Stalled Innovation In Fountain Pen Design

[Tweel]

innovation... is a function and a result of new approaches to the concept of fountain pen nibs and filling systems.

 

My concern is for innovation in the core purpose of the fountain pen, namely the filling, storage and application of wet ink to a writing surface, not cap and barrel construction or "bling".

 

Then I might suggest that Sheaffer wasn't innovating. They didn't invent the "Touchdown" filler, they adopted it from Chilton's 1920s design. And the sheath and inlaid nibs don't do anything new by way of applying ink to paper. They're essentially "bling", and make the pen harder to service as well.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Tweel

[milkb0at]

 

My concern is for innovation in the core purpose of the fountain pen, namely the filling, storage and application of wet ink to a writing surface, not cap and barrel construction or "bling".

 

So far, there has been no examples of sort of innovation that characterised the pens mentioned at the beginning of the thread from the 40s and 50s.

 

 

 

 

OK, if you're specifically asking about nib and filling only:

- Conid, which you have already dismissed somehow as "just another piston". Also Visconti's Power Filler.

- Edison, with draw, pump, pneumatic and bulb fillers, most of which are variations of old tech but with new materials etc

- Titanium nibs from Bock et al are a pretty radical change

- Plastic feeds are a post-50s innovation and have massively changed modern fountain pens.

 

Whether any of these are an improvement over 40-50s designs is a discussion had many times (especially plastic vs ebonite feeds).

 

So there is innovation, but either they are less impressive or the companies involved don't have the massive marketing presence of Sheaffer and Parker had back then.

[Bo Bo Olson]

There was a soft point....by Parker or Pelikan that wasn't really a fountain pen, because of it's nib was fiber. It adjusted to ones Hand, sooner than later.

I tired it at my B&M it was So Lala....more the lala. Interesting but no cigar.

An innovation that went nowhere, but was marketed.

 

Oft I wonder if many problems are not caused by supersaturated inks.

 

Some posts here are quite alert.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Bo Bo Olson

[Venemo]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned the capillary filler yet. It's a good example of a completely new paradigm in filling systems. It can fill itself without effort, it can clean itself and of course it holds a reasonable amount of ink. I think it was the best of the '60s.

 

However the capillary filler turned out to be hard to flush, and can dry out if left unused for a long time. So it is good if you use it regularly and with the same ink, but is a hassle otherwise. I think it could be interesting to know how it would have developed if fountain pens hadn't gone out of fashion.

[ParkerDuofold]

OT:

Be a real pro, and McGyver an infusion pump into the feed. You wouldn't run out of ink capacity either. Not really that transportable, but eh, that's small price to pay, right?

 

- A.C.

[ParkerDuofold]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned the capillary filler yet. It's a good example of a completely new paradigm in filling systems. It can fill itself without effort, it can clean itself and of course it holds a reasonable amount of ink. I think it was the best of the '60s.

 

However the capillary filler turned out to be hard to flush, and can dry out if left unused for a long time. So it is good if you use it regularly and with the same ink, but is a hassle otherwise. I think it could be interesting to know how it would have developed if fountain pens hadn't gone out of fashion.

Hi Venemo,

 

I understand capillary action, but I'm unfamiliar with it as a filling mechanism... what are some pens that use it?

 

 

- Anthony

[Venemo]

Hi Venemo,

 

I understand capillary action, but I'm unfamiliar with it as a filling mechanism... what are some pens that use it?

 

 

- Anthony

 

Only the Parker 61.

Unfortunately, due to the issues I mentioned and the decline of fountain pens after the 60s, the filling system was not fitted to other pen models.

You can find out about its history here: https://parkerpens.net/parker61.html

[ParkerDuofold]

Only the Parker 61.

Unfortunately, due to the issues I mentioned and the decline of fountain pens after the 60s, the filling system was not fitted to other pen models.

You can find out about its history here: https://parkerpens.net/parker61.html

Very intriguing, Venemo, thanks.

 

Actually, if you would fill the bulb syringe with water instead of using the cap system to flush, I think it would go a lot quicker and easier, (advance to 13 m):

 

http://youtu.be/rzMYbGondlo

 

 

I think I might like that pen.

 

 

- Anthony

[YPwalt]

Venemo,

 

Don't men to derail and as a rookie, I seldom post, but just wanted to say thank you for that link...can't believe I've not visited that site before...So much to learn and enjoy!!!

[Venemo]

Very intriguing, Venemo, thanks.

 

Actually, if you would fill the bulb syringe with water instead of using the cap system to flush, I think it would go a lot quicker and easier, (advance to 13 m):

 

I think I might like that pen.

 

 

- Anthony

 

You're welcome, Anthony! I hope you enjoyed researching it.

 

Yes, it isn't hard to flush if you have a bulb syringe, or if you are willing to blow through it with your lungs. The latter is exactly how I cleaned my own Parker 61 when I got it.

Unfortunately, the 61 is made of weaker material than the 51, so the barrel and section are prone to cracking.

 

The 61 may not be as popular as the 51 as a collectors' item, but it's still a nice pen if you are willing to care for it.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Venemo

[dapprman]

The only ones I can think of are all really just variations or improvements on existing systems, such as

Lamy Dialog 3 - but that's really just a safety pen without the need for a cap

Pilot Vanishing Point - again just a ball pen design with an internal seal

Conid's nib seal tech - but again it's just an improvement.

[Pickwick]

According to an article published last year in the Chicago Tribune the sale of fountain pens are enjoying a healthy trend amongst a younger generation, and some companies are encouraging such by gifting them to employees. Cross for one has seen an healthy increase in sales due to this. As long as growth in sales continues there is no need at this stage for any of the major pen manufacturers to consider spending money and time in developing any novel innovations in filling systems. It seems new customers are satisfied with the current designs.

[Mulrich]

Im not sure how much room for innovation there is in a pen or any product thats been around for 100+ years.

 

As others have mentioned I think Conid is doing some neat things (the CAISO capping system is the latest). Visconti should also get some credit for innovation (lava material, hook safe cap, my pen system, maybe the double reservoir power filler).

[Maurizio]

The other point to consider is that maybe fountain pens have just about reached their pinnacle of form and function except for some minor tweaks for materials.

 

When’s the last time there has been a major innovation in a violin?

[hari317]

The Pelikan Level L65 and L5 was another innovation with a double ink chamber that did not quite click.

Edited November 9, 2017 by hari317

[ParkerDuofold]

The other point to consider is that maybe fountain pens have just about reached their pinnacle of form and function except for some minor tweaks for materials.

 

Whens the last time there has been a major innovation in a violin?

I agree with Mulrich and Maurizio on this one.

 

While cars have transcended by leaps and bounds since the '50s; many other things have remained relatively static... such as violins.

 

Another example, with the exception of lasers and green dots and occasional safety updates; guns have also remained fairly static. Compare a WW II era 1911 .45 with a new one and you'll discover very little has changed. Perhaps the fp has also reached it's apex... with the exception of little tweaks here and there... such as the VP and slip and seal, etc.

 

 

- Anthony

 

EDITED to correct text.

Edited November 9, 2017 by ParkerDuofold

[Randal6393]

I'm going to refer you to Nathan Tardiff's career. Tremendous innovations in inks and fountain pens. At a low price level. No, no really new designs, just adaptations of existing ideas to give the customer a less expensive product. Have you looked at his latest pen? The Boston Safety Pen looks to be a fun pen to use. Although maybe a bit messy.

 

Enjoy,

[Pickwick]

I agree with Mulrich and Maurizio on this one.

 

While cars have transcended by leaps and bounds since the '50s; many other things have remained relatively static... such as violins.

 

Another example, with the exception of lasers and green dots and occasional safety updates; guns have also remained fairly static. Compare a WW II era 1911 .45 with a new one and you'll discover very little has changed. Perhaps the fp has also reached it's apex... with the exception of little tweaks here and there... such as the VP and slip and seal, etc.

 

 

- Anthony

 

EDITED to correct text.

Although cars still have the same inefficient piston engine invented well over a century ago. The only innovations is the adding of more gadgets and gimmicks, complicating the machine which in turn makes it more expensive to repair when it goes wrong. The same with fountain pens, the more innovative the manufacturers become the more complicated it is and likely to go wrong. Even past innovations weren't all they were hyped up to be.

[Lloyd]

Were TWSBIs the first pens designed for users to be able to fully disassemble as well as service (if need be)?

[Bo Bo Olson]

Top cars went from 180/200 hp about 1950 to 350 to 400 in the mid-late sixties....now pushing 750 and more if you 'want'.

 

TV's are much better than the shadowy early '50's tiny round B&W one where you had to turn off the lights in the living room.

 

The lever pen especially with the Waterman box for the lever as a filling system is as good as it was and actually as good as, and faster than any other filling system now...........but it became old fashioned....was not the newest status toy around.*** One had to unscrew something and push a button, and that became old fashioned.

 

Why it was more elegant to unscrew a barrel cap and push a button, rather than just pull a lever out....is pure advertising. ....and the status of paying more for a more complicated system. The paying more was the main point of status.

 

With the P-51 training everyone to twist off the barrel and squeeze often for a long time, trained folks for the up-to-date quicker cartridge. That kept the companies nose above water for the following decades until now. The expensive cartridge moved even Wearever into middle class in long term expense.

 

***I never had a whole lot of trouble cleaning out my lever pens....but I wasn't using supersaturated inks either. Take your Estie, screw out the nib and needle or baby rubber bulb it clean....in about the time it would take to clean a piston pen.

 

It is too bad supersaturated inks eat ink sacks....too bad they are not made to last 30-40 years like once was the case.

The sac pen, airomatic, piston, and cartridge pens are perfected. That was from the Golden Age of Fountain Pens. The converters not, in they need something in them to break vapor lock.

 

We live in the Golden Age of Inks.....and that could be a big part of the problem.

Pens of companies that make inks, design their pen to best match their inks.....not other companies inks.

 

Oddly, I've never felt the urge to take off the nibs of my Lamy pens, but the bottom of the feeds are '20's slick. PenEngineer(sp) worked with chemicals to make it as rough as ebonite....that feed is designed to work best with Lamy inks.

 

Where the problem seems for working lies with the lead to the feed, the feed and more care with the nib making. So from all I keep reading....it is the whole of the feed that is modern day problem....matched with a perhaps supersaturated inks that the feed was not designed for.

 

How many of you have these problems with Herbin, MB or Pelikan 4001 inks? Or if you use Lamy ink in your Lamy pens?