Jump to content

The Fountain Pen Network uses (functional) cookies. Read the FPN Privacy Policy for more info.  To remove this message, please click here to accept the use of cookies






Photo

Esterbrook Dip Pens For Everyday Writing


  • Please log in to reply
44 replies to this topic

#1 corgicoupe

corgicoupe

    Collectors Item

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,397 posts
  • Location:East of Atlanta
  • Flag:

Posted 11 February 2018 - 19:29

There are a number of Esterbrook Penholders illustrated in Paul Hoban's book, "The Fountain Pens of Esterbrook" and this forum is almost entirely about fountain pens. However, I recently got interested in dip pens and pen holders when given a vintage agate and brass penholder with an Esterbrook #314 nib. I had recently purchased an Estie fountain pen with a 9314-M nib which I found to write nicely, so I tried the dip pen with the 314 and discovered it wrote as well as the 9314. Having made about 50 fountain pen kits and having tired of the limited creativity they afforded and the cost of the kits, I played with the idea of kitless pens, which on these forums have done, but realized it was going to require a major investment in equipment and time to learn to use a metal lathe for turning, I set that idea aside and decided to turn a few dip pen holders. I bought a half dozen #314 bronze nibs and 10 penholder inserts, and this is what I produced.

 

fpn_1518376709__img_0820s.jpg

 

fpn_1518376883__img_0819cs.jpg

 

The Rosewood pen has an Esterbrook 442 nib, much like the 2442 FP nib; the Gabon Ebony pen has a Blackstone 284 nib, like a 9284 Signature Stub; and the Zebrawood pen has the 314 Relief nib, like the 2314 or 9314 nibs, probably F or M.

 

I'm wondering if any of you have delved into the world of dip pens and Esterbrook pen nibs, and if so what nibs and inks do you find give the most pleasure. I limit the question to Esterbrook nibs solely because this is an Esterbrook forum.

 

 


Baptiste knew how to make a short job long

For love of it. And yet not waste time either.

                                                         Robert Frost


Sponsored Content

#2 AAAndrew

AAAndrew

    (Not so) Wee Timorous Beastie

  • FPN Supporter - Rhodium

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,605 posts
  • Location:Durham, NC
  • Flag:

Posted 12 February 2018 - 00:05

The 556 is a good, every-day writer. Others I like a lot include, in no particular order,
453 Business and College. Big but flexible and very durable
761 Natural Slant. Very nice Fine, semi-flex, great for correspondence
531 Flyer. A small spoon pen with pinched waist and turned up tip. Very smooth, some flex, holds a lot of ink
14 Bank Pen. Charles Schultz used the Radio version of this pen to draw all of the Peanuts comics. Long, medium fine and firm-flex.
128 extra fine elastic. Great for decorative writing

There are so many. These are just a few


Edited by AAAndrew, 12 February 2018 - 18:58.


“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928



Check out my Steel Pen Blog


"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne


#3 PaFitch

PaFitch

    Vintage

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 482 posts
  • Location:Michigan
  • Flag:

Posted 12 February 2018 - 17:35

Nice work!



#4 corgicoupe

corgicoupe

    Collectors Item

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,397 posts
  • Location:East of Atlanta
  • Flag:

Posted 13 February 2018 - 02:06

Thank you. I appreciate your comment. I want to make one minor change in the design and will post an image when I feel it's right.

Baptiste knew how to make a short job long

For love of it. And yet not waste time either.

                                                         Robert Frost


#5 _InkyFingers

_InkyFingers

    Antique

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,548 posts
  • Location:San Jose, CA USA
  • Flag:

Posted 14 February 2018 - 06:06

40213241732_5c4cbed65a_n.jpg

 

I need a 913 to compare to...Have anyone tried to mount a 313 or 913 912 on a FP?



#6 AAAndrew

AAAndrew

    (Not so) Wee Timorous Beastie

  • FPN Supporter - Rhodium

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,605 posts
  • Location:Durham, NC
  • Flag:

Posted 14 February 2018 - 15:35

The 9xx pens of Esterbrook are the same as the originals, but just with the silver-alloy “Radio” coating.

 

Most manufacturers had their silvery versions. Hunt just puts an “X” before the original number, so the 64 becomes the X-64.  Others called their's the Silverine, or Neva-Rust or whatever marketing name they came up with. It does seem to confer some degree of rust inhibition over the straight metal, at least for the Esterbrook’s, but it doesn’t impact performance at all. 

 

Charles Schultz used the 914 for all of his Peanuts comic strips, and so the 914's are difficult to find, and more expensive when you do. But the 14 Bank pen is the exact same kind of pen, and you can sometimes find quite early ones, which are of much better quality, for cheaper just because they don't have the coating. 

 

And American Civil War historian Shelby Foote was fond of the 313 Probate. That's the pen he used to write all 3000+ pages of his giant Civil War tome. The 313 is a fairly broad stub pen, and you can see it in a page of his manuscript notes. 

 

fpn_1518622504__foote-s.gif



“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928



Check out my Steel Pen Blog


"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne


#7 _InkyFingers

_InkyFingers

    Antique

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,548 posts
  • Location:San Jose, CA USA
  • Flag:

Posted 14 February 2018 - 15:49

You think I will be a famoust writer if I buy all the Probate 313?

Happy Valentine Feast
38448325700_7297bbbd1a_b.jpg

#8 Cane

Cane

    NOS (New Old Stock)

  • Member - Silver

  • PipPip
  • 24 posts

Posted 15 November 2018 - 18:03

I am about to buy a couple of Esterbrook nibs, but I whould like to know what the difference is, between the "natural slant" versions and the regular ones? Is it a compensation for those that hold the pen in an unnatural angle (but then it is called "natural"...)?

#9 corgicoupe

corgicoupe

    Collectors Item

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,397 posts
  • Location:East of Atlanta
  • Flag:

Posted 16 November 2018 - 00:18

If you are looking for "natural" line variation rather than "spreading tine" variation, I would suggest the 442, which is cut straight across, and the 314, which is an oblique nib. But I would certainly defer to Andrew.


Baptiste knew how to make a short job long

For love of it. And yet not waste time either.

                                                         Robert Frost


#10 pajaro

pajaro

    Amblin along like I had good sense.

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11,946 posts
  • Location:Tecumseh, MI
  • Flag:

Posted 16 November 2018 - 01:16

You think I will be a famoust writer if I buy all the Probate 313?

Happy Valentine Feast
38448325700_7297bbbd1a_b.jpg

 

Very beautifully written.  I love Neruda. 


"Don't hurry, don't worry. It's better to be late at the Golden Gate than to arrive in Hell on time."
--Sign in a bar and grill, Ormond Beach, Florida, 1960.

 

They took the blue from the skies and the pretty girls' eyes and a touch of Old Glory too . . .


#11 _InkyFingers

_InkyFingers

    Antique

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,548 posts
  • Location:San Jose, CA USA
  • Flag:

Posted 16 November 2018 - 01:28

Thank you Pajaro. Your kind words are overwhelming.

@Cane Natural slant is just a way to say, normal shading or little shading with Spencerian type of writing, a pointed pen.
Different pen for each person, as we all write with different pressure on the nib.

Natual slant, modified slant, school pens are all everyday type of pen. It is not meant for Engrossing or Ornamental penmanship.


I might be wrong...better to wait for @Aaandrew reply. He's the authority with Esterbrook pens.

#12 ac12

ac12

    Museum Piece

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,481 posts
  • Location:San Francisco Bay Area, California, USA - SFO
  • Flag:

Posted 16 November 2018 - 03:14

I do use Esterbrook nibs, but the G nib is my standard nib.

 

Try a G nib; Nikko, Zebra or Tachikawa.

The chrome plating make it last longer, before the nib starts to corrode.

It is relatively inexpensive and best of all, it is in production and readily available.


San Francisco Pen Show - August 23-25, 2019 - Redwood City, California

www.SFPenShow.com


#13 AAAndrew

AAAndrew

    (Not so) Wee Timorous Beastie

  • FPN Supporter - Rhodium

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,605 posts
  • Location:Durham, NC
  • Flag:

Posted 17 November 2018 - 18:40

I am about to buy a couple of Esterbrook nibs, but I whould like to know what the difference is, between the "natural slant" versions and the regular ones? Is it a compensation for those that hold the pen in an unnatural angle (but then it is called "natural"...)?

Natural Slant was a school of penmanship that wrote the letters more towards vertical. So the slant is the slant of the letters, not of the pen. You also had Modified Slant as another school.

Natural Slant pens are school pens so tend toward more firm, but also smooth and good everyday writers.

Esterbrook Natural Slants: 761 is fine, 773 is a small, flexible medium, 782 is a firmer medium.

Edited by AAAndrew, 17 November 2018 - 18:44.


“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928



Check out my Steel Pen Blog


"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne


#14 Cane

Cane

    NOS (New Old Stock)

  • Member - Silver

  • PipPip
  • 24 posts

Posted 17 November 2018 - 23:08

Ok, think I understand it know. Regarding different brands and such. Someone wrote a sample with the 358 nib, and I fell in love with the way it looks. I do write on the very small side (we are talking max 3mm for capital letters and about 1,5mm for lower case o, e etc) and you could write tiny text with it, and still have a nice wariable line with (not extreme, but enough to give it some character).

I didn't really think that it was worth the shipping cost, just buying one nib and holder, that's why I was thinking of buying a couple of nibs (who knows I might like them to), and besides, since I don't have any experience, I don't have any preference, yet (except very fine nib, not to wet, and not to scratchy). I was thinking about buying one Platinum 3776 Century, with UEF nib. But I have a sensitivity for all types of substances including ink, so I might never find one that I won't react to. In that case the Platinum fountain pen would be a waste of money. However if I find the right ink, I might still buy one. Until then, I will experiment with dip pens instead.

#15 Cane

Cane

    NOS (New Old Stock)

  • Member - Silver

  • PipPip
  • 24 posts

Posted 17 November 2018 - 23:17

Among the finer nibs, the seller have classified as medium flex, little flex and hardly any flex: 358, Art & Drafting 556, Pen 702, school Medium Fine 520, Penesco Pen 761, School Medium Fine 761, Natural Slant 556, School Medium Firm 810, Cashier's Pen

#16 corgicoupe

corgicoupe

    Collectors Item

  • Member - Gold

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,397 posts
  • Location:East of Atlanta
  • Flag:

Posted 17 November 2018 - 23:20

Unless you are partial to blue or black, I suggest you try walnut ink. I've seen it already mixed, but I bought a bag of powder made from walnut shells from Highland Woodworking and added water. If you're not sensitive to walnuts this could be a solution for you [pun not intended].


Baptiste knew how to make a short job long

For love of it. And yet not waste time either.

                                                         Robert Frost


#17 Cane

Cane

    NOS (New Old Stock)

  • Member - Silver

  • PipPip
  • 24 posts

Posted 17 November 2018 - 23:34

Hmm, I had everyone on itsi own line anf separation between them... Anyway.



#18 Cane

Cane

    NOS (New Old Stock)

  • Member - Silver

  • PipPip
  • 24 posts

Posted 17 November 2018 - 23:39

@corgicoupe thanks. Someone else recommended food coloring... But I do hope to find a permanent ink.



#19 Cane

Cane

    NOS (New Old Stock)

  • Member - Silver

  • PipPip
  • 24 posts

Posted 18 November 2018 - 00:17

@AAAndrew can you recommend any of them?

Medium flex:

358, Art & Drafting

 

Little flex:

556, Pen

702, school Medium Fine

520, Penesco Pen

761, School Medium Fine

761, Natural Slant

 

Hardly any flex:

556, School Medium Firm

810, Cashier's Pen 



#20 AAAndrew

AAAndrew

    (Not so) Wee Timorous Beastie

  • FPN Supporter - Rhodium

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,605 posts
  • Location:Durham, NC
  • Flag:

Posted 18 November 2018 - 01:40

I can recommend all of them, for specific uses. What do you want to do with it? You mentioned small writing. The 358 is the master at that, but it is super fine and extra difficult to use for those not used to dip pens.

He others you list are general writing pens with all pretty much the same level of flex. The 810 may be a bit firmer than the others. But if youre writing small, flex is not your friend. That just makes it much harder to write small.

Now, medium and firm mean something different in dip pens than in fountain pens. Heres a 761 in 9mm lines.

Attached Images

  • F6343E4B-A4AF-4E89-BBFF-EA15C7C7D5FF.jpeg


“When the historians of education do equal and exact justice to all who have contributed toward educational progress, they will devote several pages to those revolutionists who invented steel pens and blackboards.” V.T. Thayer, 1928



Check out my Steel Pen Blog


"No one is exempt from talking nonsense; the mistake is to do it solemnly."

-Montaigne







Sponsored Content




|