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Disappointed With High-End Ballpoints And Rollers


Precise

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Well, he is disappointed about the holder part, not about the refill.

I know someone who worked at a stationery shop for 40 years, and according to her the refill are more or less all the same, regardless of the brand stamped upon them.

Perhaps she is correct for groups of refills, but there are some outliers that write better.

 

Sometimes it's subtle, like balls that only roll when the pen is near vertical, but scratch when the pen is held at a common angle of near 45 degrees.

Alan

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I now have acquired a dozen "quality" ballpoint and rollerballs. By "quality" I mean that they cost from $15 to $150. A few of the rollerballs start without hesitation. But several other rollerballs and all the ballpoints need a few letters to reach full strength.

 

Yet all of my $3 EnerGels start full strength without hesitation and write perfectly smooth.

 

Alan

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The Parker Jotter serves well and I'm especially fond of the flighter version. Another one that I've found to be comfortable and a solid writing experience is the Pilot Ageless Future which take a very smooth pilot ballpoint refill or a short G2.

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I mean this seriously, the best ballpoint pen you can buy is (IMHO) the BIC M10. It is no longer sold in the USA, but it's still sold in parts of Europe and Australia. You can order them by the box on Amazon.uk

It was first introduced in 1956 (!) and advertised as the ballpoint with the shock absorber. It is very comfortable, super light, the retracting mechanism is a classic and it is super inexpensive. I trained many pilots in my life; all over the globe: many military pilots use the M10. The fact that it is still being made after 60 years attests to its qualities.

 

I looked up the M10 and recognised it as a ballpoint I find pretty comfortable, just never knew its name. The rings molded into the section help grip quite well, despite their shallowness.

 

post-29904-0-31457200-1454281164_thumb.jpg

 

 

The Parker Jotter serves well and I'm especially fond of the flighter version. Another one that I've found to be comfortable and a solid writing experience is the Pilot Ageless Future which take a very smooth pilot ballpoint refill or a short G2.

 

I lost my 80's all steel Jotter and recently replaced it with an 07 model. I can hardly grip it at all! Did they change the brush finish somehow?? It would be great if the metal version came with engraved gripping rings, but that's something I've only seen on early 45 ballpoints. I much prefer the Jotter's button rather than cap actuation though, as well as its iconic looks.

Latest pen related post @ flounders-mindthots.blogspot.com : vintage Pilot Elite Pocket Pen review

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Any rollerball is smooth when perpendicular to the paper. But, at a typical hold angle, many scrape on the paper. It's especially bad on the upstroke when the metal surrounding the ball scrapes the paper.

 

Many of you have a wealth of knowledge about roller balls. Do you have any suggestions of brand or ball-width regarding this?

 

Thank you,

 

Alan

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  • 1 month later...

I have several quality rollerballs and gel pens from Cross to Mont blanc. Sometimes they dont write very well. I just bought a hoarde of zebra Sarasa .7 gel pens on a ridiculous clearance sale .They write wonderfully. Pack of ten is about $13.00. I bought 14 packs of 10 pens for $14.00 and tax total. score.

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I have several quality rollerballs and gel pens from Cross to Mont blanc. Sometimes they dont write very well. I just bought a hoarde of zebra Sarasa .7 gel pens on a ridiculous clearance sale .They write wonderfully. Pack of ten is about $13.00. I bought 14 packs of 10 pens for $14.00 and tax total. score.

 

How long does one of those pens last you?

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I write a lot so based on the current filler in this pen it should last me about 2 weeks. Seems like a short life span for a pen filler but at .10 per pen it doesn't matter. I use pens like this, ball points and fountain pens for my journalling habit. What's even crazier is that I now have 140 refillable pens. I have boxes and boxes of various quality writing pens bought for pennies on the dollar. Yes I'm a pen, pencil paper hoarder and notebooks and let's not even talk about my art supplies.

Edited by Studio97
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My favorite non-FP non-mechanical-pencil writing implement is a Lamy 2000 RB body with an Schneider fineliner refill.

I needed to add some millimeters of plastic rod as the fineliner refill was shorter than the Lamy roller ball refill, but that is not a problem.

I really love how it writes :)

http://libpens.org/content/images/2016/Mar/IMG_20160308_165810.jpg

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I lost my 80's all steel Jotter and recently replaced it with an 07 model. I can hardly grip it at all! Did they change the brush finish somehow?? It would be great if the metal version came with engraved gripping rings, but that's something I've only seen on early 45 ballpoints. I much prefer the Jotter's button rather than cap actuation though, as well as its iconic looks.

 

Mine is a 90's version so afraid I can't comment on the recent ones.

Edited by Martinsroom
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My favorite non-fountain pens are the Uniball Signo 307 and the Pilot Precise V5 stick version. However, the Precise V5 retractable refill is pretty bad compared to the capped-stick one (but is by no means bad), so I wouldn't recommend it unless you want to use the rollerball bodies you already have. However, I don't have a Precise at the moment because I bought a two-pack of Uniball Vision Needle pens with "micro"-sized points.

 

The Signo feathers significantly less than the Vision. However, Since the Signo's ink is more viscous, it dries slower, but I have yet to see it feather at all (and I've gone through four of them). The Vision ink dries extremely quickly by any standard. Both inks are very water-resistant after drying and I learned this after various occasions of accidentally drawing on my clothing. All of these pens can write at an angle of about 45 degrees.

 

FEATHERING:

Signo: Practically no feathering, even on cheap paper

Vision: Feathers so much... it's great for heavy paper though.

Precise: Somewhere between the two

 

LINE (All these pens are in black):

Signo: In medium, it makes a fat line through the first fourth of the cartridge then steadies down to a manageable, usable line once that portion of ink is finished. It's quite strange. I recommend the micro point. Anyways, the line is wet, bold, professional-looking, and just plain awesome.

Vision: It says "extra fine," but I'd say it's a medium-fine. Line variation is annoying as when I write slower it will make a fat line. Ink is visibly wet on the paper but absorbs quickly. The line is bold but feathers a whole lot on cheap paper.

Precise: A great extra-fine line, as labeled. Doesn't feather much, even on cheap paper.

 

PRESSURE:
Signo: Requires very little pressure to write. Very nice.

Vision: With its thin ink, it requires nearly no pressure to write

Precise: Somewhere between the other two

 

BLEEDING:

Signo: Bleeding is not bad. On my exclusively cheap 50 cent notebook paper, I can see what's on the other side fairly clearly, so I can't write on both sides of my cheap notebook paper.

Vision: Bleeds so bad that some ink goes through the sheet and on the one under it, making a dotted sheet underneath.

Precise: Bleeds, but only on one sheet of cheap paper.

 

SMOOTHNESS:

Signo: Smooth like butter on a hot pan. Like a wet bar of soap on a tile floor. By far the smoothest pen I've ever used. It is smooth to about 45 degrees then it will start scratching the paper with its metal ball-holder.

Vision: A bit toothy, if not scratchy. Not to the extent of offense though. Can write to 30 degrees (or even more!) to the surface and still write nearly the same.

Precise: Very nice and tactile, yet not scratchy. I don't remember what angle it stops writing, but I hold my pens at about 45 degrees and never had a problem with my Precises.

 

BODY:

Signo: A cool modern design with faux carbon fiber pattern near the clip. I don't like rubber grips, and this one has a fat grip that is somewhat awkward to hold. The pen weighs 10.3 grams but feels hollow and light. Not very comfortable.

Vision: Really nice clip and well balanced, even at 9.8 grams. It has a nice thin-ish grip that is a perfect size for me.

Precise: I love how this pen feels. It's disposable, but I love the feel in my hand. The gripping section is the same size as for the Vision, and is weighted about the same, but the plastics feel more upscale somehow. It weighs 9.7 grams.

 

I like the Signo 307. I can't recommend it enough. I've gone through several of these since I first discovered them and my feelings haven't changed yet. It's a great pen. On the other hand, I can't imagine buying another pack of Uniball Signos ever again. They are dumb pens and I want to say I hate them, but the clip is so nice and it requires nearly no pressure to write...

 

VERDICT:

Buy the Signo 307 (not the 207) and put the refill into one of your rollerballs and be happy. It's the greatest non-fountain pen ever manufactured. Did I mention it was buttery smooth? Even my non-pen-people friends are dazzled by how smooth and bold it writes. Every Signo 307 I've used never skipped even once from start to finish, and always starts instantly when set to paper. I wish Uniball sold the refills by themselves so we don't have to throw away the body every time, especially since the ink runs out fast.

 

I'm praising it so much I probably sound like an adman :)

Edited by lyonlover
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For gel pens I prefer the Signo 207 or 307.

 

For ballpoints I always use a Fisher Space pen refill (Parker style) in a Sensa body (love that squishy grip, and the pen is perfectly balanced). You can find old Sensa pens on fee-bay.

 

http://www.pensinasia.com/Senverbp66.jpg

You might also want to look at the Sensa Cloud, which takes a Cross-type refill. However, I have taken an Energel refill and cut it to the right length to use in the Sensa pictured. It doesn't really fit perfectly, but still retracts and extends, and gives you that great Energel saturation and smoothness.

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I always hated "high quality ballpoint pens", it really seem useless for me. They don't bring anything up when you compared with cheap plastic ones, they even have more minuses, most of them not being too light, and not having a good grip section. These kind of ballpoints are mostly for presents, they often come in set, with fountain pens or mechanical pencils, and the selling point it's the look, not how it feels. And i get it. I wouldn't buy a set of an nice, black, fountain pen and an demonstrator, much thinner and with rubberized grip ballpoint, it would not make any sense.

 

Anyway, on these kind of pens, even regarding fountain pens too, i found out that i prefer the scholar versions, or versions with rubberized and specially shaped grip section. They are plastic, light weight, but they just feel perfect. Most of the times, the ones that look "serious", are not practical. Grip section will often be slippery, they might be too heavy, they might be too thick, i wasn't been able to find a good looking ballpoint. Uniball, Pilot, even BIC, make some great ballpoints. The price it's low, but i don't see why that would stop us to compare them with expensive ones. In this case, higher quality does not necessary means better.

 

Nevertheless, you are pretty much comparing apples with oranges, on how your rollerball writes better than ballpoints. I don't think that's a fair comparison. There are advantages and disadvantages. In front of my writing table, most rollerball pens will write better than most of my ballpoints, but on the outside, when i might have to write on a piece of napkin, or over some correction paste, i highly prefer taking a sturdy ballpoint.

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I would preffer BPs over RBs I just dont like RBs because they have a consistency of squeaking or you hear as the bearing rolls along your medium

for this I have preferred gel pens (Uni-ball Signo RT1 .38 refill, and Uni-ball style fit .38 refills) considered an F point in their refills but to me they are the probably the second best in terms of my bias, as I still like the Pilot V pens especially the RT ones

but if I were to prefer a body for a pen I would either get Ondoro smoked oak BP, Pilot S20 BP, Lamy 2K gredanilla BP, but from that I'm satisfied with my choice of refills, considering I actually like spring loaded clips that clip well like the Zebra Sarasa not to mention because they fit "Pilot G2" refills the Signo RT1 refills fit them as well the Muji Sarasa also fits if you don't like Zebra's design and would prefer the ones Zebra made for Muji

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Higher end bps and rbs are just more interesting than uniballs. If you remove interesting nothing beats a bic stick. I'll just leave it at that.

 

Roll a few mm of masking tape at the gripping section of the bic and voila cramping solved. Practical but not very interesting or fun.

Edited by max dog
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I lost my 80's all steel Jotter and recently replaced it with an 07 model. I can hardly grip it at all! Did they change the brush finish somehow?? It would be great if the metal version came with engraved gripping rings, but that's something I've only seen on early 45 ballpoints. I much prefer the Jotter's button rather than cap actuation though, as well as its iconic looks.

 

Mine is a 90's version so afraid I can't comment on the recent ones.

 

 

 

I had the opposite problem... I have an 80s made in USA one that I found the brushed metal slippery..more grainy. But more recent Jotters the metal is smoother and I find it slips less. They definitely changed the finish of the stainless steel.. in theory the early ones should have more grip but I did not find that to be the case.

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I lost my 80's all steel Jotter and recently replaced it with an 07 model. I can hardly grip it at all! Did they change the brush finish somehow?? It would be great if the metal version came with engraved gripping rings, but that's something I've only seen on early 45 ballpoints. I much prefer the Jotter's button rather than cap actuation though, as well as its iconic looks.

 

I have no idea what these things set one back, so maybe this is sacrilige, but have you considered sort of re-doing the brushed finish with some abrasive something - anything from a rigid kitchen cleaner green pad to steel wool to who knows what?

 

Or, you know, you could just wrap what would be the section part in blu-tac...

 

Sidles carefully towards door...

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I lost my 80's all steel Jotter and recently replaced it with an 07 model. I can hardly grip it at all! Did they change the brush finish somehow?? It would be great if the metal version came with engraved gripping rings, but that's something I've only seen on early 45 ballpoints. I much prefer the Jotter's button rather than cap actuation though, as well as its iconic looks.

 

I have no idea what these things set one back, so maybe this is sacrilige, but have you considered sort of re-doing the brushed finish with some abrasive something - anything from a rigid kitchen cleaner green pad to steel wool to who knows what?

 

Or, you know, you could just wrap what would be the section part in blu-tac...

 

Sidles carefully towards door...

 

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I have always been looking for a comfortable, reliable, decent looking, retractable writing instrument to use in place of my beloved fountain pens. The closest I have got to the ideal is the Pilot Acroball.

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I have tried many of the latest ballpoint/gel rollerball types, and find all of these to be reliable pens.

Edited by Mike 59
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