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Con-70 No Suction

pilot con-70 maintenance suction

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39 replies to this topic

#21 inkstainedruth

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Posted 03 June 2018 - 17:48

Anyone know what converter comes on the nib assembly on a Vanishing Point/Decimo?  I'm having a lot of trouble with the capacity on my Decimo and if I don't use it constantly it seems to either dry up or clog or run out of ink, or maybe just get air bubbles in it.  I like the pen otherwise: there are times when having a "click" pen is convenient, and I really like the size of the pen overall.  But I don't seem to be able to get a lot of writing out of it (even with a Japanese F nib) before it needs to be refilled.  And I can't believe the issue is the ink (since I'm currently using Iroshizuku Kon-peki in it, which should be IDEAL).

There are times where I think I'm wiping more ink off the section than is actually going into the pen (because of where the hole is in the feed, you really have to dunk in really deep compared to other pens which don't have such a long nib and feed). :angry:  And the whole POINT of getting the pen was that my husband didn't like the F nib on the used VP I found a couple of years ago (it seemed more cost effective in the long run to buy MYSELF the Decimo and just get one with an EF nib and swap assemblies -- given that a replacement assembly was going to cost nearly double what I'd paid for the VP in the first place) -- plus got me a pen that I could use, since the VP was a little heavy for me.

Anyone know if there is a way to replace just that part if necessary?  I'd rather not have to pay for a possibly expensive repair at the moment, and $80 US for a replacement assembly seems really exorbitant.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth


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#22 MYU

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Posted 03 June 2018 - 18:02

Ruth, are you dunking your Decimo with nib into the ink well? "I'm wiping more ink off the section than is actually going into the pen "  It sounds like you may be doing that... which could be the reason for your troubles.  You're supposed to remove the nib assembly from the pen and then submerge the nib up to the assembly shoulder for filling.  If you leave the assembly in the pen, it's doubtful you'll get a full refill.  Plus, the dunking gets ink inside the front part of the pen and, over time, compromise the seal of the trap door, thus permitting air entry and premature drying out of the nib.

 

I've found the best way to get a more satisfying ink supply is to refill a cartridge with a blunt syringe.  The original piston converter included with the pen loses a lot of capacity because of the long screw knob.


Edited by MYU, 03 June 2018 - 18:06.

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#23 MYU

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Posted 03 June 2018 - 18:10

CON70 is a nuisance to use. It is extremely difficult to clean completely and doesn't suck up ink properly after several uses. Even with an ultrasonic cleaner, there is always, still, remnant ink. CON50 is good for me but Pilot took the wrong stance and discontinued it. CON40 is another pain in the ___, also difficult to clean and dry thoroughly. On my Pilot pens, I have switched from convertors to refilling cartridges with a syringe, and it seems to slow down evaporation of ink even better than convertors.

 

As Sundragon pointed out, a CON-70 can be easily cleaned out using a blunt syringe loaded with water.  It does need to be periodically flushed clean, if continuing with the same in refill after refill.  I've had no troubles with my CON-70 filling up completely, in my Custom 845.  I have heard that CON-70 can loosen up and suffer efficiency loss.  I've never taken mine apart, but if it does have the ability to be tightened down, that may be required to restore full function.


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#24 sundragon

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Posted 07 June 2018 - 16:23

Ruth, are you dunking your Decimo with nib into the ink well? "I'm wiping more ink off the section than is actually going into the pen "  It sounds like you may be doing that... which could be the reason for your troubles.  You're supposed to remove the nib assembly from the pen and then submerge the nib up to the assembly shoulder for filling.  If you leave the assembly in the pen, it's doubtful you'll get a full refill.  Plus, the dunking gets ink inside the front part of the pen and, over time, compromise the seal of the trap door, thus permitting air entry and premature drying out of the nib.

 

I've found the best way to get a more satisfying ink supply is to refill a cartridge with a blunt syringe.  The original piston converter included with the pen loses a lot of capacity because of the long screw knob.

 

I concur with all of the above advice. The nib unit must be removed to properly fill or you'll get ink in the mechanism that retracts the nib unit and in the cover. Also, the blunt syringe method for filling has given me the best performance, you can push a little ink into the feed once it's filled and attached to prime the pen for writing.



#25 biancitwo

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 01:57

This is dissapointing. I am considering a Namiki and it comes with a CON70, and i do not user cartridges. Is the converter a dealbreaker?


No, it's not a deal breaker. I'm using cartridges, but I'm still enjoying the pens. Though I must admit wondering, why can't Pilot provide a piston filler like Pelikan. I love experiencing the feel and performance of different pens. But, I would prefer the reliability and capacity of a piston filler, or at least a converter that works, fills, and provides ink upon command. But, it's still not a deal breaker.

#26 Tseg

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 02:26

No, it's not a deal breaker. I'm using cartridges, but I'm still enjoying the pens. Though I must admit wondering, why can't Pilot provide a piston filler like Pelikan. I love experiencing the feel and performance of different pens. But, I would prefer the reliability and capacity of a piston filler, or at least a converter that works, fills, and provides ink upon command. But, it's still not a deal breaker.

 

Different strokes for different folks.  I have gravitated to converters or cartridge refill pens and syringe fill them because it keeps the whole process much more neat.  Not only do I not need to wipe down nibs but I keep my ink bottle caps and bottle necks clean so I don't get caps stuck to bottles with dried ink... Iroshizuku caps crack easily.  For my piston fill pens I typically 'decant' ink with a syringe into a small plastic fill cup from the bottle where I do the ink exchange with the pen... I just end up with more things to clean.  With the above said, I recently bought a snorkel fill Sheaffer Pen For Men and I'm in heaven with that filling mechanism, other than I'm sending it in for precautionary service tomorrow as I don't know when it was last serviced... the rubber sacs are generally good for 'only' 10-20 years and this is a nearly 60 year old pen.



#27 biancitwo

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 10:00

Different strokes for different folks.  I have gravitated to converters or cartridge refill pens and syringe fill them because it keeps the whole process much more neat. ...


My response was incomplete. I also refill the cartridges with a syringe. I would not give up the wide variety of bottled inks.

#28 inkstainedruth

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Posted 12 June 2018 - 19:03

Ruth, are you dunking your Decimo with nib into the ink well? "I'm wiping more ink off the section than is actually going into the pen "  It sounds like you may be doing that... which could be the reason for your troubles.  You're supposed to remove the nib assembly from the pen and then submerge the nib up to the assembly shoulder for filling.  If you leave the assembly in the pen, it's doubtful you'll get a full refill.  Plus, the dunking gets ink inside the front part of the pen and, over time, compromise the seal of the trap door, thus permitting air entry and premature drying out of the nib.

 

I've found the best way to get a more satisfying ink supply is to refill a cartridge with a blunt syringe.  The original piston converter included with the pen loses a lot of capacity because of the long screw knob.

 

No, I'm removing the nib assembly (I know better  ;)).  I meant the nib assembly shoulder, but I didn't have a better term).  

My assembly has a squeeze filler but I'm wondering if there's something wrong with the sac, or if the pen is drying out from the tip end of things.  Or if I'm just not getting a good fill (I have to dunk the assembly in pretty far in order to get to the breather hole).  And I'm wondering if I should be replacing the converter -- and if so, what size/model (the assembly is from a used Vanishing Point -- I swapped assemblies with the EF one that I ordered with the Decimo, gave my husband the VP and the EF assembly, and took the F assembly from the VP to put in the Decimo.  And am now wondering if that's the reason the used VP was so cheap (found it in a little antiques and collectible store for a third of the price of a new VP) and bought a new converter for that pen.  More recently the same booth in the store had a raden model VP for about $100 US lower than a new one would be, but I still couldn't afford it even then (plus the regular VPs are too heavy and awkward for me -- hence wanting the Decimo).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth


"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

#29 MYU

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 19:18

 

No, I'm removing the nib assembly (I know better  ;)).  I meant the nib assembly shoulder, but I didn't have a better term).  

My assembly has a squeeze filler but I'm wondering if there's something wrong with the sac, or if the pen is drying out from the tip end of things.  Or if I'm just not getting a good fill (I have to dunk the assembly in pretty far in order to get to the breather hole).  And I'm wondering if I should be replacing the converter -- and if so, what size/model (the assembly is from a used Vanishing Point -- I swapped assemblies with the EF one that I ordered with the Decimo, gave my husband the VP and the EF assembly, and took the F assembly from the VP to put in the Decimo.  And am now wondering if that's the reason the used VP was so cheap (found it in a little antiques and collectible store for a third of the price of a new VP) and bought a new converter for that pen.  More recently the same booth in the store had a raden model VP for about $100 US lower than a new one would be, but I still couldn't afford it even then (plus the regular VPs are too heavy and awkward for me -- hence wanting the Decimo).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

OK, I have a better understanding now after you explained it further. Did you thoroughly clean out the VP nib assembly after you got it used?  Because it's possible there's some dried ink the feed impeding proper flow.  It might need a good ultrasonic cleansing.

 

Do you have more than one CON-20?  Because what you could do is conduct a liquid holding test.  With the CON-20 mounted in a clean nib assembly, squeeze the CON-20 a few times and then release.  Then expel the contents into a vial or small container.  Try it again with another CON-20 and see if there are different results.  If you notice a difference, then swap the converters and see if the amount variance is consistent with the converters or with the nib assemblies.  In that way you'll know if you've got a deficient converter or if one nib assembly needs a thorough cleaning.


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#30 inkstainedruth

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Posted 15 June 2018 - 04:16

The nib assemblies for both pens were flushed well when I first got them.  The VP's was pretty clogged up: it took a lot of soaking (and was the unit which NOW is in the Decimo.)  But the Decimo was effectively a brand new pen -- it just got flushed with soapy water, followed with  then with distilled water.

I'm not sure at this point what converter actually comes as part of the nib assembly (the one which was in the VP box is a squeeze filler, which is of course what's now in the Decimo).  My husband may still be running on the cartridge (although I suspect the pen needs to be flushed again).   The nib assembly from the VP was also s squeeze filler; my husband might still have the original cartridge installed (which came attached onto  the nib assembly connected to the Decimo).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth


"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

#31 SpecTP

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Posted 15 June 2018 - 05:00

My VP's all use CON-20's. I don't know if they make them any more though.

 

I just looked through my accessories and used a CON40 converter and it works fine with the VP.


Edited by SpecTP, 15 June 2018 - 05:21.


#32 510wells

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Posted 16 June 2018 - 23:15

The problem(s) with the Con-70s is while filling them I get a lot of air bubbles in the ink reducing ink amount. Most of the inks I use do it pretty badly. Most of the Con-70s were bought about the same time, maybe bad batch, or?  

 

And the Con-40 was a step backwards in My opinion :-( And you really don't want to hear what I have to say about no longer making the Con-50. 


Edited by 510wells, 17 June 2018 - 01:52.

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#33 SpecTP

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 04:09

CON-50 is still sold on amazon and ebay.. so it's still available. I have a dozen of them. I don't find any issue with the CON40 either.



#34 minddance

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 06:45

The problem(s) with the Con-70s is while filling them I get a lot of air bubbles in the ink reducing ink amount. Most of the inks I use do it pretty badly. Most of the Con-70s were bought about the same time, maybe bad batch, or?  
 
And the Con-40 was a step backwards in My opinion :-( And you really don't want to hear what I have to say about no longer making the Con-50. 


It is not a bad batch: CON70 certainly produces alot of air bubbles.

#35 sundragon

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 16:57

The problem(s) with the Con-70s is while filling them I get a lot of air bubbles in the ink reducing ink amount. Most of the inks I use do it pretty badly. Most of the Con-70s were bought about the same time, maybe bad batch, or?  

 

And the Con-40 was a step backwards in My opinion :-( And you really don't want to hear what I have to say about no longer making the Con-50. 

 

Mine also get a lot of air bubbles but not with every ink. Some inks are more prone to bubbling up than others. If you can let the pen sit for a moment, the bubbles usually pop and you can finish the fill.


Edited by sundragon, 18 June 2018 - 16:57.


#36 letterByOwl

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 04:28

I fill the con70 with an ink syringe

#37 minddance

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Posted 01 August 2018 - 01:11

I syringe-fill cartridges.

Pilot Con40 and con70 are a big disappointment. CON40 barely sucks any ink if I dip nib into ink bottle to fill. CON70 is difficult to clean and produces alot of air bubbles, especially with Pilot own inks and some Iroshizuku.

#38 letterByOwl

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Posted 07 August 2018 - 02:19

I prefer to fill the Con 70 with an ink syringe too. It’s possible to fill it through the nib and feed but I didn’t have the patience for it. Every button press just increased the chances of me making a mess.

#39 bizhe

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Posted 07 August 2018 - 02:55

My con-70 is ok. Quick presses on the button to fill, slow pumps to expel ink. I clean it by removing the converter, add water, shake, add new water, let sit vertically (hole up) for a couple hours, shake some more, etc.



#40 galeos

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Posted 13 August 2018 - 03:15

 

I have gravitated to converters or cartridge refill pens and syringe fill them because it keeps the whole process much more neat.

 

I've also gone this route; it's better in every way.  And if you use pipettes instead, you don't have to constantly explain to people what you're doing with a big syringe.







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