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Parker 51... ...or... A Lamy 2000?

lamy parker 2000 51 vs

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#21 AL01

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 15:20

What are you writing with now?
I have a bunch of P51's, areo, Vac, and mk111's, and I love them all. But I won't take the mk1 or vacs out of the house. I'll carry a Pelikan, Montblanc, Sailor, almost anything that can easily be replaced. The P51's are no longer made. Pens fall out of your pocket, off the desk, your backpack gets snatched, all sorts of things can happen to an EDC. You might consider the Lamy 2000 Makrolon for now, the fiberglass body will take a lot of wear and tear. Plan to get the P51 for graduation, your birthday, or Christmas. Especially if you can get someone to gift it to you.
Also I suggest you steer away from the P51 Vac. I know you have your heart set on one and they are really great pens. The sac is their Achilles heel. It is latex, You might look for an areo with a plyglass sac. They are extremely durable and easy to clean, and more forgiving of today's inks. I only use Waterman Serenity Blue in my Vacs. I'm less conservative with the Areo's equipped with a plyglass sac. You can put almost any ink in them as long as you maintain good pen hygiene and clean them regularly.
There is a small amount of areo's out there with what looks to be a black latex sac similar to what is in the Vac. Be on the look out for these. I ended up with one out of carelessness. Eventually I'll change out the sac. Look for a clear plyglass sac in your new P51, you won't be disappointed.
I'm sure you will have both the Parker and a 2000 before too long.
Whichever you choose I'm sure you'll be happy with it. They are all quality pens.

 

 Answering the First question: Sheaffer school pen, Wearever Pennant, Sheaffer Prelude, Pilot Prera, Esterbrook J, Parker Vector, Lamy Al Star. USED TO USE: Pilot Varsity, Sheaffer VFM, Parker 45, Parker 21.

 

 I'll keep that in mind. I have not had the problem of getting my pens stolen. I use Waterman Blue, Skrip Blue, Noodler's Black, Jentle Turquoise, Lamy Blue, and I occasionally use a special bottle of Skrip Orange/Gold.  

 

 Vacs aren't notoriously unreliable, right? I own an Estie and a Wearever Pennant, no problems for 2.5 years.

 

 Thank You.


Edited by AL01, 04 May 2017 - 15:25.

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#22 AL01

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 15:23

The most important consideration for me is how long do you tend to write for, and how frequently do you want to change your ink colour?

 

Parker 51 aerometric or vacumatic won't write for so long with one fill as a Lamy 2000 will, and both Parkers are more difficult to clean out before changing ink colour than the Lamy 2000 is.

 

As far as a sweet spot on a nib is concerned, on a F nib this shouldn't be so much of an issue. Most Parker 51's will have nibs that have been previously used by someone else. So the sweet spot on A Parker 51 will always seem bigger than that on a brand new Lamy 2000 nib. In any case, when you start writing with a pen, you will make your own sweet spot on your new nib.

 

 I change ink colours whenever my pens run out of ink. Cleaning out a pen is no problem for me. 


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#23 _InkyFingers

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 17:32

I have all three and prefer another.

P51 all time faithful and never inked.
L2k great pen. Not my style.
A88 is the top of these three.

But if you want a pen, get the Omas 361. If you can find one.

#24 Old Salt

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 19:14

[quote name="AL01" post="3843392" timestamp="1493911252"]
 Vacs aren't notoriously unreliable, right? I own an Estie and a Wearever Pennant, no problems for 2.5 years.
 
I never said that Vacs are notoriously unreliable. It seems, those are your words. Vacs are not at all unreliable, but they, like all pens have their good and not so good features. That was all i was attempting to point out. Yet, you unapologetically distort my words.
We maintain a certain decorum here. Good Manners if you will. People from all over the world each with their own experiences culture, language, and opinions to share. Some how we all seem to get along showing respect and appreciation. All while not necessarily being in agreement.

You seem well experienced with fountain pens, I know you will make a wise decision. Best of luck to you.....Salt

#25 AL01

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 20:15

 Old Salt, my apologies... You have more experience than I ever will with pens. I'll keep what you said in mind. I am the type of person who likes the worst case scenarios... Again, my apologies. Thanks for correcting me.

 

 Al.


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#26 AL01

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 20:15

I have all three and prefer another.

P51 all time faithful and never inked.
L2k great pen. Not my style.
A88 is the top of these three.

But if you want a pen, get the Omas 361. If you can find one.

 

 

 I'll keep that in mind... But I'll pass with the 361. Thanks...


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#27 Parispens

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 15:28

Hi..someone said to go with the one you like. I agree.  I own multiple copies of each one. I'll point two advantages of the Lamy 2K over the P51. First, it's less expensive than the Parker. Second, The Lamy 2K is supposedly designed to prevent leaks when flying. Mine have never leaked on planes, but my 51s occasionally have. If you're looking for a really good EDC pen that's sturdy and easily replaced go for the Lamy.

 

I'm about to leave for an airline trip so I'm filling up my L2K to test as one of the potential candidates.

 

Good luck. Enjoy your quest.



#28 Albert26

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 15:43

As I said already, I would go for an Aurora 88, but if I had to choose btw Lamy 2000 and Parker 51, I don't know if I would make up my mind. Both are almost perfect pens, with in my opinion the following shortcomings:

 

- The Parker 51, being the nib completely covered, makes it a bit difficult for me to write, especially to write fast; I need to pay more attention to put the nib in the correct position as I would otherwise need with an uncovered or semi-hooded nib (Aurora 88 and Lamy 2000 style).

- What bothers me about the Lamy 2000, on the other hand, is that there is no true fine, let alone extra fine nib available. No matter how they call it, their "extra fine" nib is actually a medium, or at most a wet western fine, especially the more you use it. So keep that in mind if, like me, you have small handwriting.

 

Apart from these observations, which I know don't bother many people, you can't go wrong with either.


Edited by Albert26, 05 May 2017 - 15:44.


#29 AL01

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 20:07

Hi..someone said to go with the one you like. I agree.  I own multiple copies of each one. I'll point two advantages of the Lamy 2K over the P51. First, it's less expensive than the Parker. Second, The Lamy 2K is supposedly designed to prevent leaks when flying. Mine have never leaked on planes, but my 51s occasionally have. If you're looking for a really good EDC pen that's sturdy and easily replaced go for the Lamy.

 

I'm about to leave for an airline trip so I'm filling up my L2K to test as one of the potential candidates.

 

Good luck. Enjoy your quest.

 

 

 Enjoy your flight! Hope that the 2k does not leak... P51 Aeros leak on the plane? I heard vacs have a little bit of a problem, but not aeros...


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#30 AL01

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 20:11

As I said already, I would go for an Aurora 88, but if I had to choose btw Lamy 2000 and Parker 51, I don't know if I would make up my mind. Both are almost perfect pens, with in my opinion the following shortcomings:

 

- The Parker 51, being the nib completely covered, makes it a bit difficult for me to write, especially to write fast; I need to pay more attention to put the nib in the correct position as I would otherwise need with an uncovered or semi-hooded nib (Aurora 88 and Lamy 2000 style).

- What bothers me about the Lamy 2000, on the other hand, is that there is no true fine, let alone extra fine nib available. No matter how they call it, their "extra fine" nib is actually a medium, or at most a wet western fine, especially the more you use it. So keep that in mind if, like me, you have small handwriting.

 

Apart from these observations, which I know don't bother many people, you can't go wrong with either.

 

 Thanks... I like both of them too much. I may just get both. If I could do under 200$ for both, both may be winners. I did check out the 88, for a good price, it looks like a nice pen. Who sells them? I don't see a lot of good ones on FPN and Ebay...

 

 I used to own a P21 Super. The 51 is like an upgraded P21 Super in some regards. 

 

 I am still looking for opportunities for each pen... I will keep you updated. Any more suggestions will be appreciated.

 

 Thanks, Al.


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#31 FOUR X FOUR

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 20:11

The Lamy 2000. Carlos suggestion is also good. Buy both

#32 Albert26

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 20:28

 

 Thanks... I like both of them too much. I may just get both. If I could do under 200$ for both, both may be winners. I did check out the 88, for a good price, it looks like a nice pen. Who sells them? I don't see a lot of good ones on FPN and Ebay...

 

 I used to own a P21 Super. The 51 is like an upgraded P21 Super in some regards. 

 

 I am still looking for opportunities for each pen... I will keep you updated. Any more suggestions will be appreciated.

 

 Thanks, Al.

On ebay.it there are always offers of Aurora 88. It was a model sold in the millions (and small wonder). I prefer the earlier versions of the late 40s and 50s, because later on the pen got thinner, and this is one of the features for which I prefer it over the 51, the extra girth.



#33 AL01

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 20:46

 Ok. I'll look at International sellers... In the USA, you really can't find vintage European pens... But I will take a look at it. 

 

EDIT: They are quite affordable in Italy's Ebay webpage. Interesting option.


Edited by AL01, 05 May 2017 - 20:59.

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#34 ac12

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 20:56

 

 

 I change ink colours whenever my pens run out of ink. Cleaning out a pen is no problem for me. 

 

My 51 has PR DCSS blue, and it is a LONG TERM ink.  I have not changed ink for the past 3+ years.

I would not recommend a 51 to someone who will be constantly changing inks. 

 

The 51 can be a PiA to clean, especially the Vac model.  Cleaning a 51 will require a LOT of soaking and emptying, like 3x a day for a week+.  If you get a 51, I highly recommend that you build a Ron Zorn spin dryer, to whip the water/ink out of the pen.


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#35 AL01

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 21:09

Eh... The Parker 21 gave me an excuse to kill time..  :lol:

 

(Might as well look at some aeros...)


Edited by AL01, 05 May 2017 - 21:09.

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#36 Albert26

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 21:30

Yup, this is also important. I change inks compulsively as well. A piston pen is easier to clean and take care of than a vacumatic. I don't know aerometric, I haven't any pens with an aerometric system.

 

By the way, as of late I have set my eyes in the Pilot Custom Heritage 92. By all means it looks quite hard to beat as a dependable, everyday pen, and I don't have a single demonstrator in my collection. At some point I will get one, pretty sure...



#37 AL01

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 22:54

 The Pilot customs are good pens... I just don't like the feel of them. The nibs on the Customs and the 3776 are phenomenal. But the 2000 feels better suited for fast cursive. I do have a Pilot Prera. A nice fine nib with a wet flow. I highly recommend them, that is if you like the way they feel in the hand.


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#38 AL01

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 22:55

The answer is obvious.... buy both! :thumbup:

 

 

 I questioned you before, but you sir, are 200% right! I will find both. Thanks for the help!

 

  :thumbup:


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#39 carlos.q

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Posted 05 May 2017 - 23:51

I questioned you before, but you sir, are 200% right! I will find both. Thanks for the help!
 
  :thumbup:

Well, we are all just happy enablers on this forum. :)

You can get both pens within your budget. Check out Massdrop as they usually sell L2k pens for $103. As for the P51 I would recommend Rick Krantz or any other of the usual vendors in the classifieds.

Enjoy!

#40 pajaro

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Posted 06 May 2017 - 02:09

The most important consideration for me is how long do you tend to write for, and how frequently do you want to change your ink colour?
 
Parker 51 aerometric or vacumatic won't write for so long with one fill as a Lamy 2000 will, and both Parkers are more difficult to clean out before changing ink colour than the Lamy 2000 is.
 
As far as a sweet spot on a nib is concerned, on a F nib this shouldn't be so much of an issue. Most Parker 51's will have nibs that have been previously used by someone else. So the sweet spot on A Parker 51 will always seem bigger than that on a brand new Lamy 2000 nib. In any case, when you start writing with a pen, you will make your own sweet spot on your new nib.


The solution to using several inks with 51s is to have several, and a salad spinner.

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