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Hairline Celluloid Crack


sugna

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I have a lovely vintage Aurora Selene in a beautiful brown basketweave celluloid. It has a hairline crack beginning at the barrel lip (i.e. threads) and continuing down about 3/4 of an inch. Interestingly, the crack follows the pattern in the celluloid, almost as if the material itself is unraveling along the line it was extruded/formed. With a very slight squeeze, the crack disappears, but with the pressure exerted during normal writing, or when depressing the button, the crack widens.

 

I have seen various posts about celluloid welding, and am thinking this would be an appropriate application for MEK. I am thinking I can use the bottom end of a pick or scraper tool to gently spread the crack, then paint a little MEK on each side, then hold them together.

 

Not having done this before, how long should I squeeze / hold the crack together? Or am I heading down the road to ruin by even attempting it?

 

Interested to hear your thoughts!

 

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have not tried working on celluloid pens but using a brush to apply solvent will mar the surrounding area more than necessary. It's better just to let it wick into the crack itself.

 

when I do styrene solvent welding, I use a hypodermic needle like a pipette

 

http://www.cybermodeler.com/tips/images/glue_01.jpg

 

Better still is the Plastruct applicator, it's a glass tube with a hypodermic needle tip. I suck up solvent into the glass tube & dispense it neatly either by gravity or closing the top with finger then using bodyheat to warm the glass & expelling the liquid

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None of the above materials will work properly with celluloid.

 

You should use MEK, and apply with a soft camels hair brush. Wear gloves and avoid breathing the fumes. A mask with charcoal filters would be even better. Clamp the crack closed, and allow it time to cure. The repair will need a week to reach sufficient strength, though longer will be better.

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Sold My Celluloid Edison but will eventually get another pen made in that wonderful material (most likely a vintage).

Ron, for the weld you are suggesting on that cracked rim, would you apply the MEK from the inside only or also "carefully" treat the front surface of the crack as well?

Is MEK runny like water or does it have some consistency?

*Sailor 1911S, Black/gold, 14k. 0.8 mm. stub(JM) *1911S blue "Colours", 14k. H-B "M" BLS (PB)

*2 Sailor 1911S Burgundy/gold: 14k. 0.6 mm. "round-nosed" CI (MM) & 14k. 1.1 mm. CI (JM)

*Sailor Pro-Gear Slim Spec. Ed. "Fire",14k. (factory) "H-B"

*Kaweco SPECIAL FP: 14k. "B",-0.6 mm BLS & 14k."M" 0.4 mm. BLS (PB)

*Kaweco Stainless Steel Lilliput, 14k. "M" -0.7 mm.BLS, (PB)

 

 

 

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Sold My Celluloid Edison but will eventually get another pen made in that wonderful material (most likely a vintage).

Ron, for the weld you are suggesting on that cracked rim, would you apply the MEK from the inside only or also "carefully" treat the front surface of the crack as well?

Is MEK runny like water or does it have some consistency?

Surface tension of water is ~73, for MEK ~25.

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Surface tension of water is ~73, for MEK ~25.

You lost me there. Took the absolute minimum maths & sciences.

*Sailor 1911S, Black/gold, 14k. 0.8 mm. stub(JM) *1911S blue "Colours", 14k. H-B "M" BLS (PB)

*2 Sailor 1911S Burgundy/gold: 14k. 0.6 mm. "round-nosed" CI (MM) & 14k. 1.1 mm. CI (JM)

*Sailor Pro-Gear Slim Spec. Ed. "Fire",14k. (factory) "H-B"

*Kaweco SPECIAL FP: 14k. "B",-0.6 mm BLS & 14k."M" 0.4 mm. BLS (PB)

*Kaweco Stainless Steel Lilliput, 14k. "M" -0.7 mm.BLS, (PB)

 

 

 

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You lost me there. Took the absolute minimum maths & sciences.

 

 

wikipedia

 

Water has high surface tension, so will tend to bead rather than to run into fine cracks, which is why when cleaning we use an ultrasonic cleaner, to help it to penetrate. MEK will run by itself, so to speak.

X

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None of the above materials will work properly with celluloid. You should use MEK, and apply with a soft camels hair brush. Wear gloves and avoid breathing the fumes. A mask with charcoal filters would be even better.

Have my doubts a charcoal filter would do anything against MEK or solvents... unless it's biohazard grade ;) if you're really serious about protection & use it often enough, I'd go for a ventilated mask with air supplied from the next room!

 

MEK stinks like Acetone. I usually weld styrene with Methylene Chloride cements, less odorous. I don't play with it often enough to mask up, but my workbench is upwind from exhaust fan blowing out an open window.

 

All 3 are pretty thin and wick into tiny fissures easily, and evaporate even quicker.

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Have my doubts a charcoal filter would do anything against MEK or solvents... unless it's biohazard grade ;) if you're really serious about protection & use it often enough, I'd go for a ventilated mask with air supplied from the next room!

 

MEK stinks like Acetone. I usually weld styrene with Methylene Chloride cements, less odorous. I don't play with it often enough to mask up, but my workbench is upwind from exhaust fan blowing out an open window.

 

All 3 are pretty thin and wick into tiny fissures easily, and evaporate even quicker.

 

Tamiya, your post and avatar give one the thought that you're a plastic modeler like me. Ron is of course right -- except for the Ambroid, which is (sadly for us modelers) no longer available and was not pure MEK, and the Testor's, which has changed formulas numerous times and is currently part acetone, the other solvents you have are all DCM, methylene chloride. They won't weld celluloid or any but the cheapest extruded modern plastic pens, and they might scar them severely in the attempt.

 

Sugna, This is a job for MEK, which is available in some states in hardware stores and can be bought via Amazon. Don't get the MEK substitute sold in Home Depot in the banned states. It's best kept clamped into place -- I use a wooden clothes pin, which has a round opening for the clothesline and which generally fits a pen well. For a little extra tension in a bigger crack I put another clothes pin over the end of the first one. You want enough tension to hold the crack closed while the weld cures, not enough to do more damage with the stress. Feather it on a couple of times with a brush, eyedropper, or divider point, both inside and out, and walk away. Once a day for a week and see if the weld holds. The MEK, by the way, is extremely volatile; take care with its use and storage.

 

Tim

Tim

 timsvintagepens.com and @timsvintagepens

 

 

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Hi Tim!

 

ahh well, you're 1/2 right... haven't touched any Airfix kit for decades but I do muck around with Evergreen styrene for prototyping my madscientist inventions ;)

 

I'm downunder... afaik there's no wholesale ban on MEK & it's still available from good hardware stores, paint suppliers or worst case definitely the plastic/acrylic guys still get supplies.

 

Model supplies otoh, all we get @LHS are your usual US & Japanese brands so yeah, the "good stuff" is gone.

 

Then again, my childhood household had a huge gallon vial labelled "ETHER" ... this stuff was amazing, we used it to weld Airfix models & PVC pipes, plus it worked as fuel for 049 Cox Diesel engines...

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Tamiya, your post and avatar give one the thought that you're a plastic modeler like me. Ron is of course right -- except for the Ambroid, which is (sadly for us modelers) no longer available and was not pure MEK, and the Testor's, which has changed formulas numerous times and is currently part acetone, the other solvents you have are all DCM, methylene chloride. They won't weld celluloid or any but the cheapest extruded modern plastic pens, and they might scar them severely in the attempt.

 

Sugna, This is a job for MEK, which is available in some states in hardware stores and can be bought via Amazon. Don't get the MEK substitute sold in Home Depot in the banned states. It's best kept clamped into place -- I use a wooden clothes pin, which has a round opening for the clothesline and which generally fits a pen well. For a little extra tension in a bigger crack I put another clothes pin over the end of the first one. You want enough tension to hold the crack closed while the weld cures, not enough to do more damage with the stress. Feather it on a couple of times with a brush, eyedropper, or divider point, both inside and out, and walk away. Once a day for a week and see if the weld holds. The MEK, by the way, is extremely volatile; take care with its use and storage.

 

Tim

 

Thanks for your advice, Tim. I picked some MEK up from a model train shop (the back reads "this product contains MEK") as well as a camel brush per Ron's instructions. I'll give it a shot this week!

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Last time I glued something across threads like that, I didn't have a suitable clamp... ended up strapping it together with dental floss ;)

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I picked some up off ebay.uk recently from a model train seller. This I think is the same item: 112074662141

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Before paying to ship Hazmat solvents across the pond, have a look around locally first.

 

MEK is commonly used as paint thinner ("architectural coatings" supplier), weld PVC (plumbers pipe, vinyl upholsterers), stick acrylic glass (shopfitters) etc. I'd try good hardware bigbox store, or even Halfords perhaps.

 

Testor is a big US name in modelling industry, they sell various model cements but these are likely to have some styrene dissolved in it - helps with gap filling. Also very likely to have been reformulated in recent years to neuter the MEK content out of it.

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Hi all,

I've already repaired similar cracks successfully with liquid celluloid.

The crack being rather wide one can carefully fill it with liquid celluloid in my opinion.

First clean both sides of the crack by pulling a strip of 600 grit sand paper through it to remove al cumulated dirt out;

Install the section after applying a thin layer of silicone grease on the male threads ,avoiding the liquid celluloid would stick on the section threads.

Using a needle carefully fill the gap avoiding the celluloid goes in the thread spires.

The applied liquid celluloid will shrink somewhat due to the evaporation of the acetone, so let dry for a few hours ,apply a second layer and let dry again for a few hours.

Could be a third application is necessary let dry for a few hours , then remove the section and let the liquid celluloid dry out for at least 24 hours.

Using a small triangle file then carefully correct the thread profile over the welded area if necessary.

Francis

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Celluloid repair is one of my specialties. I do a lot of it, and have for about 12 years. I've had many chances to go back and look at my repairs months and years later, and have modified my techniques as a result.

 

I would let the repairs cure more than a few hours at room temperature before adding another layer. Days would be better. I have found that adding layers too quickly like that can lead to micro-bubbles and other flaws. If the repair is curing at room temperature or a bit warmer, you are best letting it cure as long as a month before blending the repair area. The extra time lets it harden properly, and produces better results.

 

The celluloid applied may shrink and crack in a few weeks if you don't allow sufficient time to cure between layers or if the celluloid slurry applied is too thick. I've also seen some cases where a faint flaw or line appears revealing where the crack was a year after the repair was blended. The repair is as strong as ever, just not invisible.

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I used a camel hair brush to apply the tiniest amount of MEK to the front and back of the crack. Then, I checked the crack by shining a light from the outside and looking inside the barrel, and it seems to have disappeared. Just testing it lightly after a day with my fingers, I am no longer able to move/shift the portion of the barrel above the crack. Should I add another wicking of MEK, or just leave well enough alone?

 

The slurry stuff is above my pay grade / confidence level.

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