Help Me Identify This Pen Please!

[bearhung]

I got this serviced vintage Waterman FP from a local store but can't find any information about it on the internet. Does anyone know what model it is and its approximate year of manufacturing? Thank you.

 

Marking on nib: Waterman's Ideal 14kt Canada 2A

Marking on the pen: Waterman's Made in Canada

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 2, 2017 by bearhung

[gweimer1]

I'm thinking a W5, based on the photo, and search I did. 1940's Canada pen.

 

http://d2ydh70d4b5xgv.cloudfront.net/images/5/8/waterman-s-w5-grey-striated-gold-fountain-pen-pencil-in-box-canada-1940-s-cb75057dadfa43044797af6d1bd7d96b.jpg

[bearhung]

I'm thinking a W5, based on the photo, and search I did. 1940's Canada pen.

 

http://d2ydh70d4b5xgv.cloudfront.net/images/5/8/waterman-s-w5-grey-striated-gold-fountain-pen-pencil-in-box-canada-1940-s-cb75057dadfa43044797af6d1bd7d96b.jpg

 

 

Thanks gweimer1. I've just looked up "Waterman W5" on the net and it seems that there are so many variants of this model (color of the clip, overall length, shape of the tip of the barrel etc.), all with some subtle differences and none of them looks exactly the same with mine. Anyway I also believe it's a W5 and I'm glad that now I own a pen that is older than me!

Edited May 2, 2017 by bearhung

[eharriett]

Hmmm. You know, if you didn't say it was a Waterman, and I didn't see the clip, I would have sworn it was a red Esterbrook. I wonder how many other pens had that general look?

[bearhung]

Hmmm. You know, if you didn't say it was a Waterman, and I didn't see the clip, I would have sworn it was a red Esterbrook. I wonder how many other pens had that general look?

 

Yes, I check it out and they really look almost the same. Do you have any idea which came first and which is the copy cat?

[peterg]

The pen looks rather too small to be a W5. A W2 perhaps?

 

Approx year 1950-52.

Edited May 3, 2017 by peterg

[bearhung]

The pen looks rather too small to be a W5. A W2 perhaps?

 

Approx year 1950-52.

 

Yes it seems that my pen is really smaller. However, the capped length of W2 and W5 are 5" and 5-1/8" respectively (correct me if I'm wrong but the data on the internet are in fact quite confusing) and my FP is in fact much shorter than that (only 4-1/4"). Therefore, could it be something else other than W2 and W5?

[Chris26]

hello,

 

Too short to be a 515, its length is 13,5 cm approx. Neither a W2 its length is 13 cm approx. and the one pictured is 11 cm. So for the shape and its length ( 11 cm approx.), I think it might be a 512V.

Edited May 8, 2017 by Chris26

[bearhung]

hello,

 

Too short to be a 515, its length is 13,5 cm approx. Neither a W2 its length is 13 cm approx. and the one pictured is 11 cm. So for the shape and its length ( 11 cm approx.), I think it might be a 512V.

 

Hi Chris, thanks for your input. I also agree that my pen is neither a W2 nor a 515 as it is just much shorter. It does seem like a 512V in term of its length. However, as far as I can see from the example found on the internet 512V has a single art-deco styled cap band and a rounded barrel end while mine has triple bands (in the order of narrow-broad-narrow) and a flat barrel end. Therefore, I still have doubt whether my pen is really a 512V.

 

This style of the triple cap bands seems to be unique to W5. Is there any chance that there is a short or lady version of Waterman W5?

Edited May 10, 2017 by bearhung

[bearhung]

 

 

 

[Ernst Bitterman]

Let me suggest something:

 

 

That's from a UK catalogue of 1947; it's (relatively) safe to assume that the Canadian factory was following that lead a little more closely than it did the US. Neither of these models appear in the otherwise similar US catalogue for that year.

[pieemme]

Can you also help me identify this English made Waterman, which came in an auction in a lot with other pens and a few odd items?

[pieemme]

Sorry, the answer was easier than I'd thought. It's an L2. I was expecting the coding to be more,complicated. It's from the late 50s, shortly before the end of old Waterman. A good writer, though the esthetics not quite to my taste. The colour reminds me of old hospitals.

[bearhung]

Let me suggest something:

 

 

That's from a UK catalogue of 1947; it's (relatively) safe to assume that the Canadian factory was following that lead a little more closely than it did the US. Neither of these models appear in the otherwise similar US catalogue for that year.

 

Thanks for that piece of information!

 

Just judging from the ratio of different parts my pen really seems like a Lady Patricia. Unfortunately the picture on the catalogue is sort of blurry (of course I know we can't expect too much from a document as old as this one) and thus I am not sure if mine is really a Lady Patricia. Anyway this is a highly possible candidate apart from W2. I guess I will never have a conclusive answer to the real identity of my pen...

[Chris26]

 

Hi Chris, thanks for your input. I also agree that my pen is neither a W2 nor a 515 as it is just much shorter. It does seem like a 512V in term of its length. However, as far as I can see from the example found on the internet 512V has a single art-deco styled cap band and a rounded barrel end while mine has triple bands (in the order of narrow-broad-narrow) and a flat barrel end. Therefore, I still have doubt whether my pen is really a 512V.

 

This style of the triple cap bands seems to be unique to W5. Is there any chance that there is a short or lady version of Waterman W5?

You are right I did not realise about the art deco ring and the shape of the barrel, it is not a 512V. I have no idea which model it could be. It is a Lady Patricia then?

[Left FPN]

I know this may not confirm suggestion but here is a Patrician box which matches the above box.

 

It just may well be that Waterman designed a slightly smaller version for the Lady P.

 

 

 

 

[gweimer1]

This has been an interesting thread, and really educational. There are so many variations of these pens, and what intrigues me is how many subtle variations of the three cap ring configuration that define different models.

[Ernst Bitterman]

This has been an interesting thread, and really educational. There are so many variations of these pens, and what intrigues me is how many subtle variations of the three cap ring configuration that define different models.

 

It's all part of the plot laid down in ages past by Waterman and Sheaffer to drive pen collectors of the future into fits of dribbling madness.

[gweimer1]

 

It's all part of the plot laid down in ages past by Waterman and Sheaffer to drive pen collectors of the future into fits of dribbling madness.

 

It worked...

[LuckyLux]

 

Thanks for that piece of information!

 

Just judging from the ratio of different parts my pen really seems like a Lady Patricia. Unfortunately the picture on the catalogue is sort of blurry (of course I know we can't expect too much from a document as old as this one) and thus I am not sure if mine is really a Lady Patricia. Anyway this is a highly possible candidate apart from W2. I guess I will never have a conclusive answer to the real identity of my pen...

Hi bearhung, I have one of these pens, different colour. I will be conclusive and call it a Lady Patricia which had a #2 nib. The Canada/England ones looks different to the U.S. version and were also made longer (Dates anyone?). Yes, the cap bands are main visual. I am pinning mine to around circa 1945 (TBD) and trying to find colour name. Mine is pearlescent celluloid showing as a grey/green colour streaks. Dave