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Being To Picky For A First Pen?


Koopa_Khan

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YEE HAW! That's your way out. Best of luck.

 

(And BTW, don't shoot for an expensive pen sooo quickly. You'll need to learn pen basics and writing skills with inexpensive pens first. IE: Writing angle, writing pressure, how to take care of a FP, cleaning procedures, good inks, garbage inks, nit picky things that I probably subconsciously do to keep my pens from getting lost, etc. I personally do not own a 14k nibbed pen yet - thinking of a Lamy 200... Or a P 51, or a Sheaffer Snorkel.)

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YEE HAW! That's your way out. Best of luck.

 

(And BTW, don't shoot for an expensive pen sooo quickly. You'll need to learn pen basics and writing skills with inexpensive pens first. IE: Writing angle, writing pressure, how to take care of a FP, cleaning procedures, good inks, garbage inks, nit picky things that I probably subconsciously do to keep my pens from getting lost, etc. I personally do not own a 14k nibbed pen yet - thinking of a Lamy 200... Or a P 51, or a Sheaffer Snorkel.)

 

The last two are to my interest :) The Parker 51 and Sheaffer Snorkel, with more bias towards the Snorkel :P

 

I agree. Go nice and slow. I started with a Lamy Safari using Cartridges. I carried that pen with me everywhere everyday in my pocket until the plastic on the pen is literally all scratched and dented. 6 months after I first purchased the pen, I went and bought a Waterman Perspective, a Kaweco AC Sport, a Platinum #3776 with 14k Music Nib, and a Parker Sonnet. Although I don't specifically regret this purchase (all in one go), I did regret that I was overeager in purchasing and diving into Fountain Pens. Reason being, today, my pen case consists of 5 pens, of which none of the aforementioned above are in the pen case. So it's a little sad.

 

So yeah, take it nice and slow :)

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You don't have to learn the basics with a cheap pen. A better pen is more pleasant to use, making success more likely. If I had started with a Jinhao or something similar recommended by the martinets here, I would be using ballpoints and soft tip pens exclusively. You needn't go expensive, just whatever you think you want to use.

"Don't hurry, don't worry. It's better to be late at the Golden Gate than to arrive in Hell on time."
--Sign in a bar and grill, Ormond Beach, Florida, 1960.

 

 

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...If I had started with a Jinhao or something similar recommended by the martinets here, I would be using ballpoints and soft tip pens exclusively...

:lol:

 

- Anthony

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Hi. Glad you are enjoying pens. I would start with something medium priced so you will have a good experience. A chrome Waterman Hemisphere would make a nice safe entry pen. A fine nib is good as a medium may be too wet. Regards, Ron

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You defiantly have to modify your grip.....as much as I don't like classic tripod that is where you have to start.

A fountain pen is held behind the big index knuckle at 45 degrees or at the start of the web of the thumb at 40 degrees.

Holding a fountain pen like a ball point will cause scratchy. Can cause the tip to become misaligned.

If you insist on holding it like a ball point....you need a big round fat tip....Pelikan 400/600. I don't know other pens in modern to tell you other brands with such ball point user's tips.

 

Holding it like a ball point pen, will carve little grand canyons in the paper...and it won't lay as much ink as holding it like a fountain pen. Scratchy.....

Holding a fountain pen right, puts a small puddle of ink under the nib to glide on. You can write much longer before your hand tires from holding on for dear life and trying to plow the south 40 with out the mule.

A fountain pen is held as lightly as a baby featherless bird......not like a ball point where one is forced to make baby bird paste just to get it to move.

 

Do look up tripod grip, or classic tripod grip.

 

You want a nail nib so you don't bend it...to start. A steel nail is much better than a gold nail....you can buy better paper and inks with the money saved. You will be Ham Fisted...... :unsure: you are a ball point user....it's a given.

It can be cured..... :P I came back to fountain pens after decades of writing with out the mule, and was heavy handed....

 

Do not even think about superflex nibs, until you have a light Hand...and work your way up the flex ladder.

Edited by Bo Bo Olson

In reference to P. T. Barnum; to advise for free is foolish, ........busybodies are ill liked by both factions.

 

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

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I happened to have a G2 laying around here at the house. So I checked size and heft with some of the pens I have.... Some that would be good in that regard include the following:

 

Parker 45

Parker 51 or 51 Special

Pelikan 120 Merz & Krell

Esterbrook J and LJ

Jinhao 599 (my problem with many Jinhao pens is they use a brass tube for the body of the pen. This adds a lot of unnecessary weight. So if you want something similar weight wise to a G2 avoid the brass barrel pens)

 

Granted the only one of these that can be had new with is the Jinhao, as the others are no longer being manufactured. That being said, multiple filling systems are represented here too. Cartridge/converter (P45, 599), P51 (aerometric), Pelikan 120 M&K (piston), lever (Esterbrook) (although I didn't plan it that way)

 

There are other options of course but those are more expensive too. (Pelikan M200 or M205 for example) Most of the above are more budget friendly if that is a consideration. I paid from around $10-15 at the low end to around $50 (P51 Special) for these.

Brad

"Words are, of course, the most powerful drug used by mankind" - Rudyard Kipling
"None of us can have as many virtues as the fountain-pen, or half its cussedness; but we can try." - Mark Twain

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I happened to have a G2 laying around here....

AH-HAH!! Now vee know! After him, boys! And don't let 'em get away! :rolleyes:

 

- Anthony :)

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I happened to have a G2 laying around here at the house. So I checked size and heft with some of the pens I have.... Some that would be good in that regard include the following:

 

Parker 45

Parker 51 or 51 Special

Pelikan 120 Merz & Krell

Esterbrook J and LJ

Jinhao 599 (my problem with many Jinhao pens is they use a brass tube for the body of the pen. This adds a lot of unnecessary weight. So if you want something similar weight wise to a G2 avoid the brass barrel pens)

 

Granted the only one of these that can be had new with is the Jinhao, as the others are no longer being manufactured. That being said, multiple filling systems are represented here too. Cartridge/converter (P45, 599), P51 (aerometric), Pelikan 120 M&K (piston), lever (Esterbrook) (although I didn't plan it that way)

 

There are other options of course but those are more expensive too. (Pelikan M200 or M205 for example) Most of the above are more budget friendly if that is a consideration. I paid from around $10-15 at the low end to around $50 (P51 Special) for these.

Hi Runnin Ute,

 

Seriously though, RU, I don't think you have to be this restrictive. :)

 

There are a lot of good pens being made today that I think the OP could easily adjust to. The Lamy Logo or CP-1 both have the traditional pen/pencil size, etc. He could also consider the FC Loom, the Jinhao 992, etc.

 

It's a shame KK doesn't like the Safari's grip... I think it would be perfect for him... in fact, that pen was specifically designed to teach (kids) how to use and handle a fp.

 

- Anthony

Edited by ParkerDuofold
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Anthony -

 

I don't disagree. I saw a lot of heavy pens being suggested, so I thought I would throw out some suggestions that were similar size wise. Any of which could be a good first pen. Like the Safari the Pelikan 120 was a student pen.

(My first was an Al Star)

 

For the right person any pen I own could be a good first pen. Some people like heavy, the op did mention he liked the size of a g2.....

Brad

"Words are, of course, the most powerful drug used by mankind" - Rudyard Kipling
"None of us can have as many virtues as the fountain-pen, or half its cussedness; but we can try." - Mark Twain

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Post Deleted. Thanks for giving me some common sense, Pajaro.

Edited by AL01
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True... But I started using FPs when I was a careless kid who could care less about writing. I am quite happy that I started with a Varsity. Their QC is better than Chinese QC, they are cheap, and they let the user experiment and see whether they truely want a FP or not. I knew someone who wanted to buy a Cross FP from a Staples but I told 'em to buy a Varsity instead. Simply put, if he bought the Cross, the 50$ would have gone down the drain.

 

So it goes. As I suspected, all the opinions here are monolithic, and everyone is to be required to do the same regimented program, because everyone must be assumed to be just like whoever opines.

 

// EXEC

// END RUN

"Don't hurry, don't worry. It's better to be late at the Golden Gate than to arrive in Hell on time."
--Sign in a bar and grill, Ormond Beach, Florida, 1960.

 

 

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I haven't used a G2, so I don't know much about the in hand feel, but I can tell you not to choose a vintage pen.
Once you have more experience you can really enjoy the old pens, when the purpose of pens was to write.

 

I say stick with the tried and tested modern starter pens. The Lamy Safari will teach you how to hold a pen correctly, the Pilot Metropolitan will take a lot of abuse, the Sailor and Pilot starter pens (I think it's the Varsity) if you want to experience a good quality nib at a low price and see if fountain pens are for you.

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Anthony -

 

I don't disagree. I saw a lot of heavy pens being suggested, so I thought I would throw out some suggestions that were similar size wise. Any of which could be a good first pen. Like the Safari the Pelikan 120 was a student pen.

(My first was an Al Star)

 

For the right person any pen I own could be a good first pen. Some people like heavy, the op did mention he liked the size of a g2.....

I got you. ;)

 

- Anthony

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Get yourself a good old P45 with gold nib or perhaps a P51. You may get the 45 for $20-30. The 51 aero may cost you a little more. Say $50-70.

Khan M. Ilyas

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So it goes. As I suspected, all the opinions here are monolithic, and everyone is to be required to do the same regimented program, because everyone must be assumed to be just like whoever opines.

 

// EXEC

// END RUN

 

AH! You got me. Your 200% true. Posts gone. Thanks for drilling some sense into me head.

Edited by AL01
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That is the same grip as the one I use and I have no issues with a Safari.

 

Still, get a Pilot Varsity for a starter.

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I've been looking at purchasing my first pen, but I haven't found something I like yet. Right now I'm using the Pilot G2 and love everything about it.

 

Is there a fountain pen with the same feel (weight and length)? So far I've been stuck on the Pilot vanishing point,

 

but I don't know if I want to spend that much yet. Am I being way to picky? The Lamy Safari I would like minus that triangular grip.

 

If you KNOW what you want, so much the better for you. That will help avoid a pen that you may not like.


There are several variables in buying a new pen. Some may be critical, some important, some nice, and some not of interest. YOU have to determine if any of these variables are of interest to you and how important it is. Some of these variables are: weight of body, weight of cap, balance point unposted, balance point posted, diameter of section, diameter of body, is the cap postable, where on the pen do you put your fingers, material of the pen, material and finish of the grip, color, PRICE, etc.


  • Example1. for me weight is CRITICAL. If the pen is over 32 grams posted, I then look at the weight unposted. If the unposted weight is more than 20 grams, I reject the pen as TOO HEAVY. My prefered weight is about 15 grams, which happens to be the weight of MANY vintage pens.
  • Example2, for me size is IMPORTANT. If the diameter of the body of the pen is over 13mm, I reject the pen as TOO FAT. In the 12-13mm range, it depends on how the pen feels in my hand. The Lamy 2000 is too FAT for my hand.
  • Example3, I generally post the pen, but I will also use the pen unposted. If the balance point of the pen when posted, it too far to the end, I will test the pen unposted, to determine if the balance point is acceptable. I use ALL my Lamy pens (Safari, Vista, cp1, pur) unposted, because the pens become too tail heavy when posted.
  • Example4. If your fingers are oily or sweaty you may not like a smooth plastic or polished metal grip, as your fingers not be able to get a decent grip on the pen, and will slip down the pen.

Places like Goulet pens have the specs on their pens, so you can determine if the pen is too heavy or too fat or too skiny for your hand.

From the Goulet web site, I determined that the Lamy Studio was too heavy for me (31 grams posted, 22 grams unposted).


So in your case, the Pilot Vanishing Point at 30 grams, is MUCH heavier than the G2.

In fact, to me, the VP is so heavy that I have no interest in buying that pen. It is 50% higher than my upper limit of 20 grams.

So if you want a similar weight to a G2, FORGET the VP, and most any all metal pen.

 

You will likely have to change your grip, as you hold the G2 very near the tip. On many fountain pens, your finger would be on the nib. For a fountain pen, you have to hold the pen a bit farther back. Many fountain pens have a flared grip section just behind the nib for people that hold close, but some like the Lamy 2000 do not. For some of us, we hold the pen much further back, that we grip the pen on the barrel.

San Francisco Pen Show - August 28-30, 2020 - Redwood City, California

www.SFPenShow.com

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Thanks for the feedback guys! I'm picking up a Varsity tonight to try out for sure. Tomorrow the store I mentioned early is open so I'm going to swing by. I feel like I need to see some of these in person before I buy. I like the look of the P45 and 51, hopefully they have a couple.

 

Edit: I just looked at the snorkel and I have to try one.

Edited by Koopa_Khan
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