2 Different Colors With Lie De Thé

[helene20]

Can someone explain to me why I get 2 different colors when I ink 2 different pens with J. Herbin Lie de Thé. Thanks!

 

I like this ink a lot in the Conklin and I don't it in the Lamy Safari.

Schedule

Schedule

[ScienceChick]

From the looks of it, the Conklin is a MUCH wetter pen and the Lamy is quite ink-stingy.

Edited February 7, 2016 by ScienceChick

[helene20]

ScheduleI'm french can you explain in other words what ink-stingy means? Sorry about that.

 

From the looks of it, the Conklin is a MUCH wetter pen and the Lamy is quite ink-stingy.

[mhguda]

It means the Lamy is a dry writing pen; the ink flows almost reluctantly. So you do not get a lot of ink in the line it lays down, and the ink seems very light and washed out.

Do you have this problem with this pen with other inks? It might just be the Lie de thé...

[helene20]

Schedule

 

It means the Lamy is a dry writing pen; the ink flows almost reluctantly. So you do not get a lot of ink in the line it lays down, and the ink seems very light and washed out.

Do you have this problem with this pen with other inks? It might just be the Lie de thé...

 

Great question, when I'm using another Lamy Safari with B nib and Diamine Burnt Sienna the ink, same thing happened, I was not happy with the ink/pen combo at all. Having said that when I'm using any of my Lamys with inks like J. Herbin Emerald of Chivor, Diamine Rustic Brown, De Atramentis Steel Blue, Diamine Rustic Brown, I get amazing results. So it might be these 2 inks that does not behave good in a Lamy.

[mhguda]

From what you're saying, it seems so... and you say this is with more than just one Lamy. They do seem incompatible then...

[Runnin_Ute]

Is the Conklin also a B? Or something narrower?

 

Some inks I absolutely love the look of in my Lamy Al Star with 1.1 mm - others not at all. In the not at all category? Papier Plume's sepia/brown (I have a sample and forget what they actually call it), but that in a narrower nibbed (and wetter) pen and it pops.

 

Levenger Pomegranate - love the ink and it is really interesting. But I like it better in my Pelikan M200 Cognac and its narrow fine nib on some papers than in my B nibbed Noodler's Konrad. I can actually see some shading with the F but not necessarily with the Konrad.

[carlos.q]

Take a look at this recent thread and you will find something similar:

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/303788-compared-some-blue-black-inks-w-a-dry-and-wet-pen/

[ScienceChick]

I apologize for being unclear. mhguda clarified perfectly.

[Sandy1]

Hi,

 

Believe me, there's only one dye in that demi-courtine bottle!

 

I found that HLdT is one of the malleable inks, which are very sensitive/responsive to the pen+paper combo.

 

If I may be so bold, there is a bit of terminology which may be useful: Hue refers to colour, and Value refers to light-dark.

(See Wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munsell_color_system There are other colour system, but I like Munsell for its simplicity.)

 

When there is a small amount of ink on the paper from a dry pen, quite often the paper is not fully dyed so the paper is still apparent - the Value is high. When the paper is fully dyed from a much wetter pen what we see is the darkest the ink can be [from that pen on that paper] - the Value is low so the Hue becomes 'submerged'.

 

For a more dramatic example, Noodler's Apache Sunset is great fun, and in the care of a calligrapher is astonishing. (Thank-you Mr Tardif!) Some of the Purple-leaning Blue inks, such as Aurora, can appear almost floral when the Value is high, yet when the the Value is low, the floral aspect disappears so the ink appears as an interesting variant of Royal Blue.

 

To my way of thinking, a 'good' malleable ink has a roomy performance envelope: delivers high line quality, doesn't feather, and is reluctant to bleed- show-through modest paper; and often has high shading potential. I choose such inks when I have the time and patience to work-out a pen+paper combo that suits what I plan to write.

 

Bye,

S1

 

__ __

My IR of HLdT : https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/218604-herbin-lie-de-the/

Edited February 8, 2016 by Sandy1

[mhguda]

Wow. Thanks for that explanation.

[Sandy1]

Wow. Thanks for that explanation.

 

Hi,

 

You're welcome.

 

If one wants to further alter the appearance of an ink, choice of paper base-tint and texture may also be brought into play.

 

For example, if using a warm base-tint paper, such as Ivory, when there is little ink on the paper the dye is translucent so the reflected light that we see includes the base-tint of the paper. As more dye is added to the paper from a wet pen not only does the Value change but the Hue changes as the ink saturates the paper to a greater degree - we see more ink than paper. When there is shading from wide nibs, there can be a slight duo-tone appearance.

 

There is also 'simultaneous contrast', wherein both the perceived Hue and Value can be manipulated, and just to keep things interesting, that can also be influenced by nib width and % coverage of the sheet. (Wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contrast_effect)

 

My wee review of the G Lalo Velin de France paper includes some close-up comparison scans depicting such. https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/195559-paper-review-g-lalo-velin-de-france/?p=1977734

 

Our perception of an ink is also greatly influenced by the ambient light; and even the amount and age of optical brightening agents in the paper make a difference.

 

As Brown is not a pure/spectral Hue, it is especially subject to manipulation.

 

Whee!

 

Bye,

S1

Edited February 8, 2016 by Sandy1

[helene20]

ScheduleI guess I have some Lamys that flows different from other Lamys that I own. I will try Lie de Thé in a different Lamy and see how it goes.

 

From what you're saying, it seems so... and you say this is with more than just one Lamy. They do seem incompatible then...

[helene20]

My Conklin All American is with the 1.1 Italic Nib, I was surprised how well it writes. I guess I will try an ink in several pens before I decide if I will buy it or not.

 

 

Is the Conklin also a B? Or something narrower?

 

Some inks I absolutely love the look of in my Lamy Al Star with 1.1 mm - others not at all. In the not at all category? Papier Plume's sepia/brown (I have a sample and forget what they actually call it), but that in a narrower nibbed (and wetter) pen and it pops.

 

Levenger Pomegranate - love the ink and it is really interesting. But I like it better in my Pelikan M200 Cognac and its narrow fine nib on some papers than in my B nibbed Noodler's Konrad. I can actually see some shading with the F but not necessarily with the Konrad.

 

Schedule

[helene20]

Thank you, I will continue to experiment with combos of inks/pens/paper.

 

Back in the days, when I started to write with fountain pens, we did not have so many inks to chose from.

 

 

Hi,

 

Believe me, there's only one dye in that demi-courtine bottle!

 

I found that HLdT is one of the malleable inks, which are very sensitive/responsive to the pen+paper combo.

 

If I may be so bold, there is a bit of terminology which may be useful: Hue refers to colour, and Value refers to light-dark.

(See Wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munsell_color_system There are other colour system, but I like Munsell for its simplicity.)

 

When there is a small amount of ink on the paper from a dry pen, quite often the paper is not fully dyed so the paper is still apparent - the Value is high. When the paper is fully dyed from a much wetter pen what we see is the darkest the ink can be [from that pen on that paper] - the Value is low so the Hue becomes 'submerged'.

 

For a more dramatic example, Noodler's Apache Sunset is great fun, and in the care of a calligrapher is astonishing. (Thank-you Mr Tardif!) Some of the Purple-leaning Blue inks, such as Aurora, can appear almost floral when the Value is high, yet when the the Value is low, the floral aspect disappears so the ink appears as an interesting variant of Royal Blue.

 

To my way of thinking, a 'good' malleable ink has a roomy performance envelope: delivers high line quality, doesn't feather, and is reluctant to bleed- show-through modest paper; and often have high shading potential. I choose such inks when I have the time and patience to work-out a pen+paper combo that suits what I plan to write.

 

Bye,

S1

 

__ __

My IR of HLdT : https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/218604-herbin-lie-de-the/

 

Schedule

[Sandy1]

Thank you, I will continue to experiment with combos of inks/pens/paper.

 

Back in the days, when I started to write with fountain pens, we did not have so many inks to chose from.

 

 

 

Schedule

 

Hi,

 

Ah. When I started using an FP I used one pen and one ink for whatever there was to write to the maximum practical extent.

 

Somehow my family noticed that I used an FP extensively, so gifted me with other FPs. (Lack of imagination or enabling?) I thought each pen should have its own ink: Parker Penman Sapphire for the Duofold, and the MB149 came bundled with the iron-gall Blue-Black so I fed it more of the same.)

 

When I started to acquire other pens recommended by friends ("That MB149 is too big - try a Pelikan.") or necessity (rotring 600 for field work), I thought they should have their own dedicated ink. Shortly after that curiosity came a'knocking, and its been an adventure ever since.

 

Enjoy!

 

Bye,

S1

Edited February 8, 2016 by Sandy1

[DaveBj]

Nobody else has brought this up, so I will: What was the previous ink in the Conklin, and are you sure that you got the nib and feed completely clean?

 

War story: My son brought me a green-and-black Guider ebonite from a business trip to India. It had been loaded with red ink, so I cleaned it (I thought) and loaded it with green ink. It still wrote red for pages.

[helene20]

ScheduleGreat question, it was probably 4 months ago with R&K Alt-Goldgrun and I did clean it very well.

 

Nobody else has brought this up, so I will: What was the previous ink in the Conklin, and are you sure that you got the nib and feed completely clean?

 

War story: My son brought me a green-and-black Guider ebonite from a business trip to India. It had been loaded with red ink, so I cleaned it (I thought) and loaded it with green ink. It still wrote red for pages.

[helene20]

I like to try different inks in all my pens. It's more fun that way. It amaze me to see how a pen/ink combo is on paper compared to the same ink with another pen.

 

 

 

 

Hi,

 

Ah. When I started using an FP I used one pen and one ink for whatever there was to write to the maximum practical extent.

 

Somehow my family noticed that I used an FP extensively, so gifted me with other FPs. (Lack of imagination or enabling?) I thought each pen should have its own ink: Parker Penman Sapphire for the Duofold, and the MB149 came bundled with the iron-gall Blue-Black so I fed it more of the same.)

 

When I started to acquire other pens recommended by friends ("That MB149 is too big - try a Pelikan.") or necessity (rotring 600 for field work), I thought they should have their own dedicated ink. Shortly after that curiosity came a'knocking, and its been an adventure ever since.

 

Enjoy!

 

Bye,

S1

 

Schedule