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Pelikan M101N Lizard

m101n pelikan lizard

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54 replies to this topic

#41 sansenri

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Posted 05 June 2018 - 19:42

I don't really see the point, your research will be deviated by factors that would influence a study such as you mention.

Of course you will find smaller pens still sell more, they are cheaper... on average (again - we already said there are some cheap pens that are large...). This has deviating effect on sales that will false your comparison.

(stick to fountain pens however, ball points are another matter, I actually don't consider them to be "pens").

 

Of course the MB149 was there 70 years ago (it was launched in 1952 if I'm not mistaken) and so were other large pens like the Duofolds

 

but on average, look at the market then, and the market now, it's clear there are more larger pens around now.

I'm not trying to say anything different from this, but I don't think you need statistics to see that either.

 

Since it's not my intention to deviate from the topic further, I confirm that despite it's smallish size by today's standards the Pelikan 101N and M101N is an extremely nice pen which does fascinate me much more than a MB149 (which I don't have) and gets much more use from me than the MB146 (which I do have).



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#42 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 05 June 2018 - 21:25

The Sheaffer Targa, the Imperial are Large pens.

The P-45 (second version) is a Large pen....but with the shaft going skinny, don't seem so. First version had a more normal rounder, shorter barrel.

 

So is the Pelikan 381 or Celebry pens of the mid-late '90's. As was the 800 from '87?88 to now.

 

When I grew up in the '50-60's a P-51 a medium-large pen was considered a big pen. I never saw in real life one of Sheaffer's Large...for the time Huge, PFM.

 

Because of it's thinness I never thought the Snorkel a Large pen, which it is. :yikes: ...............but those were Adult Pens.....something one had plans to get once one got old enough for a real job.....my, some of those cost $12 or more dollars..................when it was possible a $100 used car could run a full year. Possibility and probability are not quite the same. :rolleyes:

Fill it up, and buy a quarter quart of Quaker oil at the same time.

 

The 146 was in the '50-60's a medium large pen....I have one, IMO has better balance (and a better nib of course) than my regular flex nibbed '70-80 Large 146 ...which actually is not all that heavy or awkward....but it takes me a minute or three to get use to it. It is or feels much lighter than the 800.

 

But in my era, standard sized pens were still standard.


Edited by Bo Bo Olson, 06 June 2018 - 15:49.

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#43 invisuu

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Posted 06 June 2018 - 06:01

I don't have a horse in this race, I have all sizes of Pelikans, a MB149, etc. I enjoy pens of various sizes, except very heavy pens (over 25 grams or so).

 

Anyway, I did get some responses and the closest to a number I was able to get is a roughly 4:6 ratio M400:M800 pens sold, which is honestly more than I expected, but still. This is JUST M400 to M800. Excluding M200, M120, and other smaller/average sized pens. I'd say the new M101s are not a significant proportion of sale. The general consensus from retailers was that the M800 is a more popular model than the M400, but was also hinted that this might be due to all of the limited editions that keep coming out. Even then, it's not significantly more popular.

 

Don't worry, even in "my era", whatever that means, standard sized pens are still standard and most widely used (roughly 97.5% of people). People most certainly still do not grow up with big pens and probably never will. The only thing I could see is that people would rather drop 400EUR+ on a bigger pen than a smaller pen, due to perceived value of purchase, and maybe are more willing to use bigger pens simply because almost nobody writes for 6 hours a day anymore.

 

Now I'm done with this topic, as I feel guilty of ruining a perfectly good thread about a stunning, beautiful pen. Sorry to the OP.



#44 truphae_inc

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Posted 15 June 2018 - 16:31

Just thought I would add some group shots.

SixPelikanGroup-1.png

m200, m215, m120 Iconic blue, vintage 400, m101n lizard, m805

 

SixPelikanGroup-2.png

 

It's hard to tell from the photo, but the m101n is about 2mm longer then the m120 posted.

Amazing! Love the addition to your collection - it's gorgeous! 


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#45 Karmachanic

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Posted 15 June 2018 - 20:19

What?

The M800 is a Large pen (and the M1000 Huge)

The larger pen version of any pen is never "cheaper."

 

 

Just because Mr. Olson makes a statement doesn't mean that it is "fact", especially a statement that is a sweeping generality.

 

Sweeping generality? ASA Maya is a lovely light chunky pen. $45 +/-


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#46 Glenn-SC

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Posted 16 June 2018 - 09:16

 

ASA Maya is a lovely light chunky pen. $45 +/-

I have never heard of or seen an "ASA Maya".
So while what you say may be true, the point and question is: is there a smaller version of this pen and does that smaller version cost less, the same, or more?



#47 Calabria

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Posted 16 June 2018 - 19:29

Invisuu, what are the myths and fairytales about Pelikan modern obliques?
"If you can spend a perfectly useless afternoon in a perfectly useless manner, you have learned how to live."
– Lin Yu-T'ang

#48 Jjota

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Posted 17 June 2018 - 01:38

Actually, I know for a fact youre wrong, because based on market research of Gouletpens, one of, if not the largest fountain pen retailers in USA, they found out only around 5% of people use fountain pens. Rest are ballpoints, which are almost all thin, light pens in standard size.

I will research this topic and find out with retailers which fountain pens are sold. I am almost positive the M400 outsells the M800 and M1000 by a significant margin, but I will do my research and put an end to this muh fellings arguments which are all completely unsubstantiated!

I paid out of my own pocket over 600EUR to find out about modern Pelikan obliques and realized infomartion spread here was completely false.

I am so fed up with these myths and fairy tales people spread here.
 
EDIT: I have contacted some of the largest fountain pen retailers in USA and EU and will update this thread with actual, factual numbers, if I get a response.


5% (!?!)

Id be surprised if even .1% of the world uses fountain pens. I teach at a college in California with 25,000 students and in my 15 years there have never come across a student or faculty using a fountain pen. Too expensive and more difficult too use than a ballpoint (plus youd really have to seek out a fountain pen - even Pilot Varsity are getting harder to find)

#49 Glenn-SC

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Posted 17 June 2018 - 20:12

Here is a size comparison of some Pelikans (Capped and Uncapped).

3484j7m.jpg

2e37kuc.jpg

The M100Ns are neither long or wide.

The M100Ns are not large or even medium pens.

And when compared with large pens really looks small...

1zb70vr.jpg

fxgmde.jpg



#50 Karmachanic

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Posted 17 June 2018 - 20:46

5% (!?!)

Id be surprised if even .1% of the world uses fountain pens. I teach at a college in California with 25,000 students and in my 15 years there have never come across a student or faculty using a fountain pen. Too expensive and more difficult too use than a ballpoint (plus youd really have to seek out a fountain pen - even Pilot Varsity are getting harder to find)

 

Hmm. California is hardly representative of the literate world. No offence intended.


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#51 Glenn-SC

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Posted 17 June 2018 - 23:18

 

Hmm. California is hardly representative of the literate world. No offence intended.

 

All evidence to the contrary.



#52 Jjota

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Posted 17 June 2018 - 23:37

 
Hmm. California is hardly representative of the literate world. No offence intended.


...so, where exactly does one cull data from for informing this apparently geopolitical discussion?
California currently has the 5th largest economy in the world whilst having one of the most diverse populations as well. Surely, with such a broad sample of people to observe from there should be more evidence of fountain pen use, no? If your opinion is based solely upon internet sources then thats a flawed, overly filtered sample population to draw from.

Wasnt intending to start a debate... just stating an opinion as you are - in the end were all on the same team (human beings enjoying archaic writing instruments no matter where we live or came from ;-)

#53 Driften

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 01:29

...so, where exactly does one cull data from for informing this apparently geopolitical discussion?
California currently has the 5th largest economy in the world whilst having one of the most diverse populations as well. Surely, with such a broad sample of people to observe from there should be more evidence of fountain pen use, no? If your opinion is based solely upon internet sources then thats a flawed, overly filtered sample population to draw from.

Wasnt intending to start a debate... just stating an opinion as you are - in the end were all on the same team (human beings enjoying archaic writing instruments no matter where we live or came from ;-)

 

 

California may be diverse, but does not require kids to use fountain pens for some grades in school like I understand some countries do. (Germany? China?)



#54 Glenn-SC

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 06:55

 

California is hardly representative of the literate world.

 

 

 

 

California may be diverse, but does not require kids to use fountain pens for some grades in school like I understand some countries do.

And where is the evidence that the "use of fountain pens" equates to "literacy"?



#55 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 16:34

Germany as far as I know, no longer requires fountain pens.

It might well still be favored though.

 

Well, I just lucked into a 1005, and it is 3/8ths of an inch longer and quite a bit wider than a post '97 600.(lucked into a 400 size pre-'97 600 also.)

 

What did surprise me was the 1005 is 1/8th an inch smaller than my Lamy Persona.

It's still a huge pen. I'd just not realized how huge the Persona was.

The Waterman 52  is the same length as the 1005.

 

 

I like that sea green tortoise 500, I have a lighter than now 500 Tortoise.

 

Medium-small was very IN, for quite a while, the 100/100n, 140, Geha 760, Kaweco Dia, some Osmia pens were medium-small. All have long caps, so they post to standard size.

 

Medium small fits shirt pockets very well.


Edited by Bo Bo Olson, 18 June 2018 - 16:49.

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 






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