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Hero 232 And Pelikan Blue-Black Mini-Comparison

hero 232 pelikan 4001 blue-black comparison shading indigo ink china

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#1 TruthPil

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Posted 17 April 2018 - 15:03

Hello again to all my FPN friends,

 

I happened to have 2 pens of similar flow and nib size inked with these and thought it might be helpful to compare them.

Both are iron-gall inks and somewhat similar in color. However, at least in my experience, Hero 232 is much drier than Pelikan 4001 Blue-Black.

It's so dry that it stopped flowing at all in the pen I used for this comparison once the converter wasn't completely full. The dryness may be due to high iron gall content. I assume this because when I flushed the pen, there was a notable strong smell of fresh blood that I've only experienced before with the super-charged iron gall ink ESSRI. Hero 232 usually has the same smell many other Chinese inks, as well as Pilot Blue-Black, but when mixed with water in the sink the iron smell took over. So all you vampires out there will probably enjoy Hero 232. 

 

General observations:

- The Hero is drier than the Pelikan.

- The Hero is darker and more saturated than the Pelikan.

- The Pelikan shades easier than the Hero.

- The Hero can produce a nice, deep indigo when fully saturated, slightly reminiscent of my favorite Kung Te-Chung.

- In China, the Hero is one tenth the price of the Pelikan. 

- Both are iron gall inks, but not so much as to harm your pens or leave sediment behind.

- On absorbent paper, both are almost completely waterproof. The Hero looked completely unchanged, but some slight fading with the Pelikan.

- Both are great inks if you have wet pens.

 

The pen used for the Hero 232 writing is a Pelikan P30 with soft 14k broad nib.

The pen used for Pelikan Blue-Black writing is an ebonite FPR Himalaya fitted with an extremely flexible steel Artus/Degussa oblique broad ("BS") nib and feed.

 

I just scribbled this out on a cheap notepad, so I don't know how different they would look on better papers like TR or Rhodia.

 

fpn_1523976839__hero_232_pelikan_bb_comp

 

Comparison Close-ups:

 

fpn_1523977108__hero_232_pelikan_bb_comp

 

fpn_1523977153__hero_232_pelikan_bb_comp

 

Hero 232 Close-up:

 

fpn_1523977214__hero_232_sample.jpg

 

Pelikan 4001 Blue-Black Close-ups:

 

fpn_1523977256__pelikan_bb_sample_1.jpg

 

fpn_1523977295__pelikan_bb_sample_2.jpg

 

 

 

 

 


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#2 Mech-for-i

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Posted 18 April 2018 - 17:56

Leave it for another 10 days to a couple of weeks and you will see that they will turn black alright, the Pelikan not so much but the 232 definitely. Despite Hero never bother to market the 232 as an archival ink it serve the purpose well enough. I really like their 234 Carbon Black ( which is their official archival ink ) for using in calligraphy but well, day to day use of that thick black carbon can be troublesome if not being careful with the pen. I've since return to using IG ink for document and am currently experimenting with various different one. The 232, the Bai Yuan 760, the R&K Salix all gone down the better ones. Lamy and Montblanc o longer do IG with their Blue Black, and the Pelikan IMHO had been a bit low on the IG part.



#3 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 18 April 2018 - 18:07

Any good, BB ink will change colors to darker. Richard Binder said one often had to wait a day.

With ESSR, depending on the paper, it could be a day to 5.

One could expect a less saturated ink to shade better.

I just  put Pelikan BB in a regular flex F Pelikan pen, the first time I'd used a BB in well over a year.

 

Grumble, having just looked at the pictures.....could have inked a semi-flex.

 

I don't think Pelikan BB is IG any more.....could be wrong.


Edited by Bo Bo Olson, 18 April 2018 - 18:08.

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

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#4 lapis

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Posted 18 April 2018 - 18:56

Pelikan's 4001 BB of today is now officially an IG ink. The whole story goes somewhat like this:

  • Prior to about 2013, Pelikan in Hanover told me that that ink up to about 27 years earlier was indeed an IG ink.
  • Our Good Captain posted a photo of his own gem (I think a 62.5-ml bottle) where it could be plainly read on the label that that was, yes, an IG ink.
  • Nonetheless, at the time of my phone call with Hanover (in about 2013), I was told that it was no longer an IG ink (since 27 years earlier).
  • But about 1-2 years ago, somebody else (in the US, I think) posted a thread here in FPN revealing that a real, authentic Pelikan website page indeed showed that it (the 4001 BB) it is in fact, today, an IG ink, however little the concentration of IG today may be, at least in comparison to the old/original concentration of IG.

Whew!


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#5 TruthPil

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Posted 19 April 2018 - 01:12

Leave it for another 10 days to a couple of weeks and you will see that they will turn black alright, the Pelikan not so much but the 232 definitely. Despite Hero never bother to market the 232 as an archival ink it serve the purpose well enough. I really like their 234 Carbon Black ( which is their official archival ink ) for using in calligraphy but well, day to day use of that thick black carbon can be troublesome if not being careful with the pen. I've since return to using IG ink for document and am currently experimenting with various different one. The 232, the Bai Yuan 760, the R&K Salix all gone down the better ones. Lamy and Montblanc o longer do IG with their Blue Black, and the Pelikan IMHO had been a bit low on the IG part.

I just checked a writing sample of 232 I wrote on clairefontaine paper three months ago. While the most saturated parts of the line indeed turned black, the lighter areas cured to a nice blue-grey (exactly what I had hoped that ESSRI would do). So there is definitely enough blue dye in the ink to retain some blue. It's quite lovely!

Hero 232 is really growing on me, but I need to find out which pens it works best in. It actually stopped flowing completely in one of my otherwise wet writers. Does anyone have any favorite pens to use with this ink?

I did a water test last night and will post results as soon as I can.

UPDATE: Nevermind what I said about Hero 232 being too dry. The issue was with the pens I tried it in. I've got it flowing marvelously in a MB 145 at the moment. Ironically, it flows better in this pen than any Montblanc ink I've tried in it.

Edited by TruthPil, 19 April 2018 - 23:58.

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#6 TSherbs

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Posted 19 April 2018 - 01:32

I just checked a writing sample of 232 I wrote on clairefontaine paper three months ago. While the most saturated parts of the line indeed turned black, the lighter areas cured to a nice blue-grey (exactly what I had hoped that ESSRI would do). So there is definitely enough blue dye in the ink to retain some blue. It's quite lovely!

Hero 232 is really growing on me, but I need to find out which pens it works best in. It actually stopped flowing completely in one of my otherwise wet writers. Does anyone have any favorite pens to use with this ink?

I did a water test last night and will post results as soon as I can.

 

Jinhao 992 for my Hero 232

 

10-4



#7 Tweel

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Posted 19 April 2018 - 01:46

I can't remember what pen I used 232 in.  It might have been a Waterman Harmonie, but in any case it didn't strike me as being a dry ink, so keep looking and you'll find the right pen.


fpn_1375035941__postcard_swap.png * * * "Don't neglect to write me several times from different places when you may."
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#8 Mech-for-i

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Posted 19 April 2018 - 04:10

....

Hero 232 is really growing on me, but I need to find out which pens it works best in. It actually stopped flowing completely in one of my otherwise wet writers. Does anyone have any favorite pens to use with this ink?

I did a water test last night and will post results as soon as I can.

 

Interesting for decades I've been using this ink and had no issue with it drying out unless the pen is not sealed well ; I've used it in numerous pens from Hero's own 616 to Montblanc 146 and all in between and result and performance is pretty consistent. Currently I had on my PenBBS 308 with the standard F nib inked with this. I intend to try this on the Wing Sung 601 after and when I got finished modding it with a Caligraphy nib


Edited by Mech-for-i, 19 April 2018 - 04:11.


#9 TruthPil

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Posted 19 April 2018 - 12:20

 
Jinhao 992 for my Hero 232
 
10-4

 
Thanks, my 992 is kind of dead, but the 991 has the same nib so I'll give that a shot.
 

I can't remember what pen I used 232 in.  It might have been a Waterman Harmonie, but in any case it didn't strike me as being a dry ink, so keep looking and you'll find the right pen.

 

 
Interesting for decades I've been using this ink and had no issue with it drying out unless the pen is not sealed well ; I've used it in numerous pens from Hero's own 616 to Montblanc 146 and all in between and result and performance is pretty consistent. Currently I had on my PenBBS 308 with the standard F nib inked with this. I intend to try this on the Wing Sung 601 after and when I got finished modding it with a Caligraphy nib

 
Yeah, I think I might have just had a bad combination this time around. I may have to try the 308 with goulet 1.1 stub for 232. Looking forward to some nice indigo shading with that combination!


Yep...it was a pen problem. Thanks for mentioning your 146. It motivated me to get out my long neglected 145 that I could never get to write to my liking. Now I can't say that anymore. Hero 232 may stay in this pen forever.

Edited by TruthPil, 20 April 2018 - 01:35.

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#10 TruthPil

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 05:04

Hero 232 is definitely more waterproof than Pelikan 4001.
I just swiped a wet hand down an entire page of notes I wrote with 232 last week and there wasn't even the slightest smearing or lifting of ink. Truly waterproof!

I've also had a writing sample on the window sill for a couple weeks and it hasn't faded one bit.

Hero 232 is a great ink!!

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#11 TSherbs

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 10:21

Hero 232 is definitely more waterproof than Pelikan 4001.
I just swiped a wet hand down an entire page of notes I wrote with 232 last week and there wasn't even the slightest smearing or lifting of ink. Truly waterproof!

I've also had a writing sample on the window sill for a couple weeks and it hasn't faded one bit.

Hero 232 is a great ink!!

 

been my favorite blue-black for two years

 

Diamine Denim is second, but that is a very different, non-permanent ink



#12 RG_VII

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 13:01

Leave it for another 10 days to a couple of weeks and you will see that they will turn black alright, the Pelikan not so much but the 232 definitely. Despite Hero never bother to market the 232 as an archival ink it serve the purpose well enough. I really like their 234 Carbon Black ( which is their official archival ink ) for using in calligraphy but well, day to day use of that thick black carbon can be troublesome if not being careful with the pen. I've since return to using IG ink for document and am currently experimenting with various different one. The 232, the Bai Yuan 760, the R&K Salix all gone down the better ones. Lamy and Montblanc o longer do IG with their Blue Black, and the Pelikan IMHO had been a bit low on the IG part.

 

Mech-for-i, do you have any link to this Bai Yuan 760 ink?  I tried searching for it on google and I found nothing.  I am collecting fountain pen blue-black iron gall inks (or at least trying to).  Thank you in advance.



#13 TSherbs

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 15:17

TruthPil, any chance that you could post some photos of these samples from today to follow up with how the colors age over time?



#14 TruthPil

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 15:43

TSherbs, Thanks for reminding me about this. I just dug out the paper and will take a picture as soon as there is decent sunlight.

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#15 TSherbs

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Posted 07 October 2018 - 17:12

TSherbs, Thanks for reminding me about this. I just dug out the paper and will take a picture as soon as there is decent sunlight.

 

:thumbup:



#16 Mech-for-i

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Posted 09 October 2018 - 07:07



 

Mech-for-i, do you have any link to this Bai Yuan 760 ink?  I tried searching for it on google and I found nothing.  I am collecting fountain pen blue-black iron gall inks (or at least trying to).  Thank you in advance.

 

I am not aware of its selling anywhere outside of its home market ( in fact most are sold in its home province only and now online ), the Bai Yun 760 had been and is always, almost never sold in stationary supply but its marketed towards office supply and termed a document ink. It literally turn black right in front of your eyes when writing.

 

Anyway the new production of these ink cost roughly 10RMB- ( or 1.5US$ ) for the 48ml, it can be had on Taobao and many of China's online retail channel. I have no idea if anyone ever sell it on oversea channel .. but you can goto TaoBao and hand in search for " 白云蓝黑墨水 " or " 白云760蓝黑墨水 " .. and for your ref this is how it look like ... and if you at all effort can't locate a retail that can sell you one, you can message me direct .. I have these in stock ( literally cause I usually buy in pack of 10 and had stock at home ) and might be I can send you a couple ( now if Mail allow me to do that , I'll have to check though )

 

fpn_1539068622__bai-yun-760.jpg


Edited by Mech-for-i, 09 October 2018 - 15:35.


#17 TruthPil

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Posted 09 October 2018 - 09:32

Sounds like something I should get a bottle of before moving off the mainland. So is it a really heavy bore IG?


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#18 Mech-for-i

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Posted 09 October 2018 - 15:33

instead of heavy IG its more like fast reacting IG instead .. this ink had been around for decades ( like since the 60's ) and not like its having any record eating up nibs or paper, the other similar and equally vintage ink still on the market is the Green Leaf blue black and having similar performance



#19 TruthPil

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Posted 21 October 2018 - 11:49

TruthPil, any chance that you could post some photos of these samples from today to follow up with how the colors age over time?

 

Here are photos I took today, which is a little over 6 months after these samples were first photographed.

The reason the paper looks weird and worn is because I had completed soaked the paper in water to do an immersion test and then let it dry out.

Pelikan faded more in the immersion test than the Hero did, undoubtedly due to Hero 232's very high IG content.

 

fpn_1540122215__hero_232_pelikan_bb_6_mo

 

Looking at the paper now, I'm very pleased that the Hero retained a decent amount of the original blue. It's still really blue black whereas Pelikan became more like a purple-tinged grey. 

 

fpn_1540122471__hero_232_pelikan_bb_6_mo

 

Who'd have thought that an ink that cost under US$1 in its home country would perform so well! 


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#20 TSherbs

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Posted 21 October 2018 - 12:04

Awesome follow up. Thanks.

I have long been a fan of 232, but its price has gone up some on eBay (only way I can get it).





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: hero, 232, pelikan, 4001, blue-black, comparison, shading, indigo, ink, china



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