't seem to be a real distinction with furniture not so marked as I've a few 85's that are gold filled.

 

Roger W.

 

Thanks, Roger! The other ID I received felt it might be considered a B8 1/2 C. Are both the "5" and the "1/2" codes for the band? Definitely no marking or hallmark, etc, indicating 14k on the band, so I'm assuming gold fill.

"When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick; and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

~ Benjamin Franklin

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Roger W. Antique

Roger W.

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Posted

 

Thanks, Roger! The other ID I received felt it might be considered a B8 1/2 C. Are both the "5" and the "1/2" codes for the band? Definitely no marking or hallmark, etc, indicating 14k on the band, so I'm assuming gold fill.

Yes, the 5 is a 1/2 band ("B" is for Ribbon Line, page 17, 1925) . I'd be willing to consider the other but, they never used that coding in 1923 or 1925 for lifetime pens so it is straight out wrong.

 

Roger W.

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JonSzanto Antique

JonSzanto

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Yes, the 5 is a 1/2 band ("B" is for Ribbon Line, page 17, 1925) . I'd be willing to consider the other but, they never used that coding in 1923 or 1925 for lifetime pens so it is straight out wrong.

 

Roger W.

 

Thanks, Roger! I'm keeping a note with all this info in my records and I look forward to when the PCA gets the website back up and running - I don't have a pdf of the 1925 catalog, but will look forward to that reference.

"When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick; and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

~ Benjamin Franklin

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Roger W. Antique

Roger W.

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Posted (edited)

Jon;

 

In a long discussion offline I am not able to reliably name this model as it does not appear in any catalog. In '23 the lifetimes are on pages 8-10 and the regular line 8 1/2C is on page 5. It doesn't make sense to me to put a lifetime pen on page 5. If these were found with 8 nibs that would be a different story but, I've not seen that to be the case. B85C's are 14K gold which is why I caveat it to be more or less that since it is gold filled. So there is a valid case for it to be an B81/2C though you have to ignore that it is an LT in that case. Unfortunately, they are rare enough that a stickered model is unlikely. So yes, it is more or less a B85C lacking a gold band. Anyway, B8C with a wide gold filled band is a proper enough description.

 

Roger W.

Edited by Roger W.
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JonSzanto Antique

JonSzanto

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Jon;

 

In a long discussion offline I am not able to reliably name this model as it does not appear in any catalog. In '23 the lifetimes are on pages 8-10 and the regular line 8 1/2C is on page 5. It doesn't make sense to me to put a lifetime pen on page 5. If these were found with 8 nibs that would be a different story but, I've not seen that to be the case. B85C's are 14K gold which is why I caveat it to be more or less that since it is gold filled. So there is a valid case for it to be an B81/2C though you have to ignore that it is an LT in that case. Unfortunately, they are rare enough that a stickered model is unlikely. So yes, it is more or less a B85C lacking a gold band. Anyway, B8C with a wide gold filled band is a proper enough description.

 

Roger W.

 

Most excellent. I, um... was made aware of those conversations! And I very much apologise for not getting a photo up but unfortunately we've had a family emergency that has needed my attention. I expect to be back to all this in about a week and I'll do some good pics for you guys. Promise!

"When Men differ in Opinion, both Sides ought equally to have the Advantage of being heard by the Publick; and that when Truth and Error have fair Play, the former is always an overmatch for the latter."

~ Benjamin Franklin

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