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Found Three Fountain Pens To "analyze"

fountain pen germany usa united states of america golden black

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12 replies to this topic

#1 Liuna

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 12:32

Hello to everyone. :)
I found three really similiar looking fountain pens at my love's flat. I wonder what brand they could be or how old they must be, what their engraved subtitles refer to and so on. 
I took photos and luckily I can read small letters from close, so I can write what I found engraved on their tips. 
 
I will describe them according to their order on both photos, they are in the same order on both.
 
On the left, no pattern: has a "Spirit of St Louis" graving at the bottom edge of the lid. On the point "Iridium point" and Germany are engraved with some nice spiral-decorated "frame" like pattern. It seems to be made of steel or some other lighter metal.
Middle one, "stripy": on the tip it says "Radiant tipped" and "Made in USA". It has a very light, plastic feeling, especially the lid. The other two have more metal weight and feeling.
On the right, with black shapes: on the tip it says "Matador", below that is an encircled "1" and below that is New York. The lid and body are made of metal.
 
Thank you in advance :)
 
Update: Found one more, it was in a Marksman titled case, but I'm not sure if it is one.

It says "Iridium point" on the tip as well with the same nice swirls, but no "Germany" is engraved.

It must have been a company gift, since there is a Philips logo on its lid.

There is a very little figure on the golden clip which looks like a winged human figure standing on one leg and holding a stretch-out bow.

 

Naturally the last photos with the dark blue pen count here.

Attached Images

  • IMG_20171020_122144.jpg
  • Peti tölt?tollai.jpg
  • Philips Iridium Point 01.jpg
  • Philips Iridium Point 02.jpg

Edited by Liuna, 27 October 2017 - 13:19.


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#2 Liuna

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 13:15

Found one more, it was in a Marksman titled case, but I'm not sure if it is one.

It says Iridium point on the tip as well, but no Germany. It must have been a company gift, since there is a Philips logo on its lid.

Attached Images

  • Philips Iridium Point 01.jpg
  • Philips Iridium Point 02.jpg


#3 Schadenfreude

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 14:31

About the one gifted from phillips:

I have had the same fp but in red which Hema sells. It comes from china and mine doesnt write smoothly as the nib must be repaired.

Not sure about the other ones.
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#4 inkstainedruth

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 17:57

The third pen, the one that says "Matador" is apparently a lower tier German company from back in the day.  I found a bit of information on an old thread: http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/120467-matador-expess-814/ 

but unfortunately the photos are no longer available.  Interestingly enough, the overlay design is very similar to ones I've seen on some Waterman pens, and also on some Morrison pens (a 2nd tier US company back in the 1920s-40s).  In fact, had you not said it said "Matador" my initial guess would have been that it was a Morrison.  I have a couple of Morrison ringtops with almost the same design for the overlay.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth


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#5 OMASsimo

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 20:17

The "Iridium Point" with or without "Germany" pens are cheap pens, often nice looking, with very cheap mass produced steel nibs. I wouldn't expect too much from them.

 

The German brand Matador was by no means a lower tier product. They had an excellent reputation and were innovative in their prime time in the 1930s. They did produce for export as well and I've seen overlay pens from the early 1900s. If yours is one of those, you've got a gem. But it could also be a US made pen sharing the brand name just by chance.

 

Anyway, enjoy your finds.



#6 Liuna

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Posted 28 October 2017 - 19:00

The third pen, the one that says "Matador" is apparently a lower tier German company from back in the day.  I found a bit of information on an old thread: http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/120467-matador-expess-814/ 

but unfortunately the photos are no longer available.  Interestingly enough, the overlay design is very similar to ones I've seen on some Waterman pens, and also on some Morrison pens (a 2nd tier US company back in the 1920s-40s).  In fact, had you not said it said "Matador" my initial guess would have been that it was a Morrison.  I have a couple of Morrison ringtops with almost the same design for the overlay.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

Well, I will check them again, I hope I didn't mix up. They are not here with me now, as they are my boyfriend's.

 

 

The "Iridium Point" with or without "Germany" pens are cheap pens, often nice looking, with very cheap mass produced steel nibs. I wouldn't expect too much from them.

 

The German brand Matador was by no means a lower tier product. They had an excellent reputation and were innovative in their prime time in the 1930s. They did produce for export as well and I've seen overlay pens from the early 1900s. If yours is one of those, you've got a gem. But it could also be a US made pen sharing the brand name just by chance.

 

Anyway, enjoy your finds.

 

I see, that's interesting :) Well, I barely know anything about fountain pens' brands and history, I could assume New York could either refer to its place of making or a type name?
(Also I asked my boyfriend where he got them from since they are his - he doesn't remember. He's not a big fountain pen user, so that got me curious :) ). 

Thank you :)


Edited by Liuna, 28 October 2017 - 19:01.


#7 Liuna

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Posted 28 October 2017 - 19:08

About the one gifted from phillips:

I have had the same fp but in red which Hema sells. It comes from china and mine doesnt write smoothly as the nib must be repaired.

Not sure about the other ones.

Thank you. :) I tried it out yesterday and it writes fine with basic ink. 
I may also try it out with colored ink patron sometime. Can be the patrons "stored" somehow after you "opened" the patron in case you want to change the color before either of them gets empty?



#8 Schadenfreude

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Posted 29 October 2017 - 22:37

Thank you. :) I tried it out yesterday and it writes fine with basic ink. 
I may also try it out with colored ink patron sometime. Can be the patrons "stored" somehow after you "opened" the patron in case you want to change the color before either of them gets empty?


I have never stored a cartridge that has been opened and i also dont recommend it because the ink will dry out.
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#9 Liuna

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 17:31

The third pen, the one that says "Matador" is apparently a lower tier German company from back in the day.  I found a bit of information on an old thread: http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/120467-matador-expess-814/ 
but unfortunately the photos are no longer available.  Interestingly enough, the overlay design is very similar to ones I've seen on some Waterman pens, and also on some Morrison pens (a 2nd tier US company back in the 1920s-40s).  In fact, had you not said it said "Matador" my initial guess would have been that it was a Morrison.  I have a couple of Morrison ringtops with almost the same design for the overlay.
Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

In the meantime I checked the Matador tip pen again, there is no mistake, it says Matador, a circled "1" and New York. Also noticed it said Eclipse on its side. I took better photos.

UPDATE: it turned out the Eclipse imprinted part can be opened. How can it be filled? With just ink or some very thin cartridge? Is it a vacuum kind?

Update 2: found an engraving on it, saying Anci or Arici, see on the last photo.

Attached Images

  • IMG_20171110_182100.jpg
  • IMG_20171110_182213.jpg
  • IMG_20171110_190226.jpg

Edited by Liuna, 10 November 2017 - 18:02.


#10 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 18:20

It is a lever pen, with a metal overlay***, and will need a new rubber sac, in even when that pen was made a rubber sac was only good for 30-40 years.

Good for about ten now if you don't use Supersaturated inks.....there are plenty of inks to match a rubber sac.

Conklin was the first sac pen, with a bump of metal that pushed in. Sheaffer invented the lever in 1912....were made well into the '70's....in it was a good simple working system

It is not expensive to have a professional put a new sac in it.....and it deserves it.

 

Richard Bender's site....is the bible of fountain pens....would take you three days to read all the way through.....but you want to read about , nibs....sac filling system and safe inks.

 

Metal overlays were used often in the early days of fountain pens...from the '90's ..... till almost modern times. Not all overlays are cut outs, like yours. I have some late '40's silver overlays that hide the plastic barrel completely.


German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#11 Liuna

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 17:14

It is a lever pen, with a metal overlay***, and will need a new rubber sac, in even when that pen was made a rubber sac was only good for 30-40 years.
Good for about ten now if you don't use Supersaturated inks.....there are plenty of inks to match a rubber sac.
Conklin was the first sac pen, with a bump of metal that pushed in. Sheaffer invented the lever in 1912....were made well into the '70's....in it was a good simple working system
It is not expensive to have a professional put a new sac in it.....and it deserves it.
 
Richard Bender's site....is the bible of fountain pens....would take you three days to read all the way through.....but you want to read about , nibs....sac filling system and safe inks.
 
Metal overlays were used often in the early days of fountain pens...from the '90's ..... till almost modern times. Not all overlays are cut outs, like yours. I have some late '40's silver overlays that hide the plastic barrel completely.

It's really interesting, thank you. I like that lever mechanism on it.
However, it feels a bit more like plastic by touch than metal. Otherwise it's good. We loaded it once and works well.
As for the the one (which says radiated tip), can't be properly disassembled. I can show a photo later.

Edited by Liuna, 11 November 2017 - 17:14.


#12 Bo Bo Olson

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 19:37

Perhaps someone put a new sac in it a while back.

Good.

 

A plastic  'gold' washed overlay would be lots later than the '20's....right after the war perhaps. Plastic came in or our plastic during WW2.

Perhaps an older plastic...that came in in the '30's.


German vintage '50-70 semi-flex stubs and those in oblique give the real thing in On Demand line variation. Modern Oblique is a waste of money for a shadow of line variation. Being too lazy to Hunt for affordable vintage oblique pens, lets you 'hunt' for line variation instead of having it.

www.nibs.com/blog/nibster-writes/nibs-germany & https://www.peter-bo...cts/nib-systems,

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 


#13 Liuna

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Posted 13 November 2017 - 09:46

Perhaps someone put a new sac in it a while back.
Good.
 
A plastic  'gold' washed overlay would be lots later than the '20's....right after the war perhaps. Plastic came in or our plastic during WW2.
Perhaps an older plastic...that came in in the '30's.

Meanwhile I found yet another detail: on the side of the top of the cap I noticed a little "14 KT GOLD FILLED" graving, it can´t be seen very clearly, but can be noticed if I look at it closer. Itś´s a bit faded. According to my love (it´s his pen) it must be made of copper with gold filling. We saw that some of it has come off, revealing a more ocreish layer with very small checkered pattern surface (it seems to be the surface of the metal itself, not imprinted). So I guess the black part is the only plastic made part (someone said it could be bacelite).

I checked the Morrison pens that an other person mentioned here, they indeed look similiar. I think it could be an Eclipse pen with a Matador tip maybe? It turned out there exist Eclipse called pens. (Eclipse is graved on the lever as I mentioned). Also noticed there was a wooden colored surface in the little hole(?) on the tip.

Edited by Liuna, 13 November 2017 - 09:49.






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