Giving Chinese Pens More Respect And A Poll

[Maurizio]

Some Background

 

My first experience with a Chinese pen was a disaster. It was a Jinhao x750 that just wouldn't write. I bought it from a Chinese seller via Amazon after reading several glowing reviews here about the pen. When it arrived I really like the size, shape, & heft of the pen - this was before I had even heard of or seen a Jinhao 159. I flushed in with diluted ammonia & then plain water. Put some Pilot Blue ink in it and it wouldn't write. Flushed it again, spread the tines a little with my brass shims, still no good (I'm by no means an expert tinker and wouldn't dare such maneuvers with my precious Pilots or other pens). I wasted several more hours flushing, brushing the feed with a toothbrush, and fiddling with it to no avail; it still wouldn't write. I finally trashed it with contempt swearing off "cheap Chinese pens".

 

The Brave New World of Chinese Pens

 

That was about two & a half years ago. An avid reader of the FPN, I started seeing numerous mentions of the Jinhao 159 here. Generally liking big pens, I was intrigued and eventually decided to take another chance on another inexpensive Chinese pen. Not expecting much, I ordered one from another Chinese seller on the Amazon platform for a little less than $4.00. When the pen arrived in its humble plastic bag - no box - I immediately liked the size, shape and weight of the pen, even though it did seem to be to be lathed slightly off center. I flushed it with a more aggressive mix of ammonia and water than I would use for a more expensive pen - roughly 1/3 ammonia in 2/3 water; and then a flush with plain water. This has now become my standard flushing protocol for Chinese pens.

 

When I first put the Jinhao 159 to paper I was very pleasantly surprised at its performance, so much so that I had to post an enthusiastic note here (see "Big & Smooth" https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/309610-big-smooth-jinhao-159/).

My 159 writes better, I feel, than my Pilot Metropolitan medium which is equally sturdily built, though slimmer, and retails for about 4 times more than the cost of the 159. I liked the 159 so much that - like many others here - I ordered another one. The price had increased just a bit. I just ordered my 3rd 159, black with gold trim, and happily paid $9.99 for it. It also does seem that there are more color offerings for the 159 now than when I bought my first one about a year and a half ago.

 

Since my positive experience with the Jinhao 159 I've started to read the Chinese sub-forum here regularly where I have learned about other Chinese pens I was willing to try including a Hero 382, a Jinhao 1200 (neat dragon clip, nice heavy pen), and a 2nd Jinhao x750; this one writes nicely!

 

Chinese pens deserve praise because they provide us with an incredible amount of sheer fountain pen joy at accessible prices and this is no small thing. I think, at least for many of us here, fountain pens are a hobby and hobbies are supposed to be fun. This does not mean that serious collectors of high end pens don't also have fun; of course they do, and may they continue to do so for as long as they wish. And it doesn't mean that a serious collector can't also enjoy fiddling around with an inexpensive pen. I only mean to praise Chinese pens for providing a gateway to the joy of fountain pens to more people with out the necessity of a bank account capable of buying ebonite, 18k gold, urushi, maki-e or other fountain pen delights. And the accessibility of Chinese pens may help foster such a joy as to inspire more folks to save to get at least one "grail" pen someday.

 

Chinese pens, because of their cost, also allow would-be novice tinkers a field to practice in before moving on to adjust more expensive pens.

 

I think it's now time that we give more respect to Chinese pens and it's time they "come of age" in our collective thinking about them. It's already widely known that some respected pens such as Cross are now made in China and they still get good reviews. I received a Cross Bailey as a corporate gift a couple of holidays ago and it was a smoothly-writing decent pen (gave it to a summer intern). Mr. Pen's pens are made somewhere in the "Far East" his website says; odds are this is in China I'd wager. I don't own one yet but I plan to as these pens have garnered consistently good comments. I believe there are some other well-known pens with good reputations which also are made in China. The point is that Chinese manufacturers are already capable of producing a quality pen if they want to, and, if the price justifies the additional attention to quality in the manufacturing process.

 

I think the respect and change in perception is already taking place at least in some quarters. Goulet Pens and other mainstream online sellers now offer some Chinese pens because I think these retailers realize that some Chinese pens - like the Jinhao 159 - are solid performers in themselves and do also serve as "gateway pens" for beginners who may then next buy a more expensive pen.

 

The Poll

 

I'd be willing to pay more for a "stepped up" version of some Chinese pens. "Stepped up" how? Pens that are improved, manufactured better, made with better materials. I would be willing to pay for better quality control in the overall manufacturing process, better "fit and finish" as we say. Both of my Jinhao 159's are lathed slightly off-center for example. I'd be willing to pay for better or more optimized feed, nibs tuned for optimized performance the way the best manufacturers do it, and for the option of getting the pen with a steel or a real 14k gold nib, tuned nicely before it ships.

 

I propose that we as a fountain pen community representing a solid segment of fountain pen users worldwide write open letters to Chinese manufacturers to express our willingness to pay more for pens which are improved and manufactured to higher quality standards. We can send these letters by email or snail mail if members so choose.

 

I am here also asking for any FPN members who are fluent in Chinese languages and dialects who'd be willing to help and translate our letters and help us navigate the often Chinese-language only websites of these manufacturers. Maybe I'm just not that capable, but I can't even find websites for Jinhao or Hero in English, for example, if they do exist.

 

I think an emailed letter will be more persuasive if it is either "signed" by hundreds or thousands of people here, or, if hundreds or thousands of people send their own individual email to some manufacturers.

 

My poll here is simply to determine if we can reach any kind of consensus about what pens we should ask Chinese manufacturers to improve. I admit that maybe we won't be able to do that given the proliferation of Chinese pen brands and pen models, but I thought it might be worth a try. After the poll closes I will start a draft of a model open letter which I will then post for other to suggest improvements to, to use, or to modify as they see fit.

 

A Prize

 

In order to encourage participation in this poll, I will be giving away a new Pilot Metropolitan (fine point) and a bottle of Noodler's Blue ink. The winner will be chosen entirely at random by drawing names out of a basket. I will ship the prize to the winner at my expense.

 

The purpose of this poll is to try to show Chinese manufacturers that there is indeed a market for them to bother to take the time and expense to offer a higher quality product at least in some pen models.

(I wanted to add a "fill in your choice" but couldn't figure out how to do that - sorry).

 

I just realized that answers to the poll are anonymous. So please just make a simple post here to note that you voted. I will take this on people's honor. I will write all the screen names on slips of paper and draw from a basket then contact you backchannel for a mailing address. I will announce the winner on the post.

Edited April 23, 2017 by Maurizio

[ParkerDuofold]

Hello Maurizio,

 

I will grant you that Chinese pens have made strides in improved quality the past few years, (compared to the vintage ones I've tried), and I'm sure we all agree they still have a ways to go... and I like them; owning a little over 30 now, with 12 more coming.

 

But it is their hit and miss quality which always makes me hesitate recommending them to someone who's really interested in fp's for the first time... for them, I'll always recommend the Lamy Safari/Al-Star/Logo as my first choice... because it would break my heart if they ended up with one of the random dogs and walked away from the hobby for good.

 

(Although I must also confess caving to the Jinhao March... once the OP says he doesn't like Safari's).

 

That said, I have given a few Jinhao's away, (after I personally tuned them), and also cautioned the recipient not to expect more than a year or two out of it because some brands are infamous for inner cap failures, rendering the pen useless.

 

I also just bought a dozen of Jinhao's new 992 model that I plan to play with and maybe also give out to people who try to borrow my L2K at work, basically as a give-away bp... except that it happens to be a fp. (I was going to do that with Varsity's, but the 992's are almost half the price ).

 

However, all that said, (and not to even broach the human rights violations and religious persecution that's rampant in China, that puts a twinge in my gizzards whenever I do buy Chinese brand pens), I will still more readily recommend a Lamy unless the person is on a church mouse budget, because I know if he/she buys a Lamy, they'll probably come back for more... I still believe for the most part that those probabilities decline dramatically with the majority of Chinese brands... at least for the time being... but that still doesn't stop me from occasionally throwing them at people, yelling "Try a fp instead... you'll live longer and prosper!"

 

 

- Anthony

Edited April 22, 2017 by ParkerDuofold

[NinthSphere]

Personally, I would love to see a better quality 159, 992, &/or Hero 565.

 

More specifically, one piece barrels ala Lingmo on the non-demo 992s, although one might ask why you don't just buy a Lingmo at that point. Different material options perhaps.

 

For the 565, a better filling system & cap clutch ala 51 mk1 aero.

 

Across the board. better qc on nib alignment, but I'd say the same of all pens. For Jinhaos that use nib unit collars, make use of those threads. A friction fit threaded nib unit is nonsensical & you would avoid the units popping out as they sometimes do now.

 

edit: Now, to be fair though, my only real complaint about the 159 is the folded clip & perhaps only being available in laquered brass. Nib materials aside, I'm not sure what I else I would do to improve it.

Edited April 22, 2017 by NinthSphere

[ParkerDuofold]

Personally, I would love to see a better quality 159, 992, &/or Hero 565.

 

More specifically, one piece barrels ala Lingmo on the non-demo 992s...

Hi NS,

 

Do you currently own and use the 992? What do you think of it overall? (Those are the dozen pens I just bought - based on a very favorable review here).

 

- Anthony

[NinthSphere]

Hi NS,

 

Do you currently own and use the 992? What do you think of it overall? (Those are the dozen pens I just bought - based on a very favorable review here).

 

- Anthony

 

I have two on the way, a grey & a black demo. I haven't had any negative experience with Jinhao other than a couple of pens needing slight tweaking to alignment, so I expect no different from the 992s. A bit disappointed that the opaques are also injection molded & so using the same barrel plugs as the demos, but that's just an aethetic nitpick.

[TheRealMikeDr]

I've got three Jinhao 159's, an X750 an X450, a Kaigelu 316, and a Baor 388. The 159's are my favorite of the bunch but the nib will always be the weak point for all of those. Put an aftermarket nib on a 159 and it's a fine pen IMO.

 

In the end they're decent pens for the money, no doubt, but the nib holds them back from competing even with a Pilot Metropolitan.

[ParkerDuofold]

 

I have two on the way, a grey & a black demo. I haven't had any negative experience with Jinhao other than a couple of pens needing slight tweaking to alignment, so I expect no different from the 992s. A bit disappointed that the opaques are also injection molded & so using the same barrel plugs as the demos, but that's just an aethetic nitpick.

Okay, I got it. Thanks for responding.

 

- Anthony

[Moonshae]

I picked "Other" for the second and third choices because I had no concept of what these pens would be like. I suggest rejiggering the poll so that the same pens are listed for each set of choices, just request that people not choose the same pen for more than one level.

[Maurizio]

I like your suggestion Moonshae and changed the poll.

 

Poll responders:

 

I changed the poll after some people had already responded. That flaw was my fault.

 

Please don't choose the same pen in more than one choice level.

If you're interested in changing your vote, you can delete it and re-vote.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

Thanks.

Edited April 23, 2017 by Maurizio

[Wolverine1]

Maurizio- I respect what you are trying to do, but, I just cant bring myself to buy any Chinese made pens. Sorry.

[Maurizio]

Woverine1. I respect your opinion too. Thanks for your post.

 

I'm not trying to talk anyone into liking Chinese pens if they don't already. It just seems to me that with all the interest on the sub forum, all the folks here who buy Chinese pens, and the fact that mainstream sellers such as Goulet Pens are now selling the Jinhao 159 among other pens, it's time we allowed Chinese pens "at the table" so to speak and think of them the way we think of any other pen brands, especially if we can convince some Chinese makers to choose a pen or two to improve for the market.

 

Thanks for reading.

[FOUR X FOUR]

this is my first Chinese pen. I bought 6 of them because they were around 5 or 6 dollars a piece. I'll use them with my Noodlers ink. This is the Jinhao x750. In all honesty I can't find anything bad about this pen. Also, if it had a gold nib I'd buy it and pay the extra cost

[Maurizio]

Personally, I would love to see a better quality 159, 992, &/or Hero 565.

 

More specifically, one piece barrels ala Lingmo on the non-demo 992s, although one might ask why you don't just buy a Lingmo at that point. Different material options perhaps.

 

For the 565, a better filling system & cap clutch ala 51 mk1 aero.

 

Across the board. better qc on nib alignment, but I'd say the same of all pens. For Jinhaos that use nib unit collars, make use of those threads. A friction fit threaded nib unit is nonsensical & you would avoid the units popping out as they sometimes do now.

 

edit: Now, to be fair though, my only real complaint about the 159 is the folded clip & perhaps only being available in laquered brass. Nib materials aside, I'm not sure what I else I would do to improve it.

I would try to convince them to redesign the garish oversized clip shield, which to my mind reduces the proper profile of the clip, so that the design fits within the dimensions of a regular sized clip. Edited April 23, 2017 by Maurizio

[Maurizio]

image.jpg this is my first Chinese pen. I bought 6 of them because they were around 5 or 6 dollars a piece. I'll use them with my Noodlers ink. This is the Jinhao x750. In all honesty I can't find anything bad about this pen. Also, if it had a gold nib I'd buy it and pay the extra cost

My 2nd x750 which I got about 5 days ago writes really well, in sharp contrast to my first one. It's a pretty darn good pen for a crazy low price.

Edited April 23, 2017 by Maurizio

[Moonshae]

I would try to convince them to redesign the garish oversized clip shield which to my mind reduces the proper profile of the clip so that the the design fits within the dimensions of a regular sized clip.

 

The 159 is a $3.50 pen, and your biggest criticism is about the clip? That's a cosmetic complaint, not a performance issue. Sounds like they've managed to do an amazing job.

[bokchoy]

To many Chinese consumers, "quality" means NOT made in China and especially not by a Chinese brand. That was my experience when dealing with Chinese tourists. I think they had a lower opinion of Chinese goods than North Americans haha. Hopefully manufacturers are willing to combat this stigma. I'm sure they're capable of making quality goods, I'm just not sure they're willing to if there's little demand/profit.

 

The classic Hero 100 would be much better with an airtight cap. I don't care if the clip is spring-loaded, an airtight cap on a hard-to-flush pen is far more important. Wider nib sizes would be nice for the international market too.

 

Unfortunately, I own none of the pens on the list.

[pajaro]

My wife gave me a Jinhao X450. I changed the nib for a nib from Goulet. I think it works, but the cap doesn't post. Because my wife gave it to me, I might use it. That's the only reason. It's kind of heavy and awkward, holding the cap in my hand.

 

The Kaigelu 356 I thought was OK, but both samples fell apart. Sections are a mess.

 

I don't need any more pens, and so I am not inspired by my experience with these to try any similar pens. The pens are handsome. I have them in a pen tray.

[Tresconik]

I voted for the Hero 616 as my first choice.

If they could make it a cartridge system it would be an everyday carry pen for me.

[DarkAudit]

If Goulet hadn't been doing a BOGO deal on Jinhaos last weekend, I wouldn't have even considered one and would have just ordered the TWSBI like I planned. But upon reading/watching various reviews and learning that I wasn't chained to the medium nib it shipped with, I decided to give them a shot. Ordered a 159 with the X750 as the freebie. And I'm glad I did.

 

The 159 is an absolute monster. Nice to write with, and certainly makes an impression when someone else catches a look at it. But the X750 is the breakout star. Nice size and shape, and more comfortable to me than the 159. I've ordered a second X750 off of eBay for $2.79US shipped. It'll be interesting to see what how that one compares to the ones the US sellers have on hand.

 

If that one's also a winner, I may get a third to be my designated Baystate Blue pen.

[mitto]

I would buy none. Period.

Edited April 23, 2017 by mitto