Unnamed Pen & Pencil Identification

[geob10]

Hi, i recently bought this interesting set from a sale, the owner said they thought it was from the 1950's

 

according to the instructions the title is - the propelling pencil & stud filling fountain pen, but the only writing on the pen and pencil is 'made in England' has anyone any idea who made this?

 

I know very little about fountain pens and am not a collector but just saw it and rather liked it

 

attached are some photos, the small barrel still has the led in which is really nice

kind regards

 

George

 

 

 

[northlodge]

your hiding all the best clues!

 

providing a shot of the nib and of the clip may help. At the moment I think Lang (Curzon / Summit) is odd-on favourite. Unique for a each-way shot

 

Also, I would suggest earlier than the 1950's

Edited December 16, 2016 by northlodge

[peterg]

Looks like a Mentmore from the 1930/ 40's. They are very similar to the Lang's and Unique's, and Unique used that box, but the section and clip profile say Mentmore to me.

[emerson]

+1 on the Mentmore hunch.

[geob10]

thanks for your replies, and sorry for the photos, thats my lack of knowledge, I cant seem to find how to post photos in this reply but there is some writing on the nib - 'warrented ' and then definetly numbers '14' followed by what looks to be '9z' but im not sure. and 1930's - 40's wow! does age mean value? I'm hoping I got a bargain!

[jar]

Well 30s & 40s pens aren't all that unusual. A good picture of the writing on the nib as well the clip and what ever is under the blind cap at the end of the pen sure will help.

[peterg]

Try the 'More Reply Options' button if you have it yet. It allows you to browse and attach picture files (you might need to copy and reduce the quality to make the file small enough to upload).

 

Mentmores aren't particularly collectable and the set is in black. On the other hand they are in good condition with a box. As a rough guide I would say about £35.

 

9z is Ct for the 14 carat gold nib.

 

You bought them for the right reason. It will give you a lot more pleasure than investment value. Has it been resaced?

[geob10]

thanks I have found the more reply button so here are a few more pics, but I don't think they will help much as the quality is poor, and you all seem to have nearly solved the mystery, I would have never have known what 9z was so thanks again. peter g what was your last question?

 

 

[emerson]

Yes, I'd set about resaccing that one, and putting it to good use. It's a charming set.

[peterg]

The clip says Mentmore, but, as you say, the nib is too indistinct. I would say 80% certain it's Mentmore.

[geob10]

sorry for the really stupid question but what is resaccing?

[peterg]

The ink is held in a rubber sac(k) that is stuck to a nozzle on the end of the section (what you hold and into which the feed and nib, on top, are pushed).

The sac is compressed by a bar which bows out when pressed by the button. When the button is released the sac reforms and sucks up the ink.

Rubber ages and either goes soft and won't reform or hard and brittle. Either way it needs to be replaced (resaced)

[PaulS]

I've just looked at something approaching 40 Mentmore f.ps., but seems I don't have that design of clip - and George's comment was "but the only writing on the pen and pencil is 'made in England' has anyone any idea who made this?".

Going simply on probability, and bearing in mind the vast majority of Mentmore's carry the maker's name, then does that not suggest this one is probably not Mentmore?

[peterg]

I'm surprised you haven't seen that clip Paul, it's quite common.

When describing it as Mentmore I mean made by the Mentmore Manufacturing Company, not a 'Mentmore' pen as such.

I tend to describe their gold nibbed pens as Mentmore's and steel nibbed pens as Platignum's regardless of the numerous brands they traded under, or the large number of pens (usually unmarked) made for third parties.

As to marking their pens, I have yet to see one of their Visi-Ink pens that has a manufacturer's mark. I would also suggest that most of the unmarked 'quality' pens, such as George's and the numerous pens of the same 'Duofoldesque' design with steel nibs were made by Mentmore.

[PaulS]

well, obviously forty Mentmore's is too small a sampling quantity for a meaningful result - I suspect you have a lot more than I do. I did wonder if you had spotted something I hadn't, and there was in fact a maker's name on the pen somewhere. I agree that the clip is not too dissimilar from some of the Mentmore/Platignum designs (especially the latter).

 

I have two 'Ink-Lock' pens, both of which carry the name Mentmore, and four rather gaudy 'Visi-Ink' stamped examples, all of which carry the name Platignum ...... but, I don't have an example of a 'Visi-Ink' pen with a Mentmore imprint - or at least of sufficiently high quality to suggest Mentmore rather than Platignum.

 

Of course I would agree that the difference in quality/nib type is usually a give away in telling the difference between Mentmore and Platignum - dare say in fact that without picking them up you would be able to guess correctly which 'brand' each one was, without even picking them up.

The very gaudy versus the more tasteful

Edited December 20, 2016 by PaulS

[peterg]

I don't have a lot of Mentmore's, Paul, I try to draw the line somewhere! I agree the clips are mostly on Platignums. Had a very brief look and found one Mentmore Ink Lock with that clip. On the Visi Inks I found three, one Platignum, one Made in England and other completely blank. Both the latter have typical Mentmore small nibs.

 

Mentmore were very much the BMC of the fountain pen world, taking the same basic design and using different standards of finish to distinguish them (come to think of it, Langs were probably as good at it!). They were also major players in the third party/ commemorative market.

 

Apart from the nib and metalwork I find most 1930's Platignums just as good as the Mentmore and, like the CS Scribe, were often produced in attractive (gaudy?) finishes.

[PaulS]

gaudy? - well, a bit OTT, brilliantly colourful, but whatever we call them now they were fashionable and no doubt considered great at the time.

To me they are showy to the point of looking cheap, but when I look at the quantity I have, there must be some love for them somewhere.

But mostly, with very few exceptions, I really can't get on with those steel nibs - they're scratchy and have a habit of digging in when I do a forward/up-stroke.

But we can't judge the past on today's standards - pointless exercise - everything is a product of its own time, but I'd rather have a Mentmore than a Platignum, at least for writing.

As you'll know Peter, a common downside to P's, is the noticeable shrinkage of the plastics, which I'm convinced doesn't occur so often with M., and which can make for a real bummer when it comes to trying to did-assemble the various parts.

 

All the pens in the attached two pix are Platignum. In the first picture the four on the right, as you will know are the Visi-Inks - three with a two part barrel and the blue ish looking job with a three part barrel, which makes for a more sophisticated pen, using as it does a button to compress the sac rather than your fingers as is the case with the two part barrel pens.

 

In the other picture are pens post 1950 (at least I think they are) - solid colours, and what on balance are probably improved nibs in general, although not so sure I like the lurid yellow and turquoise. Of these later pens I like the nib on the Statesman - looks to have been a design nicked from the Park VP - and the Pressmatic nibs are 14 ct. and o.k. usually. The Platigum '100' appears to have pinched it's nib from the Parker stable - I have a couple but haven't yet taken the plunge and tested their capillary system - but assume the nib would be a smooth writer.

Edited December 20, 2016 by PaulS

[geob10]

i wondered what that was! thanks Peter