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Dedicated Ig Pen, Mild Paranoia

iron gall essri salix lamy steel

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#1 sleepyjz

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 17:28

Hello all,

 

Everyone's experiences and apprehensions with iron gall inks seem to be all over the place. The take home message is usually something along the lines of "if you exercise proper pen hygiene and use modern iron gall inks formulated for fountain pens, you shouldn't have an issue". I've followed this and nope, haven't had an issue yet. What I do get apprehensive about is the reasoning behind the iron gall cleaning routine.

 

It seems you don't want the ink sitting in the pen for very long but the issue arises if you want to dedicate IG ink to a pen. For example what if one were to use IG inks in a steel nibbed pen with proper hygiene (rinsing, thorough cleaning bi-weekly at best, etc) but kept refilling the pen with IG ink? Wouldn't the contact time with the steel eventually corrode the nib?

 

That's my question -- about the hardiness of steel when exposed to IG ink with proper pen maintenance. Anyone have positive/negative stories to share? This includes IG ink experiences of all kind with any nib/pen material but i'd especially love to hear from folks that have been using an IG ink in a particular pen for a long time (e.g., >=1 year). How does your pen fare under these conditions?

 

Best,

 

sleepy

 

 

P.S: Currently using ESSRI in a lamy 2k and am loving it. A left-handed overwriters dream!



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#2 Out0Mind

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 18:29

I've been using IG ink in a TWSBI 580 Diamond with very little problem.  I thought I noticed a little corrosion, but it turned out to be mild staining which washed away with some effort from a paper towel on the nib.  I probably flush the pen every two weeks, which, unquestionably, helps, but I haven't even really seen any staining in the barrel.

 

I've been told over time, a demonstrator can start to stain inside the barrel and to avoid IG with demos.  As the TWSBI can be taken apart, I've noticed that after disassembly for a thorough cleaning, some ink is left on the material I use to clean the inside of the pen, which flushing may not clear out.  That said, it may just mean that, for meat least, I only use it in pens that can be fully taken down and cleaned - for example, I won't use it in a Montblanc, where I can't completely tear it down for a top-to-bottom clean.

 

For my own sanity's sake, what I'll probably do is swap the steel nib out for a titanium nib, to simply minimize any chance of a problem.

 

Just my two cents.  Hope that helped!



#3 sleepyjz

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 19:01

I've been using IG ink in a TWSBI 580 Diamond with very little problem.  I thought I noticed a little corrosion, but it turned out to be mild staining which washed away with some effort from a paper towel on the nib.  I probably flush the pen every two weeks, which, unquestionably, helps, but I haven't even really seen any staining in the barrel.
 
I've been told over time, a demonstrator can start to stain inside the barrel and to avoid IG with demos.  As the TWSBI can be taken apart, I've noticed that after disassembly for a thorough cleaning, some ink is left on the material I use to clean the inside of the pen, which flushing may not clear out.  That said, it may just mean that, for meat least, I only use it in pens that can be fully taken down and cleaned - for example, I won't use it in a Montblanc, where I can't completely tear it down for a top-to-bottom clean.
 
For my own sanity's sake, what I'll probably do is swap the steel nib out for a titanium nib, to simply minimize any chance of a problem.
 
Just my two cents.  Hope that helped!


Thanks for your input. I too have noticed mild staining with IG inks, nothing permanent like you said, but yes I only use them in fully "disassembleable" pens to really clean off any stuck on surface residue. Let me know if you find a twsbi titanium nib or one that fits the 580. I'd be interested!

#4 canobiecrazy

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 19:22

I've been using Hero 232 exclusively in my Lamy Safari for about 4 months now. I haven't noticed any issues. The converter has some very slight darkening but it's nothing drastic. I flush it every other fill. I have noticed that Hero 232 makes pens prone to hard-starting hard-start more often. I don't know if it's just a dry ink, or if it has to do with the IG component, though.

 

(edited, sorry, somehow misread that this was about R&K IG)


Edited by canobiecrazy, 20 July 2016 - 19:25.


#5 Goudy

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 21:48

The problem with IG inks in a fountain pen is not so much to do with corrosion of the nib (stainless steel is pretty resistant to that) as the risk of the ink separating out into a solid while in the pen and clogging the feed. FP friendly IG inks like R&K Scabiosa are formulated not to do that, but others like Diamine and ESSRI may be problematic if you don't flush out the precipitate occasionally.

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#6 Tas

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 21:56

Akkerman #10 has been married to my Lamy 2000 since I first acquired the pen in December last year.

 

I refill every two to three weeks - have yet to flush it out  :blush:

 

 

Never missed a beat.  



#7 Out0Mind

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 22:42

Thanks for your input. I too have noticed mild staining with IG inks, nothing permanent like you said, but yes I only use them in fully "disassembleable" pens to really clean off any stuck on surface residue. Let me know if you find a twsbi titanium nib or one that fits the 580. I'd be interested!

 

 I've been using a Bock #6 Titanium nib for a while now on my Vac 700.  You can also get a Bock #5 Titanium nib for the 580, as well.  I ordered mine from Beaufort Ink, as TWSBI uses custom-stamped Bock nibs (I believe).  It's been working really well so far.  The link to their nib site is here:

 

http://www.beauforti...k/bocknibs.html

 

Hope this helps!



#8 ENewton

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 23:06

I have used R & K Scabiosa in a Platinum Balance for more than a year with no apparent problems.  I do flush it between fills.

 

Also, when my pen is not in use, I keep it in a cup with the nib facing upward, so the ink is not always in contact with the nib.



#9 aeba

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Posted 20 July 2016 - 23:57

 

 I've been using a Bock #6 Titanium nib for a while now on my Vac 700.  You can also get a Bock #5 Titanium nib for the 580, as well.  I ordered mine from Beaufort Ink, as TWSBI uses custom-stamped Bock nibs (I believe).  It's been working really well so far.  The link to their nib site is here:

 

http://www.beauforti...k/bocknibs.html

 

Hope this helps!

Unless you have pretty old Vac 700, it's a JoWo-nib.

 

http://blog.gouletpe...0-nib-swap.html


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#10 tinta

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Posted 21 July 2016 - 02:25

Though my present pens have gold nibs now,  for a good number of years I also used quality stainless nibs-units made by JoWo.  I have not experienced any problems with either Salix IG ink or my favourite, Scabiosa using a stainless nib.

 

Thanks to FPN, I've received a lot of advice on the care & feeding of pens that run ferrogallic inks.  I particularly took to heart the helpful suggestions found in Sandy1's thorough posts on this topic.

 

To date only Akkerman # 10 has caused any significant staining (seen on converters) but no clogging & only after the ink was left in the pen for a long time (months).  Stainless nibs did not seem to be affected by the IG inks I've regularly used (Akkerman # 10, old formula MB Midnight b/b, the pair of R&K inks, Registrars & Platinum b/b).

 

I now have a 1911 Standard/0.6 mm CI that's always filled with Platinum's b/b, sometimes for up to a month at a time.   With routine flushing (the Sandy1 way) I've never had a problem. 

I have no proof, only anecdotal evidence that the modern IG inks (formulated for fountain pens) are for the most part trouble free.  As other have said, iron gall inks tend to precipitate solids if left inside pens for too long. 

Regular pen hygiene works.  :thumbup:

 


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#11 Out0Mind

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Posted 21 July 2016 - 04:46

Unless you have pretty old Vac 700, it's a JoWo-nib.
 
http://blog.gouletpe...0-nib-swap.html

Aah, thanks for the correction! Either way, I've replaced it with a Bock Titanium #6 and it's writing just fine.

Edited by Out0Mind, 21 July 2016 - 04:48.


#12 setriode

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Posted 23 July 2016 - 06:13

I am about to dedicate a Platinum Century with its special sealing cap to IG ink and will let you know how this works out.

#13 Leftytoo

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Posted 23 July 2016 - 06:38

I also use Scabiosa and Salix with no problems at all. And no special cleaning and flushing procedures. I also use Pelikan blue-black, which is a mixture of IG and regular ink. So these are 3 IG inks that should be safe in any pen, with no special care needed. All 3 have great color and nice flow, dry time, lack of bleeding etc.

 

Some people will find the pale purple Scabiosa off-putting. If that is your case, all is not lost: mix in about 1 part any blue ink you have on hand to 4 parts Scabiosa. A few drops of brown will also help. The result is a very neat, slightly different blue-black.


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#14 inkstainedruth

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Posted 23 July 2016 - 15:21

I also use Scabiosa and Salix with no problems at all. And no special cleaning and flushing procedures. I also use Pelikan blue-black, which is a mixture of IG and regular ink. So these are 3 IG inks that should be safe in any pen, with no special care needed. All 3 have great color and nice flow, dry time, lack of bleeding etc.

 

Some people will find the pale purple Scabiosa off-putting. If that is your case, all is not lost: mix in about 1 part any blue ink you have on hand to 4 parts Scabiosa. A few drops of brown will also help. The result is a very neat, slightly different blue-black.

 

I'd be a bit concerned about *what* inks you're mixing in.  I've read recently that some Japanese inks (particularly Iroshihzuku) are somewhat alkaline and mixing any of those with an acidic IG ink just sounds like a recipe for disaster.

As for the original question about limiting what pens to use with IG inks -- I've used a lot of my Vectors, all of which have stainless steel nibs, with no issue (but I'm also pretty OCD about pen maintenance to begin with).  And just recently I put FPN member Pharmacist's Turkish Night in my replacement Pelikan M200 Café Crème, which came with an IM nib on it.  That pen was such a gusher (even by Pelikan standards, IMO) that I finally put Turkish Night in it -- and STILL had to have the nib tweaked some at the Triangle Pen Show last month to cut the flow a bit; I also bought a replacement B nib unit, which is what I had on the Café Crème I lost last March.  That pen ran with Turkish Night for about a month before I flushed it out (although part of the time it was diluted with a fill of distilled water because I was lazy).

Thinking about putting either Akkerman #10 or KWZI IG Blue Black (or maybe IG Blue #3) in that pen next.  I will note that previous inks in the pen were NOT IG inks; I've also used non-IG inks in the Vectors (the same ones I had IG inks in).  But, as I said before, I'm pretty OCD about flushing.

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#15 CS388

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Posted 23 July 2016 - 15:42

I use a whole bunch of inks. Two years ago, I brought Diamine Registrar's into the mix.

It's a beautiful ink and I enjoy using it very much.

I use Meisterstuck pens (resin and celluloid, gold nibs) and have never experienced an issue with this ink.

It does settle in the bottle, very quickly.

 

However, I recently started using steel (wartime) nibs and I've been hesitant to use IG inks in them, due to the corrision fears, mentioned above. My pen hygene is decent, but I don't always flush between inks. These are hard working pens.

Pleased to have fears allayed by previous posters. Thanks.

 

OP: I think it should work well. 

If we dedicate any pen to a single ink, it will probably result in a good pen-cleaning routine, suited to that ink and pen.

 

Good luck.



#16 wallylynn

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Posted 24 July 2016 - 20:54

 

 

Wouldn't the contact time with the steel eventually corrode the nib?

 

 

yes and no.

yes:  eventually.

no: no more so than any other water based ink.



#17 Arkanabar

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 01:11

The problem with IG inks in a fountain pen is not so much to do with corrosion of the nib (stainless steel is pretty resistant to that) as the risk of the ink separating out into a solid while in the pen and clogging the feed. FP friendly IG inks like R&K Scabiosa are formulated not to do that, but others like Diamine and ESSRI may be problematic if you don't flush out the precipitate occasionally.

+1.  The issue is the tannoferrogallic acid.  It's transparent in solution, but when dry, it oxidizes into an insoluble, dark grey solid.  That's what you have to be most careful of.

Of IG PF inks, none better has a reputation for being benign than R&K Salix and Scabiosa.


Edited by Arkanabar, 26 July 2016 - 01:12.


#18 Leftytoo

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 02:11

 

I'd be a bit concerned about *what* inks you're mixing in.  I've read recently that some Japanese inks (particularly Iroshihzuku) are somewhat alkaline and mixing any of those with an acidic IG ink just sounds like a recipe for disaster.

As for the original question about limiting what pens to use with IG inks -- I've used a lot of my Vectors, all of which have stainless steel nibs, with no issue (but I'm also pretty OCD about pen maintenance to begin with).  And just recently I put FPN member Pharmacist's Turkish Night in my replacement Pelikan M200 Café Crème, which came with an IM nib on it.  That pen was such a gusher (even by Pelikan standards, IMO) that I finally put Turkish Night in it -- and STILL had to have the nib tweaked some at the Triangle Pen Show last month to cut the flow a bit; I also bought a replacement B nib unit, which is what I had on the Café Crème I lost last March.  That pen ran with Turkish Night for about a month before I flushed it out (although part of the time it was diluted with a fill of distilled water because I was lazy).

Thinking about putting either Akkerman #10 or KWZI IG Blue Black (or maybe IG Blue #3) in that pen next.  I will note that previous inks in the pen were NOT IG inks; I've also used non-IG inks in the Vectors (the same ones I had IG inks in).  But, as I said before, I'm pretty OCD about flushing.

Ruth Morrisson aka inkstainedruth

When I say "any ink" I'm referring to the common well known and un-exotic inks such as those recommended by Richard Binder - Waterman, Diamine, Quink, Pelikan, Herbin, Lamy, Omas, Aurora. There are others, of course such as Jentil. My only excursion outside this safe zone was Private Reserve. Bought twice, and both gave problems with gunk and sediment. I notice as well that ink problems related here at FPN seldom involve the inks Richard Binder recommends. I share your feelings about gushing pens such as Pelikan. And that is one reason I love IG inks. Modern pens I've had that write more on the dry side are Sailor (good), Aurora (stub only), and Cross European Century II (excellent).


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