New Sailor Bottles

[jmccarty3]

Pen Chalet still has the 50 ml bottles available for most colors.

[inkstainedruth]

Yeah, agree this is a failed market strategy. There are too many other choices.

 

They're not the only company whose market strategy seems counter-intuitive. I'm having to have someone buy me a Pilot Decimo from a contact of his in Japan in order to get the color I want and the nib I need. I had contacted Pilot-USA asking why they only sell the four colors in the US (Burgundy, Light Blue, Purple, and Champagne Pink) and not any of the others (Black, White, Dark Blue and Light Grey) and was told that it was a "marketing decision".... [Apparently their marketing department decided that since Decimos are smaller, they would only attract interest from women, and women only want pens in "girly" colors. Well, I beg to differ. And the MOST expensive pen I own is a Pelikan M405 Anthracite Stresemann -- which is not REMOTELY *girly*. Just really classy looking, and a very good writer (plus I'm a sucker for piston fillers). Pilot's loss is Pelikan's gain -- just sayin'....]

The small square bottles (from the link that white_lotus posted) are attractive looking. But I *don't* like smaller bottles on the whole -- if I like a bottle I'd rather have a larger one that's more cost effective in the long run. And if they're going to be priced the same as the larger bottles? Sorry, no. I actually like the bottle I have of Sky High before it got discontinued and then brought back. And I like the ink itself. But there are plenty of other similarly colored inks out there at this point. So if I have to go with smaller bottles for the same price? I'll look elsewhere....

To cut the quantity by more than half and then charge the same price as the larger amount? That's just bad thinking (and, as someone said, greed) on Sailor's part.

Although I am wondering if part of the decision had to do with availability issues with the bottles (the way Noodler's did a couple of years ago when they had to temporarily switch to plastic bottles).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[minddance]

I am ready to just forget about Sailor, drop Sailor in this golden age of inks: too many other choices. And Sailors are not always the best behaved inks in pens.

[Mulrich]

I bet the glass bottle and the shipping both cost more than the production cost of the ink inside the bottle so shrinking the size of the bottle probably doesn't dramatically lower the cost of manufacturing. That being said, considering Pilot recently dropped the price of Iroshizuku inks I don't see how Sailor determined they could effectively raise the price of their inks.

I actually prefer smaller ink bottles because I like variety and don't anticipate finishing most of the inks I already own, but I wouldn't expect to pay the same as a full-size bottle.

[haruka337]

I'm fairly indifferent about the pricing.

Considering that inks and fountain pens are a drop in the bucket to Sailor's bottom line (most of their money is made in office supplies and their robotics branch), they seem to have flexibility in pricing their inks how they'd like. Am I a fan of the decrease in ink and increase in price? No, but I'm also not willing to pay any amount for lower quality inks; many brands cannot compete with Sailor's ink quality, which is why people tend to frenzy themselves over it.

My habits won't change. If I finish a Sailor bottle and I like the color, I'll repurchase.

[domzals1]

My habits won't change. If I finish a Sailor bottle and I like the color, I'll repurchase.

As someone whose day job is in corporate finance, I’d be willing to bet this is the sentiment they are assuming will be shared by most. Only time will tell if it was a prudent financial assumption!

[Inkling13]

Sailors jentle line still seems to be in 50ml bottles as evident on Jetpens.com. It seems in line with the likes of Pilot and Pelikan to offer premium inks, just at 1/2 the cost and volume. $15 for 20 ml, or $30 for 50 of Pilots. All still up in the stratosphere.

[Mew]

I am ready to just forget about Sailor, drop Sailor in this golden age of inks: too many other choices. And Sailors are not always the best behaved inks in pens.

If I may ask - which sailor ink did you face any issues with?

For me, sailor inks are the best behaved inks of them all, over and above Pilot and other European brands. They are very consistent and most of the issues that I have faced are related to the wetness of the ink (some inks being too dry). Those issues are there with 3-4% of the their total number of inks. They make 500+ colours so 3-4% is fine with me, and wetness is subjective and varies from user to user. I use fine nibs so wetness is important. Someone who uses B, BB or stubs will not be bothered by it.

[roklpokl]

To be honest Sailor inks are not the cheapest and I definitely wouldn't pay that price for 20ml. I love the colors but I don't know if any ink has such a high price tag per ml as the new Sailor will be (at least in Europe).

 

And I agree their inks are not always the best behaved. For instance Souten tends to dry in pens for me (if I don't use the pen for a few days it is very dry) and tends to dry/stick the piston as well (tried in Lamy 2000). This doesn't happen with Pelikan or Montblanc ink which are both in the same price range for 50 ml if not cheaper.

[chromantic]

I had a problem with the new van Gogh Dark Blue drying and clogging its JIF beyond what just running the nib under water for several seconds would normally correct. The Dark Green works as expected.

[KKay]

I am perturbed about the smaller bottle, but the same price too. I'm not paying that much money for such a small amount of ink. I have several bottles of their ink, but there are too many ink makers now who are producing some wonderful ink these days. They should drop the price quite a bit, if they want to keep me as a customer.

[IndigoBOB]

I really like sailor inks, especially Kiwa-Guro, which I have about 90 mL of (2 bottles), but that ink has a richness in color that even the darker Jentle inks, which I have, Doyou, Shigure, and Miruai, do lack despite how dark they are. The problem I have with them is that they are too lubricated for my broader nibs, but when I use my finer nibs they lake the deep color I prefer, let alone the richness they are already muted of.

 

I personally don't think they are worth it for the new price offered, unless I truly loved one of them.

 

At that price, Kobe and Bungubox inks start to look more attractive to me.

 

I wonder if it's a soft discontinuation of the inks, prompting purchase of the remaining and/or other inks and recreating newness if the price is reduced back down... *wishful thinking*...

 

...But if not, I have absolutely no problem moving on to other inks.

[Inkling13]

I don't know if this has been mentioned, but the new square 50ml bottles don't have a "ink miser" in them, as the squat fat round bottles used to. Apparently they are available for purchase, but it's another purchase. Kiwa-guro, thankfully has just been repackaged, but seeing that my 149 doesn't play well with it anyhow, it will be a while before I will buy more Sailor Kiwa-guro. Maybe my Pilot 823 will take it, at least once it's been back from Japan for a repair job.

Edited February 14, 2018 by Inkling13

[LittleSkink]

late to this thread - apologies, curious to know whats happened since January on this Sailors price hike thing

 

My 50ml Sailor Jentle Yama Dori is nearly used up after 2 years of enjoyable daily use, so I went to buy another bottle only to find (I) no 50ml anywhere in UK I have looked, they were £18 last year (ii) 20ml actually hard to get and a bit pricey (£12) when it is in stock

 

Much as I like Yama Dori in my Reform piston filler daily writer I have to say when the current ink bottle is empty I will be off looking to explore some more Teals. 36p/ml is quite expensive 60p/ml is way too much for me - heck my second favourite ink - Herbin The - is only just over a tenner for 100ml

[Olya]

late to this thread - apologies, curious to know whats happened since January on this Sailors price hike thing

 

My 50ml Sailor Jentle Yama Dori is nearly used up after 2 years of enjoyable daily use, so I went to buy another bottle only to find (I) no 50ml anywhere in UK I have looked, they were £18 last year (ii) 20ml actually hard to get and a bit pricey (£12) when it is in stock

 

Much as I like Yama Dori in my Reform piston filler daily writer I have to say when the current ink bottle is empty I will be off looking to explore some more Teals. 36p/ml is quite expensive 60p/ml is way too much for me - heck my second favourite ink - Herbin The - is only just over a tenner for 100ml

The new prices are beyond ridiculous.

I snatched up the last few 50ml bottles of the old style and caved and bought the new Yonaga to try out, but that's likely it. I'll continue to buy their standard blue (a favourite of mine), but the rest of the dye inks are way too overpriced. And you know 20ml is little, but that tiny bottle in your hand is just wow! Like a baby. It totally feels like some sort of sample, too, due to its size.

 

Unfortunately Platinum has done the very same price increase with their mixable line, but lucky for me I've never bought Platinum ink, so can live with that (except I love the new diamond/ rhombus bottle! argh!). To be seen whether and how Pilot will react, because usually they price their products the very same.

 

I used to think Edelstein was expensive, as well as J Herbin (both now well loved ink brands used regularly by me and the price isn't really as extortionate as it seemed when I started to buy bottled ink), but boy, where Montblanc, Sailor & Platinum have taken their inks with recent pricing is beyond the pale. Plus "artisan"/ boutique inks like Colorverse..

Thank goodness for Diamine, another longtime favourite (and the first brand I started exploring inks with!)!

[minddance]

Well, I was still deciding whether to get that bottle of 50ml Souten when it was available but it seems like I won't be getting it now.

 

Yes, Diamine has been very kind indeed to all of us and I hope things remain this very pleasant way

Edited October 8, 2018 by minddance

[A Smug Dill]

I'm 'debating' whether to get another 50ml bottle of Sailor okuyama while it can still be had for ~$20 delivered. The first (and only) bottle of it cost me ~A$26 delivered. It's a nice enough colour, but I still have >45ml of it, and mostly full bottles of Diamine Oxblood and Red Dragon, De Atramentis Red Roses and Iroshizuku yama-budo. A 'bargain' is not really that if I never get around to using the second bottle.

 

I did pick up 50ml bottles of doyou and nioisumire at the original price point recently while going crazy ordering pens on Rakuten. However, they weren't really that dirt cheap once international shipping from Japan is taken into account.

[Karmachanic]

Jentle inks 50ml, YD excepted, are available in the UK.

[Olya]

Jentle inks 50ml, YD excepted, are available in the UK.

 

Where? Many colours are sold out in the 50ml bottles and the 20ml bottles are supposed to replace the 50ml, I don't think stock will be replenished. The option to buy some colours in 50ml bottles isn't even available anymore.

[Erik Dalton]

Sailor has always seemed to me to be mercurial, somewhat stuck up, and out of touch when it comes to its marketing outside of Japan. Asia may be different I don’t know.

They make excellent products in both pens and ink. But they charge premium prices, and don’t go out of their way to encourage loyalty.

I find Japanese businessmen to be very honest and ethical to deal with. I’m old fashioned and known for making deals on a handshake. I have quite a lot of sailor pens and a healthy supply of ink, but only because of past affiliation and personal relationships.

If I had to buy on the open market today, I would have far fewer Sailor products.

This move to smaller bottles and higher prices is disturbing, but not out of Character for these guys.