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How Dark Should Iron Gall Inks Get?


lectraplayer

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After having gotten a couple samples of iron galls (Diamine Registrars Blue Black, R&D Salix, and Platinum Citrus Black), I was expecting them to get pretty dark within a few days, but so far, only Salix has shown much darkening, and Citrus Black barely even being noticeable. Registrar's showed me absolutely no change. Am I expecting too much, too fast, am I doing something wrong, or do I just have bad ink? What do you recommend for a good iron gall that gets way dark?

If it isn't too bright for you, it isn't bright enough for me.

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I have used several IG blue-black inks and none have turned a deep black. The speed at which IG inks darken also depends on the composition of the paper although I haven't figured out which type of paper is darkest.

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Wetness of nib, composition of paper (sugar cane shows no oxidation), and concentration of ferro-gallic acid in the ink will all determine how dark the ink will oxidize too, at the same time acknowledging that it may not darken as much as traditional iron gall inks used with dip pens or quills as the concentrations are far less. In a wet nib, Diamine Registrars will turn a medium to dark black, but it may take a week or two to oxidize completely. The best, and quickest oxidation I have seen is with KWZs iron gall inks, they darken within seconds generally, and can become pretty dark dependent on the color.

Edited by JakobS

FP Ink Orphanage-Is an ink not working with your pens, not the color you're looking for, is never to see the light of day again?!! If this is you, and the ink is in fine condition otherwise, don't dump it down the sink, or throw it into the trash, send it to me (payment can be negotiated), and I will provide it a nice safe home with love, and a decent meal of paper! Please PM me!<span style='color: #000080'>For Sale:</span> TBA

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Modern IG inks are pretty benign compared to those from back in the day, so the darkening potential is, in my experience, modest at best. There are a lot of factors that play a role: pH (of course) and wetness of the line in addition to those already mentioned.

"What? What's that? WHAT?!!! SPEAK UP, I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!" - Ludwig van Beethoven.

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Salix tends to not oxidize that much because it's got a lower ferro-gallic concentration than some other IG inks. I'm not familiar with Citrus Black (although my bottle of Forest Black only goes to a dark green). It's interesting that you say that Diamine Registrar's got the darkest -- my sample only oxidized to a washy blue grey. But my bottle of Akkerman Ijzer-Galnoten got very dark (my evidence that although the Akkerman inks might be made by Diamine, they are clearly not identical to them.

Like others have said, there are a variety of factors at play, including the dye components involved: for instance, a lot of the KWZI IG inks get dark but stay closer to their original color.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

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A "real" IG ink usually turns "black" within 24-48 h. That can depend -- as said above -- on several things but the most important single factor is the concentration of iron (Fe2+) ions. That can range from little (e.g. in R&K IG inks) to more (MB, Diamine and Akkerman). For an example of image shifts from blue-black to black (or "almost" black), check my review on IJzer-Galnoten bl/zw (blue-black iron gall) (#10).

Life is too short to drink bad wine (Goethe)

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In addition to things like the wetness of the pen and type of paper, another thing is just how fresh the ink is in the bottle. When the bottle is opened and the ink is used, there is an ever increasing amount of dead air space which can lead to premature oxidation of the ink in the bottle. This can be slowed down by removing the dead space with small glass pellets or marbles (learned this from working with reactive varnishes.) For the Akkerman bottle this is a problem and my IG #10 is slowly getting weaker/grayer compared to my Diamine IG.

 

Mark

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Strangely, I've noticed many saying Registrar's was the darkest and Salix the weakest. It hasn't been that way for me, although Salix starts out darker than Registrar's, then gets even darker for me with Registrar's just sitting there all week or two without change. I know ink age has something to do with it, but figure that shouldn't be the issue given that I'm working with Goulet samples and killing them within a week of when I get them. Although I too have recently noticed that some inks such as the Platinum Citrus Black get darker in a wetter pen, as my Nib Creaper turns a whole lot darker than my Preppy. I hate that color. I'm trying it on papers ranging from Hammermill to Pacon, and the results are about the same.

 

Although a lot of you are quoting inks that I haven't seen. Where do you get them from?

If it isn't too bright for you, it isn't bright enough for me.

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Akkerman no. 10 can be had either from Vanness Pens, or Anderson Pens, and KWZ IG inks can be had at Vanness Pens. You can get samples of all of them from either as well.

Edited by JakobS

FP Ink Orphanage-Is an ink not working with your pens, not the color you're looking for, is never to see the light of day again?!! If this is you, and the ink is in fine condition otherwise, don't dump it down the sink, or throw it into the trash, send it to me (payment can be negotiated), and I will provide it a nice safe home with love, and a decent meal of paper! Please PM me!<span style='color: #000080'>For Sale:</span> TBA

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As for ink samples, there is always the question of how fresh the bottle of ink was that was used to source the sample.

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My only IG experience was with Chesterfield Archival Vault, which darkened to a very dark gray, darker than the cheep cheep black stick ballpoints in use at work at the time.

That's actually around what I am hoping for. At least as dark as a Bic RoundStic.

If it isn't too bright for you, it isn't bright enough for me.

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My experience has been that Diamine Registrar's BB gets pretty dark, but Salix & Scabiosa don't have much of a change, nor does Platinum BB. Salix in particular for me likes to stay blue. (They all do change though.)

I'd like to try Platinum Citrus Black as I've heard that has a pretty dramatic change, starting from an almost "is there anything even on the page" to something more legible. At least that's what I've read. (Though lectraplayer's experience doesn't seem to indicate that's the case)

Edited by Mister5

Inked: Aurora Optima EF (Pelikan Tanzanite); Franklin Christoph Pocket 20 Needlepoint (Sailor Kiwa Guro); Sheaffers PFM I Reporter/Fine (Diamine Oxblood); Franklin Christoph 02 Medium Stub (Aurora Black); Platinum Plaisir Gunmetal EF (Platinum Brown); Platinum Preppy M (Platinum Blue-Black). Leaded: Palomino Blackwing 602; Lamy Scribble 0.7 (Pentel Ain Stein 2B); Uni Kuru Toga Roulette 0.5 (Uni Kuru Toga HB); Parker 51 Plum 0.9 (Pilot Neox HB)

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How about the ESSRI IG ink?

 

My Scabiosa doesn't really change much from the initial application. My old Montblanc Midnight Blue with IG content looks basically dark gray on the page with maybe a faint hint of blue, but it goes down as definite blue-black at first.

“I admit it, I'm surprised that fountain pens are a hobby. ... it's a bit like stumbling into a fork convention - when you've used a fork all your life.” 

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It depends on the iron gall content of the ink. Most modern iron galls do not contain too much of the stuff, so it's mostly just for show, not for serious purpose. For instance, KWZ IG inks are nice, and have a cool effect, but they are not as permanent as, say, ESSRI or Diamine's registrars ink. (But they are somewhat waterproof: if you wash a KWZ IG ink after it has dried, the color will wash away, but your writing will remain legible.)

 

I recommend trying ESSRI, which is a more aggressive iron gall ink. However it is also less pen-friendly: it can stain, so don't use it in transparent pens or pens that have an ink window. It can also corrode, so don't use with a steel nib, unless you don't mind it slowly being eaten. All that being said, ESSRI is one of my favourite inks, so I recommend it. (With caution, of course.)

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My only IG experience was with Chesterfield Archival Vault, which darkened to a very dark gray, darker than the cheep cheep black stick ballpoints in use at work at the time.

 

My understanding is that the Chesterfield inks were rebranded Diamine inks. So if that was Chesterfield's IG ink, it *was* Registrar's Blue-Black.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

"It's very nice, but frankly, when I signed that list for a P-51, what I had in mind was a fountain pen."

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My understanding is that the Chesterfield inks were rebranded Diamine inks. So if that was Chesterfield's IG ink, it *was* Registrar's Blue-Black.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

That was my understanding too. :)

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I'm not sure if it's just me, but if I want a really dark ink, that's what I use. I'm afraid I don't write with a light one and hope that it goes dark enough after a while. :unsure:

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My experience has been that Diamine Registrar's BB gets pretty dark, but Salix & Scabiosa don't have much of a change, nor does Platinum BB. Salix in particular for me likes to stay blue. (They all do change though.)

I'd like to try Platinum Citrus Black as I've heard that has a pretty dramatic change, starting from an almost "is there anything even on the page" to something more legible. At least that's what I've read. (Though lectraplayer's experience doesn't seem to indicate that's the case)

 

Well... Let me qualify that... I found something out... The pen I had the Platinum Citrus Black in was dry (a Preppy), and once I switched to a wetter pen, the results were much better. However it wasn't water resistant and I hated the muddy yellow I got from it. However the same pen I had the better results from the Citrus Black also had the Registrar's BB (which showed no sign of change and also washes off easily) and the Salix (which goes from near a BSB to a fairly dark blue/black). I may have to start trying these in my big nibs.

If it isn't too bright for you, it isn't bright enough for me.

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