Additive To Make Inks Flow Better...?

[TheDutchGuy]

Several times I've come across comments on FPN where someone said: "I added a few drops of product x to my ink and presto: wonderful flow". But of course if I search for it, I can't find it. Can someone please remind me of this product and any pros/cons of using it?

 

Thanks!

[Chrissy]

The only two products I know of that will do this are Kodak Photo Flo and Organics Studio Flo Plus.

 

Warning: One drop is usually far too much for a whole 50ml or 60ml ink bottle. It can make the ink drip out of your pen nibs into your caps. The best way to use it is to dip a cocktail stick into it, wipe most of it off, then stir the ink with the barely damp stick.

 

Proprietary inks already have flow enhancers in there. They are also what make ink foam if you shake a bottle. Some inks feel dryer than others. Before you consider adding anything to your current ink, it's worth trying a different brand that is known to be wet. Japanese inks are usually wetter. Pelikan 4001 inks tend to be dryer.

[TheDutchGuy]

The only two products I know of that will do this are Kodak Photo Flo and Organics Studio Flo Plus.

 

Warning: One drop is usually far too much for a whole 50ml or 60ml ink bottle. It can make the ink drip out of your pen nibs into your caps. The best way to use it is to dip a cocktail stick into it, wipe most of it off, then stir the ink with the barely damp stick.

 

Proprietary inks already have flow enhancers in there. They are also what make ink foam if you shake a bottle. Some inks feel dryer than others. Before you consider adding anything to your current ink, it's worth trying a different brand that is known to be wet. Japanese inks are usually wetter. Pelikan 4001 inks tend to be dryer.

Thanks! I've now got a pen where trying different inks didn't lead to the desired result. The feed has more than enough buffer capacity but doesn't get enough ink from the converter to do its job. I don't want to physically alter the pen unless I have to, so for this pen I need really wet inks. I've got such an ink, but would also like to use other inks in this pen.

[lgsoltek]

What Chrissy said. But you could also use (diluted) dish soap.

[Maurizio]

I juice up all of my inks with a drop of glycerin and Liquitex Flow Aid as I described in this post:

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/321641-shocking-ink-adulteration/

 

 

 

 

I apologize for the absence of photos. I had to clean out my "photo que" on the FPN a couple of weeks ago in order to attach more photos to newer posts. You can see the Liquitex Flow Aid by just googling the name. Glycerin is widely available and can be found at health food stores and pharmacies. Just make sure you're using 100% glycerin not glycerin adulterated with anything else.

Edited March 19, 2018 by Maurizio

[ReadyFireAim]

Had a lot of problems with PhotoFlo.

(and I have a free, almost full bottle of it if someone wants to pay shipping)

 

Glad I tried Liquitex because that stuff is wonderful.

I've used as much as 1 drop per 5 milliliters without much negative effect.

A tiny bit of PhotoFlo will make ink bleed & feather so that it is useless.

 

Liquitex even works with some iron gall inks.

Edited March 19, 2018 by Nail-Bender

[Torrilin]

Which pen? And how does it handle plain water? The reason I ask is because most pens will let water drip out of the feed more or less steadily. And plain water flows LESS well than the average ink. So if water definitely isn’t flowing, there’s a problem.

 

The other thing I’d check is the nib. A nib can seem ok visually but still be so tight it can’t take a brass shim through the tines without some help.

[TheDutchGuy]

Thanks everyone. I will try the glycerine first - might take a few days. To be continued!

[Maurizio]

Hi Dutch Guy.

 

I don't mean to be presumptuous, but did you read my prior post about shocking ink adulteration? Only reason I ask is that I do note there that the addition of glycerin will increase the drying time of your ink (I just realized that the older post has a serious typo; glycerin does not reduce dry time, it definitely increases it); this effect is, of course, contingent on several factors: the brand of ink, the type of paper you use, and your local climatic conditions, etc. Glycerin will also subtly darken the color of your ink; again, the effect varies. Glycerin is a great additive, but I just want to be clear that those who want to add it to their ink are aware of its effects so you're pleased at the result and not back here grumbling about a bad advice. Use it incrementally and sparingly until you get an idea of how it affects your ink according to your local conditions.

 

Have fun!

Edited March 19, 2018 by Maurizio

[TheDutchGuy]

Thanks, Maurizio! As a former chemistry teacher, I'd already spotted the typo regarding drying time. Anyway, as it turns out there was a small bottle of glycerine in the house which saved me a trip to the chemist. I took some ink out of my bottle of Robert Oster Fire & Ice (my favourite ink), transferred it to an empty bottle, added a touch go glycerine, shook it and left it for half an hour. During that time I cleaned, flushed and dried my pen and converter. Then I inked it by filling the converter directly from the bottle and then fitting it into the pen. This prevents flooding of the feed from dipping it into the bottle, so it will honestly tell me if the flow from converter to feed has improved, without first having to write the feed buffer dry. The first impression: big difference. I only used a little bit of glycerine. Drying time did not noticeably increase. Flow increased nicely, as did lubrication. No feathering, at least not on proper paper. The colour of the ink is still lighter than in wetter pens, but those pens have either medium nibs or stub nibs and are quite wet, whereas the pen I'm using the glycerine with has a F nib and is quite dry. So there's little sheen and not so much shading, but a significant improvement. I will postpone final judgement for a few days, just to be sure that it's not a temporary feed-flood effect.

 

So far, so good!

[ReadyFireAim]

Thanks everyone. I will try the glycerine first - might take a few days. To be continued!

 

Glycerine will make the nib feel more slippery but will not effect wetness (may increase drying time a little)

Distilled water makes ink drier & Liquitex makes it wetter.

PhotoFlow makes a mess.

[Chrissy]

 

PhotoFlow makes a mess.

 

That it does.

[minddance]

One has to be very careful with Kodak Photoflo and not add too much of it. Very often, 'a little' can be too much.

Edited March 19, 2018 by minddance

[bobs51]

For those experimenting with PhotoFlo to lubricate their inks... remember that the recommendation for use in photo developing (after wash, to help prevent water spots) was that the stock in the bottle be diluted 1:200 before use. Some use an even greater dilution.

 

So before adding this to your inks, dilute; distilled water is probably best. Or try the "dip the tip of a toothpick" trick. Or dip your toothpick in the diluted solution.

 

A little bit goes a long way.

 

It's available from your local camera store (almost as hard to find as a pen store) or by mail order from B&H, Adorama, and others.

[minddance]

So far, I have not experienced problems woth Kodak Photoflo by dipping a toothpick into it to smear the convertor. Inks that do not really require Photoflo are Iroshizuku and Sailor Jentle, this could be a case of 'a little is too much', unless one writes with an extremely dry pen on heavy papers.

 

It can change the look (and sometimes colour) of the ink on paper, a mid-light blue would turn out darker, some shading and subtle tones might be lost if no water is added. Or a purplish blue might lean more purple or more blue.

 

Whether inks really 'need' surfactants is arguable. Afterall, tastes, actual conditions and needs differ

Edited March 20, 2018 by minddance

[TheDutchGuy]

Glycerine will make the nib feel more slippery but will not effect wetness (may increase drying time a little).

The morning after glycerine: the slippery-ness is definitely noticeable, but not in a bad way. Quite pleasant. Wetness definitely improved, and then some. Very pleasant. On the next batch I will use even less glycerine. So far, so good. Great tip.

Edited March 20, 2018 by TheDutchGuy

[Maurizio]

The morning after glycerine: the slippery-ness is definitely noticeable, but not in a bad way. Quite pleasant. Wetness definitely improved, and then some. Very pleasant. On the next batch I will use even less glycerine. So far, so good. Great tip.

I’m pleased to hear this is working for you Dutchguy.

[TheDutchGuy]

For sure. It turned a very dry pen into a juicy one. The nib is wonderful, so now that the pen isn't running on fumes anymore it really is a pleasure to use. Plus, all the shading and sheening of my favourite ink is back.

[ReadyFireAim]

It turned a very dry pen into a juicy one.

 

Interesting

I shall keep that in mind.

[Maurizio]

In the post I did last June about using glycerin and Liquitex I noted that ink makers are very tight-lipped about their proprietary ink ingredients and I asked if anyone who worked in that field could comment about whether glycerin is an ingredient in some modern inks. My intuition and rational thought leads me to conclude that its highly likely that glycerin in some form is a component of at least some modern inks because it works, it is relatively inexpensive, and its effects are benign.

I asked last year (no one answered) so I'll ask again: is there anyone reading here who has experience in the ink or dye industry who can give us any insight whether glycerin is indeed an ingredient in modern inks?

Edited March 20, 2018 by Maurizio