Waterman Patrician 1930

[penjog]

Hello,

 

I'm Hansjürgen an I live in Germany. A friend of mine suggested to ask here my question.

 

I found a Waterman Patrician in a - for me - unknown colour.

It is a dull brown, like ebonit (BHR). But it isn't hard rubber.

 

Is it the Jet? Or an other variation of the Patrician?

 

I try to add pictures.

 

I would be glad to get informativ answers.

 

Hansjürgen

Edited February 21, 2018 by penjog

[penjog]

Hello,

 

I would like to add a notice:

 

I need an cap to the Waterman Patrician, because the original one, doesn't work exactly. The thread is damaged.

 

In Germany you cannot find it. So if someone will sell such a cap to me, please send me a notice.

 

Hansjürgen

[Left FPN]

The cap clip appears unusual (out of place) for a Patrician.

 

Are there any other holes in the cap other than 3 or 4 breather holes around. Are there 2 holes or 1 long hole higher up that run axial about 5mm apart. If so this indicates the original clip was lost and a later model (maybe Emblem or 100 year) added.

 

Something akin to this,

 

 

 

 

I might also suggest it was or is a Black BHR that has had a water soaking.

 

But then again what do I know about old pens.

[penjog]

O, thank you. What you wrote is helpfull.

 

Now I know, there are Black Hard Rubber (BHR) Patricians from the late 20th. I didn't know that until now. What's their name? Also Patrician?

So I will be cautious to put the BHR in water to solve the grip section from the barel.

 

Yes there are in the cap serveral breather holes and one higher up, like in the picture. I can't add here a detailed photo.

 

But the missing clip is not the main problem. That are the cracks at the end of the cap and that the screw doesn't work properly. You can screw in the cap only about 30°, like it would be an other winding at cap and barrel.

 

Can you say me something about Emblem or 100year Waterman. Maybe the cap (with doric band?) is from such a Pen?

 

Do you have a cap to sell?

 

Excuse my stumbling english - I'm not used to express detailed in english.

 

Hansjürgen

[Left FPN]

The cap is Patrician. The clip from elsewhere.

 

Sorry I sold my Patrician parts a few years ago because the missing parts could not be sourced.

[penjog]

O, what a pity! I would have been a buyer.

 

May be I'm also forced to sell it.

 

But in the moment I hope, there will be a collector, who will sell me a cap.

[Left FPN]

Don't hold your breath.

 

Mine was missing its cap band and feed which were impossible to source. It went to an FPN member who had the resources to repair it.

[penjog]

Hello,

 

you are an expert collector, aren'you?

I'm not an expert, but a fan of interesting pens, like Waterman Patrician, BHR and love handwriting with it

.

After purchasing an Patrician celluloid it forced me to bit on the BHR and surprisingly I won. The pen is ok, but the cap is in a bad condition.

 

In Germany we have also professionals, who can repair, but they have no time or don't like to repair an old Cap with fissures.

I suppose, the risk is too high for them.

 

So I'm a little bit helpless in the moment. Friends said to me, go in FPN USA, the native country of Waterman. Perhaps there is a possiblility to get a cap or to get a repair.

 

Could you give me an adress of penrepair for this pen?

 

Greetings Hansjürgen

 

btw, how will I manage it to get an information, if there is an answer to my post?

[Left FPN]

Hello,

 

you are an expert collector, aren'you?

I'm not an expert, but a fan of interesting pens, like Waterman Patrician, BHR and love handwriting with it

.

After purchasing an Patrician celluloid it forced me to bit on the BHR and surprisingly I won. The pen is ok, but the cap is in a bad condition.

 

In Germany we have also professionals, who can repair, but they have no time or don't like to repair an old Cap with fissures.

I suppose, the risk is too high for them.

 

So I'm a little bit helpless in the moment. Friends said to me, go in FPN USA, the native country of Waterman. Perhaps there is a possiblility to get a cap or to get a repair.

 

Could you give me an adress of penrepair for this pen?

 

Greetings Hansjürgen

 

btw, how will I manage it to get an information, if there is an answer to my post?

No, I am no expert or collector of these.

 

If you did find another cap you would have another problem...it most surely would not match. Now that would bug me more than living with it as is.

 

Perhaps you are better to live with it as is maybe just having it serviced to ensure all is well otherwise.

 

If you go to the top of this topic select Follow this topic and you will receive emails when someone adds to it.

[crescentfiller]

OP. Possibly the easiest and least costly solution would be to have the cap lip replaced and to live with the clip as it is. (However, you could look for a Patrician pencil--the clips are the same.) With the wide cap band, you would not see the seem where the new lip was applied. It is done all the time.

 

Ask for repairers who can do this in the Repair forum.

 

Good luck!

[penjog]

No, I am no expert or collector of these.

 

If you did find another cap you would have another problem...it most surely would not match. Now that would bug me more than living with it as is.

 

Perhaps you are better to live with it as is maybe just having it serviced to ensure all is well otherwise.

 

If you go to the top of this topic select Follow this topic and you will receive emails when someone adds to it.

 

Thank you for your hints.

Why an other cap perhaps would not match?

 

Hansjürgen

[penjog]

OP. Possibly the easiest and least costly solution would be to have the cap lip replaced and to live with the clip as it is. (However, you could look for a Patrician pencil--the clips are the same.) With the wide cap band, you would not see the seem where the new lip was applied. It is done all the time.

 

Ask for repairers who can do this in the Repair forum.

 

Good luck!

 

I asked for that. But the fissures go under the band - and that the asked would not risk to make a new cap lip.

Further the cap doesn't fit really to the barrel. You can twist only a few degrees and than it stops hard.

And third, the clip isn't original. May be there is a connection between the problems.

 

Ok - that are the adventures with old pens. I'll live with it.

But if someone can help me, I would be grateful.

 

Hansjürgen

[penjog]

The cap clip appears unusual (out of place) for a Patrician.

 

Are there any other holes in the cap other than 3 or 4 breather holes around. Are there 2 holes or 1 long hole higher up that run axial about 5mm apart. If so this indicates the original clip was lost and a later model (maybe Emblem or 100 year) added.

 

Something akin to this,

 

DamagedPatCap2.JPG

 

 

I might also suggest it was or is a Black BHR that has had a water soaking.

 

But then again what do I know about old pens.

 

 

You are right, it is a BHR( from the early 20th ??) and the hard rubber has got (is that right?) old and brown in the years without care.

 

I have polished it a long time by hand and wet micro-mesh 2400 - 8000 and than oiled with Nelkenöl (its similar to Balistol).

Now it looks better. But I have to continue polishing to make it totaly black.

 

I was sucessfully in separating section and barrel. I put it in 78° C warm water for 5 min. That worked. The schellack melted.

 

Now it's only a problem with the cap.

I got offers of repair in GB, a clip and a retail cap from Italy. I hope it will fit.

 

Thanks to the forists in FPN !

 

Hansjürgen

[penjog]

Hello,

 

I wanted to report briefly on the restoration of my Waterman Patrician BHR, to which I had asked for help here.

This is what the pen looked like after it arrived at me:

 

 

It was clear, that the clip was not original. The same goes for the fact, that the filler has to be polished to make it look black again.

What you didn't see, is that the cap thread doesn't grip anymore and that the cracks in the cap lip went so far away under the gold band that you couldn't remove the lip and replace the brittle part.

 

So I went looking for a new cap. I had been sucessfull. I could purchased cheaply a cap in ebay .

 

I could see, that the cap lip has been renewed.

The photo in ebay only show the gold band at the cap and the cap lip. What wasn't shown in the ebay picture: The cover and the clip are missing.

Maybe therefore I was sucessfull to purchase it. No other buyer bit on this cap.

Fortunately, the thread cap was ok.

 

 

Now I contacted Francis. He immediately offered, to equip the celluloid cap with a cover and a matching clip,

He filled the original mounting hole with celluloid and covered everything (except the cap lip) with black celluloid.

Now the cap was restored.

Then I polished the filler with micromesh. It's been a long process.

Now he looks beautiful again and I'm pleased.

 

 

The fact that the cap and barrel are made of different materials is probably not so rare in history of pens.
In my opinion the clip is suitable, even if it is no longer original.

 

Fortunately, the fountain pen itself was quite all right. After I had separated the shellac-glued section from the barrel, I only had to replace the ink sac. Naturaly the nib is still the star - it writes incredibly well and comfortably, enormously gently. Only because of the nib, I pulled through the whole action.

Thanks to Francis and all forists, who helped me by hints.

 

Hansjürgen

[Left FPN]

Great job both of you.