Jump to content

Comparing Sailor And Pilot Flat Top Pens.


jar

Recommended Posts

In the past I've posted about the Pilot, Sailor and Platinum "Balance" style pens but for this series I'd like to concentrate on the Flat Top ones. Platinum does not offer a similar selection under their branding so for this it will be just Sailor and Pilot. I will begin with the larger ones first.

The Sailor series starts with the King of Pen Pro Gear while from Pilot I will look at the Custom (why is it not a Custom Heritage model) 845. Both will be black with gold furniture.

http://www.fototime.com/E6A03459940A211/medium800.jpg

First the BORING DETAILS.

http://www.fototime.com/3B85E1AC8822A52/large.jpg

 

In the past I have reviewed a Pilot Custom 845 in Vermilion and found it a difficult and confusing pen. I really wanted to like it but found it was one of the few pens I simply could not enjoy so sold it. That one had a BB nib so I ordered a Medium nib black version and this one I found far more pleasant, yet still a difficult and confusing pen. It's really close to being a great pen but still falls short when compared to other somewhat similar pens I own.

The Urushi on this versions has greater depth than the vermilion urushi but still nowhere near the depth found on a Platinum Izumo or Nakaya. This example is still moderately wet but no where near the gusher of the vermilion and the medium nib is smooth, controllable and responsive. But while there were no discernible seams on the section of the vermilion whether checked with a loupe or by feel, this one definitely has seams and they are prominent enough to catch with a fingernail. I have a 743 that uses the same section but as with the vermilion the 743 has no discernible seams on the section.

If this is supposed to be the best pen marketed under the Pilot brand why can they not deliver one where you do not see or feel the seams on the section?

As with the Sailor King of Pen Pro Gear this is a cartridge/converter and uses Pilot's proprietary versions.

http://www.fototime.com/3180CB9D9066BB5/medium800.jpg

 

The Sailor King of Pen Pro Gear being reviewed is the basic resin/plastic model. It is slightly shorter than the Pilot Custom 845 when capped, unposted or posted but also considerably wider.

http://www.fototime.com/BE13DD0966E6252/medium800.jpg

 

Like the Pilot Custom 845 the KoP Pro Gear is a cartridge/converter pen and uses Sailor's proprietary versions.

http://www.fototime.com/92D5025B00AE2E0/medium800.jpg

 

Notice how much more metal there is compared to the inside of the Pilot Custom 845.

BUT... it is precisely that extra metal that makes this pen one of the absolute finest pens I own. That extra metal sits forward of where the pen body sits on the webbing between my thumb and hand when writing. That gives the pen a slight forward bias in balance. Yet The cap weighs 12.8g while the section with a cartridge inserted weighs 12.6g. That means when used posted the balance point falls exactly at the webbing between thumb and hand and the pen feels weightless. The only pens I can think of that balance so well are the Sheaffer pens built on the PFM/Legacy model, Montegrappa Classicas, Aurora Hastil and the ST Dupont Orpheo/Olympios.

http://www.fototime.com/8D9A460C6AB6B92/large.jpg

 

The pen also fits perfectly in my shirt pockets and has perhaps the best, most pocket friendly clip I've ever found. Unfortunately the Pilot Custom 845 uses the ball end Custom clip that is among the most pocket unfriendly clips I've found but more on the when we move on to the other sizes.

In summary; I can find absolutely nothing I'd change on the Sailor King of Pen Pro Gear and the Pilot Custom 845 once again while there is absolutely nothing truly bad about the 845 it is even more disappointing that they did not take the few extra steps that would have made it a GREAT pen.

Edited by jar

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 24
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • jar

    11

  • Cryptos

    4

  • cattar

    2

  • ekfritz

    2

Top Posters In This Topic

Interesting post. I always thought the KOP pro gear would be a bit to wide to be comfortable, but I am still considering it since it's such a gorgeous pen.

 

Could it be mounted with a Naginata Togi?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting post. I always thought the KOP pro gear would be a bit to wide to be comfortable, but I am still considering it since it's such a gorgeous pen.

 

Could it be mounted with a Naginata Togi?

Maybe if Sailor starts offering the specialty nibs again.

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Having once owned the KOP, I agree with your point on the inner metal bit. It makes the KOP a step above the 1911L in my opinion. I definitely wish Sailor would bring back the piston on the KOP for a regular line. I wasn't so hot on using either converter or cartridge for the KOP - I dislike the cartridges more for refilling/reusing. And I also found difficulty in refilling the converter using Sailor's own ink bottles!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Great post, Jar! I am really looking forward to the next installment, and I am interested to see what your third one will be as well. Pro Gear Slim vs. Custom Heritage 91? Pro Gear Slim vs Stargazer/Stella 90S? I guess we'll have to stay tuned to find out :-)

 

Thanks again!

 

Best,

Chad

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Great post, Jar! I am really looking forward to the next installment, and I am interested to see what your third one will be as well. Pro Gear Slim vs. Custom Heritage 91? Pro Gear Slim vs Stargazer/Stella 90S? I guess we'll have to stay tuned to find out :-)

 

Thanks again!

 

Best,

Chad

PG Slim and 91.

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As threatened, the next pair to be compared are the Pilot Custom Heritage 912 and the Sailor Pro Gear. Like the first pair, here the Pilot pen is longer, lighter but also skinnier.

With that introductory remark; here are the Boring Details:

http://www.fototime.com/4B7D39639F6A583/xlarge.jpg

And the two pens:

http://www.fototime.com/AF2E20375998D28/medium800.jpg

The width difference is not as great as it is between the Pilot Custom 845 and the Sailor Pro Gear King of Pen but is still really noticeable in hand. The section on the Pilot Custom Heritage 912 measures 11.4mm at its widest and 10.75mm near the nib. The Sailor Pro Gear though measures 11.48mm near the threads and 10.95mm down near the nib. As I said, a small difference but enough to make a big difference in how the two pens feel in my hand. The section on the Pilot Custom Heritage 912 is longer than on the Sailor Pro Gear and for many that might be a bigger influence than section width.

http://www.fototime.com/17BB1071BA59E60/medium800.jpg

Both pens balance well, both use proprietary cartridge/converter standards, both are moderately wet with the Pilot once again being slightly wetter than the Sailor. Both are long enough to use when not posted, post securely if desired and are balanced either way.

http://www.fototime.com/1491705B86A220F/medium800.jpg

This example of a Pilot 912 has a factory stub nib and frankly it falls very short when compared to factory stub nibs from other makers. It is okay but I would rate it as the least pleasant of all my factory stub nibs. The Sailor has a medium nib and it is typical Sailor, moderately wet and very smooth but with pleasant feedback.

 

The next epistle will look at the Pilot Custom Heritage 91 and the Sailor Pro Gear Slim.

Edited by jar

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That's a significant difference in length. I have a 912, and yes I can just about use it un-posted (I rarely do though). The Sailor would be uncomfortable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That's a significant difference in length. I have a 912, and yes I can just about use it un-posted (I rarely do though). The Sailor would be uncomfortable.

Okay.

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hmm. I'm actually looking into Platinum Izumo at the moment. Was considering the Tagayasan, but your comment about the depth of the urushi being about equal with Nakaya pens has me wondering now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hmm. I'm actually looking into Platinum Izumo at the moment. Was considering the Tagayasan, but your comment about the depth of the urushi being about equal with Nakaya pens has me wondering now.

Totally lost me there.

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Now for the smallest pair, the Pilot Custom 91 and the Sailor Pro Gear Slim. As usual. let's begin with the Boring Details:

http://www.fototime.com/3D85179619C3AFA/large.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/A03E8FDA8019727/medium800.jpg



Many things are still the same, the Sailor is still shorter than the Pilot and the Pilot nib is wetter than the sailor but there are also differences. In this pair the Sailor is also lighter and the section is a hair skinnier than on the Pilot. The Pilot varies from 10.8mm near the threads to 9.95mm near the nib while the Sailor varies from 10.5mm near the threads to 9.8mm near the nib.

http://www.fototime.com/58D8C6A87C6979C/medium800.jpg



Again, the section on the Pilot is slightly longer than on the Sailor and for some that may be important.

The Pilot is long enough to use without posting but the Sailor really does feel best posted.

http://www.fototime.com/E97FD38DC23AEDF/medium800.jpg



Both have always been utterly reliable, smooth, forgiving and both are definitely shirt pocket friendly. Of the two the sailor gets the most pocket time but that's because it's PURPLE!!!

Edited by jar

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Enjoyed this side/side thread of the flat tops. The pics, the boring bits, the commentary.

I first saw a Sailor pen in late 2014.
It was a year before I saw another one and had the opportunity to write with it. Meanwhile, people told me Sailor nibs were difficult, Pilot had friendlier nibs, and even Platinum nibs were more usable.

What I found is - Sailor is a great pen if you have a light and steady hand and like finer nibs.
Platinum pens and nibs are good. And Pilot pens and nibs are mostly meh, for me.

The first Sailor I wrote with was the ProGear with an MF nib. Until then, Nakaya had been my dream pen.
I also enjoy the ProGear Slim/Sapporo with that curve to the barrel and those lovely Sailor nibs.
The kingsize pens across brands are beautiful but too large, and often too heavy, for my hand. And I write with my pens unposted.

In Pilot, I like the resin Falcon, a flattop, and I'm considering a pen with a PO nib.
I was surprised the CH91 is a bit wider in the section than the ProGear Slim. The curve of the ProGear Slim makes that pen more comfortable to my hand.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Enjoyed this side/side thread of the flat tops. The pics, the boring bits, the commentary.

 

I first saw a Sailor pen in late 2014.

It was a year before I saw another one and had the opportunity to write with it. Meanwhile, people told me Sailor nibs were difficult, Pilot had friendlier nibs, and even Platinum nibs were more usable.

 

What I found is - Sailor is a great pen if you have a light and steady hand and like finer nibs.

Platinum pens and nibs are good. And Pilot pens and nibs are mostly meh, for me.

 

The first Sailor I wrote with was the ProGear with an MF nib. Until then, Nakaya had been my dream pen.

I also enjoy the ProGear Slim/Sapporo with that curve to the barrel and those lovely Sailor nibs.

The kingsize pens across brands are beautiful but too large, and often too heavy, for my hand. And I write with my pens unposted.

 

In Pilot, I like the resin Falcon, a flattop, and I'm considering a pen with a PO nib.

I was surprised the CH91 is a bit wider in the section than the ProGear Slim. The curve of the ProGear Slim makes that pen more comfortable to my hand.

Thanks. I'm glad you enjoyed it. Frankly I always knew that the section of my Sailor Pr Gear Slim was wider than on my Pilot 91. My hand and my Mark1 eyeballs told me I was right. But like the song says, it 'taint necessarily so.

 

I know the section on my 1911S is wider than the section on my Pilot 74. My hand and my Mark1 eyeballs tell me I'm right. But should I test it?

 

 

 

 

 

Nah, my eyeballs are happy.

Edited by jar

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lol. Yes, the pen fits.
And there's something right about a Sailor nib too.

I wrote with Waterman and vintage pens for decades.
Now it's primarily Sailor.
And a few other pens, modern and vintage. I haven't let go of my Sheaffer touchdowns.

As you go through your collection, it's interesting to see how the pens compare.
.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As you go through your collection, it's interesting to see how the pens compare.

.

I'm at the downsizing stage and it's been interesting. So far there haven't been many pens I let go that I seriously wish I had held on to and it has included many that over the years I really enjoyed. Almost all the Pelikans and Montblancs and Omas and a few of the Montegrappas and Conway Stewarts and even a few ST Duponts have gone walkabout and seem happy at their new digs.

 

Only a few of the Pilots and sailors have left home; the faceted Vanishing points and a few Maki-e and a Pilot Custom 845 all started new lives elsewhere. A few Parker and Sheaffer pens also left home but they went to folk just starting the fountain pen journey and they went because I knew they were near perfect introductory pens.

Edited by jar

 

My Website

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I really love these comparisons. I have all of these Pilots, and I keep thinking I'll get more Sailors (I've only got a 1911L at the moment). This is really useful, and more than a little enabling!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Most Contributions

    1. amberleadavis
      amberleadavis
      43844
    2. PAKMAN
      PAKMAN
      33501
    3. Ghost Plane
      Ghost Plane
      28220
    4. inkstainedruth
      inkstainedruth
      26627
    5. jar
      jar
      26101
  • Upcoming Events

  • Blog Comments

    • Shanghai Knife Dude
      I have the Sailor Naginata and some fancy blade nibs coming after 2022 by a number of new workshop from China.  With all my respect, IMHO, they are all (bleep) in doing chinese characters.  Go use a bush, or at least a bush pen. 
    • A Smug Dill
      It is the reason why I'm so keen on the idea of a personal library — of pens, nibs, inks, paper products, etc. — and spent so much money, as well as time and effort, to “build” it for myself (because I can't simply remember everything, especially as I'm getting older fast) and my wife, so that we can “know”; and, instead of just disposing of what displeased us, or even just not good enough to be “given the time of day” against competition from >500 other pens and >500 other inks for our at
    • adamselene
      Agreed.  And I think it’s good to be aware of this early on and think about at the point of buying rather than rationalizing a purchase..
    • A Smug Dill
      Alas, one cannot know “good” without some idea of “bad” against which to contrast; and, as one of my former bosses (back when I was in my twenties) used to say, “on the scale of good to bad…”, it's a spectrum, not a dichotomy. Whereas subjectively acceptable (or tolerable) and unacceptable may well be a dichotomy to someone, and finding whether the threshold or cusp between them lies takes experiencing many degrees of less-than-ideal, especially if the decision is somehow influenced by factors o
    • adamselene
      I got my first real fountain pen on my 60th birthday and many hundreds of pens later I’ve often thought of what I should’ve known in the beginning. I have many pens, the majority of which have some objectionable feature. If they are too delicate, or can’t be posted, or they are too precious to face losing , still they are users, but only in very limited environments..  I have a big disliking for pens that have the cap jump into the air and fly off. I object to Pens that dry out, or leave blobs o
  • Chatbox

    You don't have permission to chat.
    Load More
  • Files






×
×
  • Create New...