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Should A Pelikan Fine Nib Be Free Of Any Scratchy Feeling During Writing?


vooblier

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Hi everyone. Today I purchased a new M215 fountain pen with Fine Nib. I do not have any prior experience with such a nib.

 

Do you think a Fine nib in M2xx series should be free of any scratchy feeling? Or is it normal that a fine nib has a little bit of scratchiness? I was expecting the nib to flow very smoothly. But in fact I sometimes have this strange scratchy feeling when writing (like as if you move a nail on paper). Not too much, but a little bit scratchy, especially when I make oval movements.

 

The reason I am asking this is that I want to understand whether it is normal, or whether I received a bad nib that needs adjustment. In fact, this scratchiness is not something you can easily measure, but I thought you pelikan users may have an idea. Thank you very much in advance for your help and comments.

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Feedback is certainly possible but there shouldn't be any scratchiness. Most of my Pelikan F nibs are smooth but some do have a little feedback.

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Uncial and Mulrich, thank you very much for your answers.

 

If you excuse me, may I ask what do you imply by "feedback"? Is it scratchiness? Sorry, I am not familiar with the jargon :)

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What is your prior experience with other fountain pens? My reason for asking is other nibs all have a bit of feedback. Think of it like a felt tip Sharpie. There will be no scratchyness due to the material of the tip, yet you will feel it on the paper. Where as scratchyness will react like the ovals you described where it feels like a nail. Now the direction this is occurring is important because it tells you where you need to focus on the nib tuning. Matt Armstrong (Pen Habit vids on YouTube), shows you how to adjust your nib or where to smooth it.

 

If this is your first fountain pen, it could be because of the pressure you are putting on the pen when you write.

The pen, is truly mightier than the sword!

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Take your pen and draw a straight line left to right; then do the same right to left. Can you feel a difference? Does one way feel scratchy? if so, you have a tine that is out of line (up or down too far). I suggest you go to http://www.richardspens.com/?page=ref/nibs/primer.htm He has all kinds of information on nibs. Also, did you buy the pen from a store? If so, maybe they can help you.

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Pelikan nibs are not supposed to be scratchy. First of all you should rule out user error: do you have experience writing with fountain pens? Do you write with a very light touch or do you press down like you were using a ballpoint?

 

Once user error is ruled out, there are other factors, mainly tines that are not properly aligned. To check for this you will need a good 10x loupe.

Edited by carlos.q
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The M2xx fine nibs can certainly have some feedback but should not be scratchy. I'd use a 10x loupe to look at the tines and make sure that they are aligned properly. That's usually the most common cause of what you describe. You should anticipate a smooth writing experience with a decent ink flow and mild feedback with a bit of springiness to it.

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Ditto to what everyone else has said. A little feedback should be expected, but it shouldn't feel scrathcy. The tines are probably out of alignment. This is easily corrected if you have a decent 10X loupe so that you can see the tip of the nib clearly. I recommend the BelOMO loupe. Great optical clarity and reasonably priced.

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy. Hamlet, 1.5.167-168

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Thank you very much for all your help.

 

This is not my first fountain pen, so I think user error should not be the case.

 

When I make a line from left to right or from right to left, it is equally scratchy. But the movement that most irritates me are oval movements. For example, when I scribble 888888888 (all connected to each other, to test the smoothness of the nib) I feel quite a bit of scratchiness.

 

Recently I was using a Waterman Hemisphere Medium Nib. This medium nib, for example, never make me irritated as if I move a nail on paper. But it was Medium, and this pelikan is Fine, so maybe it is just this difference in nib width that causes this problem.

 

Maybe my expectations were too high. In fact, my main intention in opening this topic was to understand whether it is normal for a Fine nib to feel a little bit scratchy.

 

I started to think this nib needs adjustment. Otherwise, it would not be a nice experience to use such a nib and so many people would not be a fan of pelikan m2xx series. I will see what I can do to fix this problem.

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Feedback means the noise you hear and the feeling when you write.

Western Fine nibs would generally give you a bit more feedback than medium nibs.

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The 200 nib is steel. I have received some Pels that had a little feedback or scratchiness when I first got them. I tiny bit of smoothing has cured them easily.

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The tines are out of alignment .

95% of scratchy is that or, and or holding the fountain pen before the big index knuckle like a ball point.

 

In I have had a 10X loupe from near the get go...in I was buying old cheap vintage pens...from Ebay with out an idea of if it would, be aligned or not,needed one....

 

With out a loupe I don't know how to tell you which is the up tine you need to press down from the breather hole....three or so seconds so it is under the low tine....do that Gently, 3-4 times.

 

If you had a 10-12X loupe you could tell if it's even or not. If not do a couple more times, until it tests smoother.

 

Someone else might help you find with is the up tine with out a loupe.

 

It is 'normal' first for new pens or even pens one has had a while to suffer a tiny knock and be out of alignment.

Many a poster here has had a brand new pen that got to him out of alignment...so the "normal".

 

I had then luck with my new 200 and used one from before 1990 and a like new used modern 215.

In I often buy old pens....I find it easy to align the nib....but the first time is a small sweat.

Gently.

Edited by Bo Bo Olson

In reference to P. T. Barnum; to advise for free is foolish, ........busybodies are ill liked by both factions.

 

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

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I want to thank you all for your helpful responses.

 

I am now quite convinced that the nib needs alignment. I will try to fix it as per your instructions. Again, thank you very much.

Edited by vooblier
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Just because one has had fountain pens before....means little if it is held like a ball point before the big index knuckle instead of behind it like a fountain pen.

 

When held behind the big knuckle, there is a small puddle of ink the pen floats in. No pressure is needed.

When held like a ball point...there is only ink wetting the furrow being plowed in the paper....and the heavy ball point pressure needed still.

 

Many to most fountain pen companies in the mid-late '90's went over to big fat thick tipped double ball nibs.....like the M400 with a ring or a 600....for folks that persist in their fountain pen like a ball point. Semi-nail so it's harder to bend....a harder ride.

Is often 'butter smooth'.....a good nib to stub or make CI. Otherwise boring.

 

The 200 is not such a nib....but made as it should be, as it was in semi-vintage days....@ 1/2 a width narrower, cleaner line....a 'true' regular flex, with the touch of spring such a nib should and once had....a better ride.

 

95% of scratchy is a misaligned tine and or holding like a ball point.

 

As I see it, Butter Smooth...can slide off slick paper....good for lousy paper...if narrow enough.

 

Good and smooth...the level under Butter Smooth....what I aim for when removing drag for old sat in the back of a drawer for a generation or two pens.

My two new 200/215 are M....and are between Butter and Good.....not the least bit scratchy....also a M....a most under appreciated nib....very good for shading inks. M being wider than F should be smoother. I would expect any new nib to be smooth enough.....not scratchy. EF is more problematic in it has so little tipping. F is wide enough that no problems should be expected.

 

Toothy is like writing with a pencil.

More than that is scratchy.

 

Good to better paper and wetter inks help. Pelikan is a wet writing nib, in Pelikan ink is dry.

Edited by Bo Bo Olson

In reference to P. T. Barnum; to advise for free is foolish, ........busybodies are ill liked by both factions.

 

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

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You are welcome.

I feel lucky having absorbed the knowledge of others to give some of it back.

 

...... :headsmack: Not that I'm always right mind you.....I'm still learning, too. :rolleyes:

In reference to P. T. Barnum; to advise for free is foolish, ........busybodies are ill liked by both factions.

 

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

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My old m400's nib progressively got grabbier and grabbier, not scratchy but it would sort of hang on to paper; since it happened gradually I didn't mind until I wrote with another of my (way cheaper) pens, the comparison was embarrassing... I remembered I had some fine micro mesh, did a few "8" figures and it is smooth again, you might want to try it.

"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt."

 

B. Russell

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Not figure 8's, which Ol'Griz (RIP) claimed could cause baby bottom. Circles left and right and 4 way squiggling while rotating the nib. 4-5 seconds on the smooth side.

:glare: Iridium rust can happen in even the best of families. It seems one must not abandon a pen in a dark dismal drawer for a generation or two for drag to happen.

 

 

I didn't think of my 200's had feedback :mellow: ....but if one is use to using the big fat blobby semi-nail modern butter smooth 400/600.....the normal springyness of 'true' regular flex with a narrower than 400/600's marking of a nib could leave one wondering is that feedback?....in it is not the butter smooth of the fat 400/600.

 

I'm a little wrong I guess....now that I think of it. I do have too few Butter Smooth nibs. :doh: So thinking at how smooth I like it....good and smooth, the stage under slick Butter Smooth, didn't realize it could also be I liked 'feedback'. Or that others would think that feedback.

 

I think of feed back....as more towards an Aurora, than the 'normal' semi-vintage 'pre 98 400 and the Celebry...'90's-early 2000's, (2, 1-gold, = 1-steel) and 38X/39X of that era. All three (4 pens total) nibs match my 200's, being 'true' springy clean lined, 1/2 a width narrower than the blobby modern semi-nail of the 400/600; which are 'butter smooth'....good to make a Stub or CI out of.

One of the reasons I became a 200's nib fan.

 

One man's toothy is another's scratchy. One man's feed back is another's normal good and smooth. One man's butter smooth...is all's butter smooth. :rolleyes:

 

The big fat blobby 1/2 over size semi-nail 400/600 wide tipped double ball/double kugal is butter smooth. It better be, it has nothing else to offer.

(The grapes are sour???? Well, I don't take out the roughening stone on the butter smooth nibs I have, but they are not the first pens I grab....even on regular paper...... :wallbash: :gaah: It turns out I like must feed back!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Life is a self discovery trip. :happyberet: )

Which is what I have when I use a 'laid' paper....and that is not quite my favorite paper. I have to be in the mood for it and have a wide nibbed pen on hand.

Hummm, laid paper and butter smooth nibs....sounds like a good match. :bunny01:

 

Boy, will the flat stub almost no 'iridium' of a '50-65 semi-flex nib be a shock! :huh: :o :yikes: There is feedback! :puddle:

Edited by Bo Bo Olson

In reference to P. T. Barnum; to advise for free is foolish, ........busybodies are ill liked by both factions.

 

 

The cheapest lessons are from those who learned expensive lessons. Ignorance is best for learning expensive lessons.

 

 

 

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  • 8 months later...

Hello all,

 

I'm new to the forum. I have been writing with the same Sheaffer Fashion II for the last 18 years (since the age of 14) and have recently got into pens again. Back then, it was affordable school parkers, but now I have a W. Germany Pelikan M250 and also a Porsche Design TecFlex Gold/Silver Rollerball.

 

I have a question about the Pelikan M250.

 

It has a 14ct 'F' nib, and it seems a bit scratchy. I have had a look at it with a Loupe and it seems a little lop-sided.

 

Pics posted here: http://imgur.com/a/gEsOo

 

I also see what looks like a polish mark on the shoulder of the nib.

 

Does anyone have an idea as to why it looks like this/feels like this? And do you think it can be solved by aligning the tine, or does it need 're-tipping'.

 

I am not sure if I should sell it as-is on ebay, or try and find a nibmaster in Germany.

 

 

Cheers,

 

Ben

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