Sailor Pro Gear Slim/sapporo - Zoom Nib- Persimmon

[KellyMcJ]

This is a gorgeous pen, as are all the Pro-Gear Slims. This is the Persimmon color, which I don't see "in the wild" very often; it's a gorgeous deep coral/red orange/orange red/hard to describe translucent color which changes with the light and which photos can't do justice to. Kind of like this: http://bestride.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Orange-Camaro.jpg

 

I mostly want to talk about the nib. This nib is a lot of fun, and you can coax a lot of line variation out of it, if you're willing to do carpel-tunnel inducing acrobatics. It's very responsive to changes in angle (not, oddly, producing an awful scratchy sensation but instead varying the line) and speed of stroke. It has a surprising bit of softness, whereas other Sailor nibs are nails. It's not flexible by any means, and the softness will not get you any line variation, but it will produce a wetter line (so it's good for depositing bits of sheen with the right ink!) It gives a comfortable "bounce" which really surprised me considering my Broad nib is a nail.

 

If you don't want to do acrobatics, it still gives a lot of natural line variation and a surprisingly expressive line!

 

It did take a few days of sitting with ink in it to really start flowing well- this nib takes a lot of ink and I suspect, the feed doesn't keep up as well with western cursive (this is actually a trait I'm fond of as it increases the line variation.)

 

This nib could certainly be used for everyday writing if you write large and have room to run- however I really like to use it for signing cards.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[inkstainedruth]

Bumping this topic back to life.

I may actually getting a Pro Gear Slim Purple Cosmos! Yeah, there are actually still a few out there -- I was up half the night making notes about which vender had which nibs, how much the pen cost (+ s/h), etc.

Only now I can't decide on a nib....

Normally, I'd be my usual self and going for an F or M nib. But several of the vendors have both the "music" nibs (which I gather are more of a crisp stub than a *true* 3 tine music nib) and the zoom nibs. So I'm considering going out of my "Western F" comfort zone. I've seen the SRE Brown videos demonstrating the music and zoom nibs, and those nibs have plusses and minuses to them. And of course one of the minuses of the zoom is getting used to the change of angle needed to get the nib variation. So how do you like yours? Is changing the angle of the pen as simple as the video suggested, or is it a steeper (no pun intended) learning curve?

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[Honeybadgers]

The zoom is not a fun nib to use unless you're really into playing with it as you write, or really want a big juicy double broad. It's also not a glassy smooth double broad (it's got the same feedback that every sailor has, that slightly toothy, sharp 2b pencil feel) so it doesn't really glide across the page. it's not great for cursive, much better for printing or short strokes like kanji. If I wrote in asian characters, I think this would be one of the coolest nibs ever. If I printed a lot, same. But if you're a big cursive fan, ruth, particularly with your fondness for F and M, you'll likely not use it much.

 

If you can find a 3776 Coarse nib to try, it's very similar to that, it just gets narrower the more vertical you hold it. Not something you can really do in cursive.

 

I'm glad I have one, but I'm even happier I have it in a cheap, simple, small 1911 standard. It's fun to use on occasion, but mostly for the oddity factor. It's never found its way into regular rotation. If I was someone who needed a fancy signature pen, this nib would be great, same if I was just a fan of the ball tip double broad line.

Edited March 27, 2019 by Honeybadgers

[inkstainedruth]

Thanks for the heads up. I don't have any other Sailor pens, so the nib feedback was not something that I was aware of. And even after shopping around for the best deal, the Purple Cosmos is not exactly inexpensive. I know that some people have said the zoom nib is nice for doing artwork -- but I have other pens that I like to draw with; the 1990s era Pelikan M400 Brown Tortoise, with its juicy and springy F nib) comes to mind -- and that pen is also great to write with as well, although it insists on brown ink... (I keep threatening to put Noodler's Navajo Turquoise in it as an antidote to all the brown, but it hasn't happened yet.).

I'm trying to push myself out of my comfort zone (I actually made a New Year's resolution this year -- the first one I've done in a long time -- to that effect). So in January I entered the bardic competition at an SCA event (and pushed myself past the stage fright); no I didn't win -- I didn't expect to.... And I'm currently taking a creative writing class at a local community college. So I was looking past "normal" nibs to get for the Purple Cosmos. Only I suspected that the SRE Brown video made manipulating the pen angle for a zoom nib easier than perhaps it actually was....

Even plain old B nibs are pretty rare in my stash. I have only a few obliques. The IM nib that came on the replacement M200 Café Crème was pretty much of a firehose (I currently have it on the other M200, and 4001 Brilliant Black is the *only* ink I've found that really behaved in it -- even after getting the nib tuned a couple of summers ago. Surprisingly, Iron gall inks were too wet for that nib... ).

If the Purple Cosmos was a $30 pen -- or even a $50-60 pen -- I might go for it. But it isn't. Which is why I've been waffling about whether I'm willing to go out on a limb for something that is that exotic a nib, only to find that I don't like it. And then will have the issue of having to pay the return shipping AND probably a restocking fee because I will have inked the pen up. And trying to resell it after being used will mean likely selling it at a loss -- even with it being a very limited run. But I can't waffle for too long either, because then the pens could very easily be sold out....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[ENewton]

I have a Purple Cosmos with a broad nib. It is the only broad in my collection is very pleasant to use, wet but some texture to it.

 

I have not tried a zoom nib but did have the chance to try a Naginata Togi once and decided I didn't want to adjust to changing the angle of a pen while writing. I study Japanese brush calligraphy, and in that context, changing the angle of the brush is considered the worst of habits; I would be afraid that the skills required to wield any fude-type nib would interfere with my more traditional writing practice.

[A Smug Dill]

What particular effect(s) are you trying to get from using a Zoom nib?

[inkstainedruth]

What particular effect(s) are you trying to get from using a Zoom nib?

 

Not sure who you're asking that of.

Me, I'm just curious about it. I've never tried one, and I'm trying to expand my horizons. I went from M to F, then tried some B nibs and obliques a couple of years ago. I was just trying to get input about the zoom from people who have used one, to see if it's something I want to try or not -- before I plop down a wad of cash. I don't want to buy the pen, try it, not like it, and then have to spend *more* money sending it back, especially after it's been inked.

A friend of mine who really likes Sailor pens has both a music nib and a zoom, so I'm trying to arrange to get together with him at some point this weekend and try them out. That will better inform my final decision as to which to get. I do have a few nibs that will be similar to the music nib (including a very nice (real) music nib, harvested from a no-name lever filler and put onto an old Parker Parkette, and it's a very nice writer. My everyday pens do still tend to be Fs, but I'm trying to not get into a rut. I may find that I truly hate fussing with the zoom. Or, I may find that it's really really cool and different. But I'm trying to get as much information ahead of (actual) purchase as possible, since it is such an unusual nib. (And yeah, I gather that a naginati-toga nib will be better than a zoom -- but I'm not in the position to pay more for a nib alone than I did for my Pelikan M405 Anthracite Stresemann... ).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[A Smug Dill]

Not sure who you're asking that of.

The question was meant for you. I should have been clearer, sorry.

 

Me, I'm just curious about it. I've never tried one, and I'm trying to expand my horizons. I went from M to F, then tried some B nibs and obliques a couple of years ago. I was just trying to get input about the zoom from people who have used one, to see if it's something I want to try or not

The Zoom nib is capable of producing a wide variety of line widths, from "Western Extra Fine" to Broad, but largely in a monoline manner. It is possible to elicit line variation from it while writing English in a cursive hand, but not quite in the way how most people would hold a fountain pen.

 

A friend of mine who really likes Sailor pens has both a music nib and a zoom, so I'm trying to arrange to get together with him at some point this weekend and try them out. That will better inform my final decision as to which to get.

That's absolutely the best way to go, I agree.

[Eric2018]

Sailor's music is a one-tine nib, wet and like a smooth stub. Before making the decision, I hesitated.

I got the Sailor Ocean Slim on Music Nib earlier, really really glad to have it.

 

Similar to many stub, the music is not good for writing Japanese or Chinese characters.

And so I think the Zoom nib is designed for that purpose.

 

Keep planing to have a zoom.......

[A Smug Dill]

Similar to many stub, the music is not good for writing Japanese or Chinese characters.

And so I think the Zoom nib is designed for that purpose.

 

I'm not sure I share that view. The Zoom is, generally speaking, too broad for the number of strokes one may have to fit inside a tight space when writing kanji or hanzi, unless the user is holding it at an unnatural angle, or 'reverse-writing' with it with the inscribed side of the nib facing down at the paper. Stub and Italic nibs, which leave narrower horizontal lines (perpendicular to the plane of the slit on the nib) than vertical lines (in line with the plane of the slit), are still better than "architect's grind" nibs that do the opposite.

 

All the Sailor EF, F and MF nibs I have are quite fit for purpose for writing hanzi (in the kaishu script) in 5mm squares up to 10mm squares. The most versatile Sailor nib I've used for writing in Chinese, however, is the Naginata Concord nib.

[Honeybadgers]

Thanks for the heads up. I don't have any other Sailor pens, so the nib feedback was not something that I was aware of. And even after shopping around for the best deal, the Purple Cosmos is not exactly inexpensive. I know that some people have said the zoom nib is nice for doing artwork -- but I have other pens that I like to draw with; the 1990s era Pelikan M400 Brown Tortoise, with its juicy and springy F nib) comes to mind -- and that pen is also great to write with as well, although it insists on brown ink... (I keep threatening to put Noodler's Navajo Turquoise in it as an antidote to all the brown, but it hasn't happened yet.).

I'm trying to push myself out of my comfort zone (I actually made a New Year's resolution this year -- the first one I've done in a long time -- to that effect). So in January I entered the bardic competition at an SCA event (and pushed myself past the stage fright); no I didn't win -- I didn't expect to.... And I'm currently taking a creative writing class at a local community college. So I was looking past "normal" nibs to get for the Purple Cosmos. Only I suspected that the SRE Brown video made manipulating the pen angle for a zoom nib easier than perhaps it actually was....

Even plain old B nibs are pretty rare in my stash. I have only a few obliques. The IM nib that came on the replacement M200 Café Crème was pretty much of a firehose (I currently have it on the other M200, and 4001 Brilliant Black is the *only* ink I've found that really behaved in it -- even after getting the nib tuned a couple of summers ago. Surprisingly, Iron gall inks were too wet for that nib... ).

If the Purple Cosmos was a $30 pen -- or even a $50-60 pen -- I might go for it. But it isn't. Which is why I've been waffling about whether I'm willing to go out on a limb for something that is that exotic a nib, only to find that I don't like it. And then will have the issue of having to pay the return shipping AND probably a restocking fee because I will have inked the pen up. And trying to resell it after being used will mean likely selling it at a loss -- even with it being a very limited run. But I can't waffle for too long either, because then the pens could very easily be sold out....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

 

If you want to pay for shipping, ruth, I'd be willing to loan you a zoom nib 1911 standard for a few weeks to try. But if you want a good pen for a low price that should show you what that sharp 2b pencil feedback is like (it's not scratchy at all, it's a very unique feedback I've yet to find in any other pen company, and it's really pleasant, particularly in the finer nibs) then the sailor young profit skeleton is about $25 and has a really pretty full clear body/feed, a steel FM nib that has the same kind of feedback as the other models, and as a kicker, you can put the section/nib from any 1911 standard or pro gear slim into it and have a demonstrator gold nib.

Edited March 30, 2019 by Honeybadgers

[inkstainedruth]

 

 

If you want to pay for shipping, ruth, I'd be willing to loan you a zoom nib 1911 standard for a few weeks to try. But if you want a good pen for a low price that should show you what that sharp 2b pencil feedback is like (it's not scratchy at all, it's a very unique feedback I've yet to find in any other pen company, and it's really pleasant, particularly in the finer nibs) then the sailor young profit skeleton is about $25 and has a really pretty full clear body/feed, a steel FM nib that has the same kind of feedback as the other models, and as a kicker, you can put the section/nib from any 1911 standard or pro gear slim into it and have a demonstrator gold nib.

 

Thanks for the offer, but it turns out that a friend of mine has both the music nib and the zoom. He even has a couple of the naganati-toga nibs. So I'm trying to arrange to get together with him to try the different ones out. Maybe even those last -- not that they are remotely affordable.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[1nkulus]

Thanks for the offer, but it turns out that a friend of mine has both the music nib and the zoom. He even has a couple of the naganati-toga nibs. So I'm trying to arrange to get together with him to try the different ones out.

 

An ideal situation.

 

I think you might like the music instead of zoom, unless you want line variations at different angles.

 

..... show you what that sharp 2b pencil feedback is like (it's not scratchy at all, it's a very unique feedback I've yet to find in any other pen company, and it's really pleasant, particularly in the finer nibs)

+1

[WLSpec]

Nice review and pictures! Those Sailor Zoom nibs have so much tipping...

[Driften]

 

Thanks for the offer, but it turns out that a friend of mine has both the music nib and the zoom. He even has a couple of the naganati-toga nibs. So I'm trying to arrange to get together with him to try the different ones out. Maybe even those last -- not that they are remotely affordable.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

 

To me the Zoom nib is not about changing line width while writing, but to have the equivalent of several nibs sizes in one pen. As KellyMcJ showed you can get lots of line widths, none are very stub like.

 

With a wet ink like Pilot Iroshizuku I found it too broad for my liking, but when paired with a Montblanc or Robert Oster ink I really liked it. I sold my REALO with Zoom and miss it now. My two sailor's ProGear Ocean with B nibs are finer then I like, but I still have use of them so don't regret it, but wish one of the two had the Zoom.

 

In any case I hope you can try your friends before the supply runs out. The only opinion that matters is what it's like in your hands...