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Soennecken Prasident 1


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#1 Raif79

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Posted 28 November 2017 - 19:20

I figured I'd share some pics.  New sac installed and inked up.  

 

 

fpn_1511896287__img_0928.jpgfpn_1511896320__img_0930.jpgfpn_1511896328__img_0931.jpgfpn_1511896345__img_0932.jpgfpn_1511896362__img_0933.jpgfpn_1511896393__img_0934.jpgfpn_1511896427__img_0936.jpg



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#2 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 28 November 2017 - 21:30

Nice, Beautiful condition. :happyberet:

Soennecken was always one level too far up for me. My high level stopped at Osmia.

 

I'd saved up E750 for a Soennecken 111 Extra herring bone....after six months the money burnt a hole in my pocket and I was followed home by a flock of Pelikans.

There is or was a woman with 6 of the 8 I think Herringbone shades.... :notworthy1: :thumbup:


Edited by Bo Bo Olson, 28 November 2017 - 21:34.

German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#3 Raif79

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Posted 28 November 2017 - 23:19

Nice, Beautiful condition. :happyberet:

Soennecken was always one level too far up for me. My high level stopped at Osmia.

 

I'd saved up E750 for a Soennecken 111 Extra herring bone....after six months the money burnt a hole in my pocket and I was followed home by a flock of Pelikans.

There is or was a woman with 6 of the 8 I think Herringbone shades.... :notworthy1: :thumbup:

Thank you Bo Bo.  You actually sound a lot like me.  I've saved up for BIG pens before only to get greedy and buy a bunch of less expensive pens.  Ask me how many Pelikans I used to own at one time.  A 111 Extra herring bone sounds lovely!  A Rheingold is on my list for next Soennecken.



#4 Christopher Godfrey

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 19:51

Raif, how much difference is there between Praesident and Rheingold?  Which one is considered more high-end?  (Your Praesident is more shiny than mine!  Mine has some wear on the clip; but nib is lovely and flexy)



#5 Raif79

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 20:25

Raif, how much difference is there between Praesident and Rheingold?  Which one is considered more high-end?  (Your Praesident is more shiny than mine!  Mine has some wear on the clip; but nib is lovely and flexy)

 

I believe (and I might be wrong) the Rheingold series evolved into the Prasidents.  It's a bit tricky with it.  The original Prasident used the same awesome filling mechanism as the Rheingold but looked different with the bulge on the cap.  The Rheingold series had some models that look pretty close to the later incarnations of the Prasidents.  Mine is the final model and the series 1 (the larger of the two Prasidents offered in those years).

 

It is my opinion that the Prasidents are Rheingolds but not all Rheingolds are Prasidents.  I do believe the Prasident series had a higher retail price than the Rheingolds.  All of the Rheingolds and Prasidents are lovely and awesome pens.  I would love to add a few more to my collection.  



#6 Azuniga

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 23:45

Beautiful pen and beautiful conditon !

Thanks for sharing...

 

I have a large amount of Rheigold (almost all colors and sizes) and some Praesident... and I could add that Praesident are harder to find, and in good condition even harder...

 

Enjoy it !



#7 Christopher Godfrey

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 02:02

Thanks, both!



#8 Raif79

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 02:23

Beautiful pen and beautiful conditon !
Thanks for sharing...
 
I have a large amount of Rheigold (almost all colors and sizes) and some Praesident... and I could add that Praesident are harder to find, and in good condition even harder...
 
Enjoy it !


Hey! Hook a brother up! Quit hoarding. Id love to see your collection.

#9 Christopher Godfrey

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 15:17

Raif and Azuniga, my Praesident measures 122mm closed (4,75in): which model do I have?  (Aha!  Raif, mine simply says Praesident on the barrel: yours has a number 1 after it, I see)

 

I have a Rheingold 913 coming: is that the mid-sized one?  After this last one arrives, I think there will be several lesser Soenneckens going on the sales block!


Edited by Christopher Godfrey, 02 February 2018 - 15:19.


#10 Raif79

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 15:35

Mine is 13cm capped (just over 5 inches).  Yes the 1 was the larger of the two.



#11 Christopher Godfrey

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 16:58

Thanks, Raif: what I love about your Praesident is that it looks to be almost NOS!  Your furnishings (clip, cap bands) look to be in perfect condition, whereas mine do show typical wear (brassing)  Now the 913 that is en route looks to be in really fine condition...we'll see...

 

Do you know much about earlier models?  I have an early 111 (no, not the beauty from 1950s) that is very small in that worked, dull black that so many of the early pens share -- and it is roughly Ibis-sized!



#12 Raif79

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 19:26

Thanks, Raif: what I love about your Praesident is that it looks to be almost NOS!  Your furnishings (clip, cap bands) look to be in perfect condition, whereas mine do show typical wear (brassing)  Now the 913 that is en route looks to be in really fine condition...we'll see...

 

Do you know much about earlier models?  I have an early 111 (no, not the beauty from 1950s) that is very small in that worked, dull black that so many of the early pens share -- and it is roughly Ibis-sized!

 

Thanks!  I was very fortunate to get such a lovely specimen.  It is not without its flaws though.  There are a few spots that need attention.  The fatter cap band is dented all over (typical of the ones that have a bowed out cap band).  The nib is impeccable.  The button is also one of the finest and cleanest I've ever seen.  

 

The Soennecken numbering system makes my head hurt.  I almost feel they numbered them the way they did to cause confusion.  Lower numbers one year is high tier.  Higher numbers another year mean high tier.  Don't get me started on the 2nd and third numbers.  Then you have Superior and Extra.  I really think they named and numbered their pens so everything would sound significant and important.  I like the numbering system of old Montblancs better.



#13 Azuniga

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 19:54

Rheingold different sizes and colors…

 

fpn_1517681079__rhein1.jpg

 

Two different models of Präsident and a Präsident 1

 

fpn_1517681119__praes.jpg

 

Later Soennecken Models (Extra, Superior…)

 

fpn_1517681150__exsu.jpg

 

This is the most complete page on Soennecken I have found

http://www.fountainp...t/Soennecken/en


Edited by Azuniga, 03 February 2018 - 18:07.


#14 Raif79

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 16:19

That is an incredible collection!  I'm envious and jealous.  Beautiful examples there.



#15 Christopher Godfrey

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Posted 09 February 2018 - 05:16

OMG!  Azuniga, I am trying to get my jaw back up to close my mouth again!  Amazing and beautiful collection of Soenneckens!  I, too, am green with envy.  I have the same, smaller Praesident as the one on l.h.s. of your photo (122mm) and my new Rheingold is 130mm (arrived just a few days ago) and a 510, which measures 128mm.  (All of them black)

 

I do have two 222s: one black and one green lizard, both in Extra size.  I don't think I shall ever get a 111 of same period, although I have a very small 1930's 111 (110mm) in that black finish of the time, so typical of Soennecken, Osmia and Kaweco.

 

Surprising to me is that the 510 turns out to be <exactly> the same size as the 507.  510 has three cap rings; 507 gets only two and mine has a steel (flexy) nib, whereas the 510 has a gorgeous and quite flexible gold one.  Additionally, the 507 has an ink-view window, whereas the 510 has <not>.  Any comment, Azuniga?

 

I think my early 111 and the 504 may have to go on the sales block: both of them too small...(shame, too, because the 111 has a lovely little nib, very flexible; but the pen is jammed and needs attention)  My other Soennecken is a weighty little 412, which has the click-stop filling system, just like a 111/222.  This is a surprise to me...

 

PS: Gracias para el link!  Now I see that the 412 certainly was known for the click filling lock; but there is no mention of either 412 or 111, alas...


Edited by Christopher Godfrey, 09 February 2018 - 05:45.


#16 Azuniga

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Posted 09 February 2018 - 23:10



 

Surprising to me is that the 510 turns out to be <exactly> the same size as the 507.  510 has three cap rings; 507 gets only two and mine has a steel (flexy) nib, whereas the 510 has a gorgeous and quite flexible gold one.  Additionally, the 507 has an ink-view window, whereas the 510 has <not>.  Any comment, Azuniga?

 

 

PS: Gracias para el link!  Now I see that the 412 certainly was known for the click filling lock; but there is no mention of either 412 or 111, alas...

 

I have two 510 and no 507 but a 506 considerably smaller (11.3 cm closed) and the 510's 128 mm as yours, but looking at the differences between my 510’s I see different color windows, so I am under the impression that in a certain moment of the production they were using different parts to complete every pen… in the image we can see the difference of the nibs sizes (Soennecken did not normally put a number on their nibs), one has a 14 carat 585 and the other a Pargo bicolor but both Soennecken… of course those nibs could be replacement nibs, but I do not think so, it seems more accurate to believe they used different parts to complete a production, even if the one on the right seems to have nib/feed a little outside, seeing the width on the lower part it cannot go further and I tried to push it a little more it did not go, and the feeds are the original ones…

Since the 506 has only one band and the 510 three bands, it seems normal the 507 have two bands

 

Maybe your 510 without a window simply has still some ink in it, and I do not mean to be rude saying that, but it is possible, specially if the cork has had a lot of use and require to be replaced…

 

fpn_1518217442__510a.jpg

 

fpn_1518217473__510b.jpg

 

In relation to the link I guess Soennecken did not do much when they closed, so the Italians organized it and it is the most complete i have found...


Edited by Azuniga, 09 February 2018 - 23:14.


#17 Christopher Godfrey

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Posted 10 February 2018 - 15:35

Raif: you wrote <...the Rheingolds and Prasidents are lovely and awesome pens.  I would love to add a few more to my collection> to which I say, tongue very much in cheek, "No point: Azuniga has them all already!  There <aren't> any more!"   :D 

 

Seriously, those are mouth-watering pens, aren't they?

 

In my last sentence I wrote something like: "I cannot find mention of the 412 or 111" (in the Italian article), when I should have written "<504> or 111".  These two pens are simply too petite to be easy to use, since I also never post a cap on any pen; but both of these have very nice flexy nibs. 

 

I am still surprised that 507 and 510 are same dimensions.  I have just had a closer look for an ink window in the "new" 510, Azuniga, and it may be that it has simply become opaque, now, with time and ink stain: I may try some cleansing fluid inside the barrel -- I have just filled it with Rapido-Eze and shall see if a small soaking makes some difference, because I believe you are right: there are signs of transparency...

 

(PS: I love your art!)

 

By the way, don't you love the <heft> of later 111/222s?  The solidity and <mass> of them -- obviously brass workings inside?  (Like Pelikan 800/1000s)


Edited by Christopher Godfrey, 10 February 2018 - 15:41.


#18 Azuniga

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Posted 10 February 2018 - 18:24

quote: ‘In my last sentence I wrote something like: "I cannot find mention of the 412 or 111" (in the Italian article), when I should have written "<504> or 111".  These two pens are simply too petite to be easy to use, since I also never post a cap on any pen; but both of these have very nice flexy nibs.'

 

In relation to this paragraph by you, it is right, there is nothing about the 504 in the link and I will look for more information next week with the German guys at the LA Pen show, but I can easily imagine the 504 it is very small, considering the size difference between 506 or 507/510 whose only difference seems to be the 2/3 gold bands on the cap. 

I am showing here a 412 in case you have not seen it. It measures 122 mm closed, it has an ink window and the nib is a bicolor 14 K 585 Soennecken… two noticeable differences with a 510 for example are: The filling system, which is the piston from 1939 referred in the Italian article where the knob of the plunger is locked when at rest. It was certainly the first essay before the one they adopted later for their 1xx, 2xx and 3xx models after the war; the second difference is the clip which is the same they used with Präsident.

 

fpn_1518286572__412a.jpg

 

fpn_1518286606__412b.jpg

 

fpn_1518286628__412c.jpg

 

What I did not understand in your paragraph I quoted was related to the size of a 111 since the Extra is 128 mm closed, the Superior 123 mm closed, they are not that small pens though, and it is only the Lady 222 that becomes smaller 117 mm closed.

Since I am into it, I am adding a picture of one 110 and it measures 116 mm closed with a normal piston filler system.

 

fpn_1518286657__s4a.jpg

 

fpn_1518286682__s4b.jpg

 

I love the 111 & 222 which as a joke I always call the Adenauer pens, they are indeed solid and with a good weight for the hand while writing. The locked knob is not easy to repair but it is very secure. Although I have heard a lot of complaints about the brittle quality of their celluloid, I have never had a problem with those models and I use them frequently.

 

(PS; thank for your comment about the art, you are probably referring to my father work, I am not an artist myself)


Edited by Azuniga, 10 February 2018 - 18:41.


#19 gandalf11

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Posted 10 February 2018 - 18:42

Grief

que coleccion hermano, esta de pelos, estoy babeando de verla

 

my dear compatriot, what amazinng collection, im stunning just to see it, congrats, you are a real collector ......


Saludos desde Mexico, "el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz entre los hombres" 


#20 fountainbel

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Posted 10 February 2018 - 19:29

Beautiful & impressing  Soennecken collection Azuniga, my sincere congratulations !

Francis








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