What's The Least Scratchy Fine Point Nib You Know?

[thiagojp]

On a side note, I agree with Minddance, Sailor and Platinum feel better with a very light touch. But if you learn how to control your arm it becomes a very smooth, very pleasant experience. With a bit more pressure they dont become scratchy, but it is not as pleasant, and they may dig a bit in the paper on upstrokes.

[Jerome Tarshis]

In first place, the Montblanc Noblesse I used to own.

 

Tied 2-4, my Waterman Laureat, which admittedly verges upon having a medium nib, but Waterman labels it a fine; my Ronson fountain pen, with a genuinely fine nib; and the Montblanc SlimLine that I now own.

[Tasmith]

My Wing Sung 698 EF is amazingly smooth.

[bayport714]

Parker 51 and Cross Peerless. Vintage and modern.

[Lloyd]

Whichever one is being used on very smooth paper.

[Mew]

One of my friend said:

 

"Pelikan EFs will probably be the smoothest in general because theyre misstamped M nibs"

[pajaro]

Parker 51 and Pelikan, Montblanc close.

 

. I understand the comment above, about Pelikan fines being misstamped mediums, and sometimes I have felt that way, but more often they fit the German definition of a fine. Bear in mind that European nibs are often a bit wider than American nibs for any size, which are often broader than Japanese nibs of the same size. It is easy to forget about this and go off on the maker.

[Mew]

@Pajaro:

 

That may be so (German definition of extra fine) but I have used an MB 149 with a F nib which was probably putting down a line width half as wide as a Pelikan F. Montblanc is German too. Haven't owned or tried a Lamy for a long enough duration to say anything about it.

 

What I have found/observed is:

Pelikan EF ~ other European maker's F ~ Japanese M

Factor in the inconsistency from Pelikan and maybe it would go to Japanese B or a BB vs Pelikan EF.

I had both Pelikan EF and F in M805's and EF was putting down the same line width as F was. Comparing them to my M800 F, they were slightly broader.

 

Just my observations.

[Tasmith]

One of my friend said:

 

"Pelikan EFs will probably be the smoothest in general because theyre misstamped M nibs"

 

My M200 F is finer than my M200 EF.

[Mew]

 

My M200 F is finer than my M200 EF.

Yeah, that can happen too.

B can be finer than M

F can be finer than EF

F or EF can be same

2 F nibs put down very different line widths

 

Just luck of the draw.

[Bo Bo Olson]

 

My M200 F is finer than my M200 EF.

Yeah, that can happen too.

B can be finer than M

F can be finer than EF

F or EF can be same

2 F nibs put down very different line widths

 

Just luck of the draw.""""

Not Quite......depends on make, ink and paper and some add how humid the day is.

 

 

Each company has it's very own standards to what a width is.

Back in the Day.....Parker made fatter nibs than Sheaffer, in either that was what their customers at the fabled Corner Pen Shoppe wanted (though years of market survey), or they had trained their customers to want that.

They did not make the same width as Sheaffer, in had they their customers could have made a tragic mistake....and bought a Sheaffer.

 

Company nib width also depends what ink the company makes or made. Pelikan makes a dry ink so has a wider wetter nib, to bring that to a golden middle. Waterman made a wetter ink, so had a narrower dryer nib....again meeting in the middle.

 

You are not using a Kaweco ink....so the nib and feed are not adjusted for a Diamine ink. (Kaweco inks are 'new' so I don't know if they used their old formula or a new one, and did or did not match the ink to their feed and nibs.) I would have thought they would have taken a day to see which formula worked or not.

 

With in tolerance/slop a skinny M can exactly = a fat F....exactly. When you have two different companies, overlap of tip width would be normal. The fatter writing darker.

 

Just before Sheaffer closed it's US factory, Ron Zorn went to it....and let us into the secret of tolerance.

 

""""Ron Zorn tolerance

Sheaffer used a dial indicator nib gauge for measuring nib sizes. The nib was inserted into the gauge, and the size read off of the dial. A given size being nibs that fell within a given range. What is listed below were the ranges given on a gauge that I saw in the Sheaffer service center prior to being closed in March 2008.

 

Measurements are in thousandths of an inch.

 

XXF = 0.010 - 0.013

XF = 0.013 - 0.018

F = 0.018 - 0.025

M = 0.025 - 0.031

Broad* = 0.031 - 0.050

Stub = 0.038 - 0.050

 

*there was some overlap on the gauge. May be 0.035 - 0.050.""""

 

Just because a nib says M means little, because of tolerance. Two different companies have different standards. So part of one's M tolerance could fall into another's F range.

 

And the 1.0, or what ever the 'new' attempt at a standardization that is offered will also have slop/tolerance......1.1-0.9 would be easily with in tolerance.

 

The only way to have your nibs all the same width as marked, is to pick just one nibmeister only and have him do all your nibs...........a different nibmeister would come up with a slightly different width.

(I don't see any real reason to do that.....but I'm not as OCD now as when I was 'noobie'.

I grew to know even with in the company, there will be half widths....much less across companies. Is it 'skinny'....good, is it 'middling'..good, is it 'broad'...good.

Take your pick hand grenades or horseshoes is as close as you are going to get with nib widths, unless you are rich and AR.

Then it depends on, flex of the nib, what paper, how hard you press when you write....and some say if the day is humid or not.

 

An EF nib on a modern 400/600/800 is fatter than semi-vintage or vintage. A 200 still has the older 1/2 a width narrower nib........so try one of them on your 400/600 instead of the fat modern one.

 

And if you calibrated your eyes with Japanese nibs from the start, the only Euro pen that won't be fat is the Aurora.

I of course calibrated my eye with American and Euro pens, so find Japanese nibs to be miss makred once size too skinny.

In I'm not after 'butter smooth' (I might use a slick paper) , so I have no idea what my smoothest F or EF pen is.....I seldom use EF. I'm after 'good and smooth' one level lower than butter smooth and have many that are similar. I would of course expect an F to be smoother than an EF....just like I'd expect an M to be smoother than an F.

[sirgilbert357]

One of my friend said:

 

"Pelikan EFs will probably be the smoothest in general because theyre misstamped M nibs"

 

LOL! That's funny...he must use Japanese pens more than European, heheh.

 

My Pilot 78g with a medium nib lays down a really smooth line that I would consider to be a fine. Anything thinner would look like a strand of hair on the paper, and I prefer to actually see the COLOR in my inks!!!

[Mew]

 

LOL! That's funny...he must use Japanese pens more than European, heheh.

 

My Pilot 78g with a medium nib lays down a really smooth line that I would consider to be a fine. Anything thinner would look like a strand of hair on the paper, and I prefer to actually see the COLOR in my inks!!!

Nah, he uses B nibs, mostly European including Pelikan.

I use Japanese F and FM and I don't particularly mind Pelikan EF's writing like Japanese mediums, but I do not like this sort of inconsistency where EF's write broader or equal to F's.

[ethernautrix]

Pilot PO (posting).

[Tseg]

Waterman Carene on Tomoe River paper with Waterman Mysterious Blue ink is my smoothest writing fine pen.

Edited April 11, 2018 by Tseg

[Kodiac136]

Sheaffer Legacy. Writes like a fine, feels as smooth as any nib I've ever used.

[Sasha Royale]

I find Parker 51 nibs to be consistently better, but the experience depends greatly on the fine-tuning of nut that holds the pen barrel.

[inkstainedruth]

Yeah, that can happen too.

B can be finer than M

F can be finer than EF

F or EF can be same

2 F nibs put down very different line widths

 

Just luck of the draw.

 

And that isn't just with Pelikan (although I like the EF nib on the striated blue M405 a lot).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

[Mew]

 

And that isn't just with Pelikan (although I like the EF nib on the striated blue M405 a lot).

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

Which other companies are like this?

[inkstainedruth]

Which other companies are like this?

 

I have a bunch of Parker Vectors and some of the fine nibs write more like mediums. And vice versa. And the Parker Urban wrote broader than the M nibbed Vectors, even though it was supposed be an F as well.

Of course, I chalk that up -- at least in part -- to the Urban being a piece of cr*p....

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

 

ETA: I've seen similar reports about Lamy nibs, but can't really say one way or the other. I only have two: Safari (F nib) and LX (M nib). I haven't actually done a side by side comparison yet (the LX is still so new I'm working on the original cartridge of Lamy Blue). OTOH, I did try an EF nib last fall at one of the tables at the Ohio Pen Show, and found it to be very scratchy.

Edited April 13, 2018 by inkstainedruth