Polarizing pens

[wimg]

Hi Rique,

Isn´t anyone going to thrash the Parker 51, the first pen mentioned in the post that started this thread?  I´ve always found them very reliable and useful pens, but nothing else. However, there seems to be a lot of people who are mad about this pen. Here in Brazil it is probably the easiest pen to sell online - there are a lot of collectors just waiting to spring on it.

I reckon it s one of those pens that you love or leaves you totally indifferent, but not because of its perceived quality. Personally, I don't think it is a bad pen at all. It's just not for me. It has no attraction whatsoever to me, there is no emotion. And I don't understand what people see in it either. I consider it to be a fountain pen imitating a BP, for which I don't see the necessity, and of which I think that it just plain ugly. I don't particularly like hooded pens in the first place, and obviously, it is the most hooded fountain pen there is . To me it is just a piece of history that doesn't have any glamour or attraction, that's all.

 

You wanted controversy, well here it is .

 

Warm regards, Wim

[Maja]

Hi Rique,

Isn´t anyone going to thrash the Parker 51, the first pen mentioned in the post that started this thread?  I´ve always found them very reliable and useful pens, but nothing else. However, there seems to be a lot of people who are mad about this pen. Here in Brazil it is probably the easiest pen to sell online - there are a lot of collectors just waiting to spring on it.

I reckon it s one of those pens that you love or leaves you totally indifferent, but not because of its perceived quality. Personally, I don't think it is a bad pen at all. It's just not for me. It has no attraction whatsoever to me, there is no emotion. And I don't understand what people see in it either. I consider it to be a fountain pen imitating a BP, for which I don't see the necessity, and of which I think that it just plain ugly. I don't particularly like hooded pens in the first place, and obviously, it is the most hooded fountain pen there is . To me it is just a piece of history that doesn't have any glamour or attraction, that's all.

 

You wanted controversy, well here it is .

 

Warm regards, Wim

 

No disagreement here; I agree with all of your points 100%, Wim!

 

Aside from some of the lovely caps on some P51s I am totally bored with the pen.

Functional--yes, attractive--no....and I don't like hooded nibs, either

If the one I have wasn't the very first vintage pen I ever bought, it would have been "Green Boarded" by now.

 

May I add Levenger's "True Writer" as a candidate for love 'em/hate 'em pens?

I love mine, but I know other people who won't touch them with a 10-foot pole because of past problems.

 

Also, Krone LE pens---someone must be buying them ...but they're not my cup of tea...

[randyholhut]

It seems most of the "hate 'em" pens are ones I use and like. Maybe it's because my pen tastes seem to gravitate toward the utiliarian.

 

Come on, how can you hate an Estie? Or a Parker 45? Granted, they are pens without a great deal of charisma. They just write. And well, I would say.

 

Likewise for the pen that is the white button-down shirt of pendom — the Parker 51, and its oousins the 21 and 61. Their design is simple and timeless. If you want flex, you're out of luck. If you want something that writes as soon as you take off the cap, this is your pen.

 

Sure, the Rotring Core is techno-ugly. It writes great too and the grip feels better in my hand than say, a Sheaffer Prelude. And the Core MP and BP are the best handling pens of their kind.

 

I'm not one for flexy nibs, pretty colors, inlays, limited editions or flashiness in general. Give me a pen that is reliable, feels good in my hand and glides on the page — an Estie J with a 9556 nib, a 45 or 51 with a 14K gold F nib, a Sheaffer Legacy 2 or Balance II, a Eversharp Skyline or Symphony. Those are the pens I reach for most.

 

I guess the question with this thread is -- do we collect pens for the way they look or for the way they write and the way they perform? I find myself in the latter category.

[Rique]

I agree that the way a pen writes has to be taken into account - I wouldn´t want a beatiful pen that doesn´t write. And the Parkers (51,45,61,21, the lot) tend to be very good writers. But if efficiency were the only criterion, I´d say that the best pen in my collection is my Word for Windows and my Epson printer... A pen besides being a tool, is also a thing of beauty, something that is pleasing to the eye. And the Parker Sonnet (for example), is in my opinion much more attractive than a 51...

[Gerry]

Well Randy, we have similar tastes. Two of my favorites are the Estie and my Parker 45. I don't think anyone could move those off my fav list.

 

Yes, beauty plus functionality. Can't be beat.

 

 

Gerry

[HesNot]

I do know that there are those who find the "51" and related progeny boring, unmoving, etc... I've grown fond of them but I also like Seiko mechanical watches as much for the remarkable performance and industrial engineering as the looks. I wasn't much of a fan of hooded nibs until I tried a "51" and while the appearance is somewhat uninspiring the function works well for me as I spend longer periods of time during the day with it uncapped but not writing and it is nice not to have to take the cap on and off all the time ....

 

I'll second the Sonnet. Lots to like about it other than it was the hardest starting pen I've ever used.

 

Here's a new one to the list:

 

Wahl/Eversharp Skyline. I keep hearing about the nibs and keep getting tempted to look at one for that reason. But whenever I look at it the bottom of the pen looks like a desk set but shorter and the clip going up over the top of the cap (an affliction a lot of italian pens seem to have as well) is not an attractive feature in my book. I just can't get over the disproportionate appearance to even get to a nib. And I am a fan of industrial design (Loewy, etc...) but it just seems odd to me overall.

[Johnny Appleseed]

I consider it to be a fountain pen imitating a BP, for which I don't see the necessity,

 

You know - I have been meaning to start a thread with the question "Is a Parker 51 just a ball-point wanna-be". I have a 51 that is always in my bag, wherever I go - a trusty die-hard performer, always filled with one of the noodlers waterproof inks. But I have just one, and when I picked up a nearly perfect Blue-diamond 51, I was happy to send my other 51 (black with lusterloy) on it's way. On the other hand, I have half-a-dozen Snorkels and touchdowns, and equally many Balance/Triumph vac-fillers. Aesthetically I just see no reason to have more than one Parker 51 (and one 61) - but because they are such spectacular performers, I think you need at least one.

 

I think the ball-point wanna-be is apt in a lot of ways, though also unfair. The Parker 51 was absolutely revolutionary in it's design and became immensely popular because it was such a great writer, was incredibly reliable, could take fast-drying inks, etc - utilitarian reasons for which the ball-point also became popular.

Today, they don't seem to have that flare that many other pens have. In fact, many non-pen people don't even recognize them as a fountain pen until you explain it to them. In some ways, the reasons why they were so popular is the same reason that they don't excite a lot of FP peoples attention.

 

At the same time, the comparison with a ball-point it unfair, because the 51 and it's hooded nib came first. Really, one could see ball-point pens as a pale immitator of the Parker 51 (though the stylographic pen is probably a more apt predicessor).

 

Wahl/Eversharp Skyline. I keep hearing about the nibs and keep getting tempted to look at one for that reason. But whenever I look at it the bottom of the pen looks like a desk set but shorter and the clip going up over the top of the cap (an affliction a lot of italian pens seem to have as well) is not an attractive feature in my book. I just can't get over the disproportionate appearance to even get to a nib. And I am a fan of industrial design (Loewy, etc...) but it just seems odd to me overall.

 

Didn't Pen-World recently do a profile of the Skyline, with quotes from different members of the vintage FP world (I remember Richard Binder and Nathan Tardiff were both on the list, though I can't remember who else). Quotes ranged from absolutely glowing to totally trashing, my favorite being something along the lines of "fantastic example of art-deco design, but don't try to write with it." I'll have to see if I can find that issue.

 

J. Appleseed

[Ray]

Let's not forget the Vanishing Point. You can either live with that weird grip around the pocket clip (in which case you LOVE the pen) or you can't (in which case you HATE it with a passion.) I don't think it's possible to be lukewarm about the VP.

 

Ray

 

Edit: DOH! Read the first page and then posted, not realising about TEN people had already covered the VP!

Edited October 3, 2005 by Ray

[djahughes]

Yep! and it's that damn clip!

 

[Mike]

How about Mont Blahs, er, Mont Blancs? Love them for the hype, hate them for the audacity of "precious resin"?

 

For that matter, consider the Snorkel. Is the (comparatively) obscene complexity a reasonable price to pay for a pen you can fill without submerging the section in ink?

 

And on a purely personal and totally idiosyncratic note, the Sailor 1911. Nobody ever refers to them as the "Sailor 1911", it's always just the "1911". Problem is, there was already another "1911" out there. It's made by Colt, and it takes cartridges, too. Very confusing, and a totally irrational prejudice.

[kjervin]

What about Krone? They get a lot of heat for their special editions and their marketing. But it seems to me that many who dump on them have never actually used them and they are reacting to their over the top pricing and marketing as oposed to any deficiency in the pens' utility. MontBlanc's special/limited editions get heat as well, but some of them seem poorly balanced for writing or write poorly otherwise.

 

Food for thought,

Kj

[Michael Wright]

Just to prove that the 51 is a controversial pen, I will say that it is not only marvellously functional, it is also a design of breathtaking beauty. It is obviously from the era of the stream line (think of the fuselage of a Constellation), but it's not a gimmick like the Industrial Design (= tarting up) of the Skyline. The whole thing is a sort of softened Bauhaus, characteristic of the strongest and best tradition in US manufacturing. The Skyline's a good pen, too, but a conventional pen with a funny shape. Flex nibs, but.

 

I can't imagine how an Esterbrook could be controversial. I can see you might not be an enthusiast, but what's not to like?

 

For controversial, how about any Italian pen except the Aurora? Beautiful pens, dodgy QC? But this is only from hearsay, except for an OMAS with the dreaded dissolving tar seal.

 

Best

 

Michael

[Rique]

As far as I have been able to gather from these posts, the most controversial (or polarizing) pens are the Parker 51 and the Montblancs... some people love them, some people hate them.

I can´t see anything polarizing in Esties (as Wim pointed out many posts ago), or Parker 45s, etc. People either like them, or don´t care.

Krones are definitely not polarizing - people either hate them, or don´t know they exist... As far as I can remember, I still haven´t seen anyone speaking in their favour...

[KendallJ]

Krones are definitely not polarizing - people either hate them, or don´t know they exist...  As far as I can remember, I still haven´t seen anyone speaking in their favour...

Ummm. Hello!

 

I love mine! Krone is officially "polarizing"

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/in...findpost&p=6002

 

https://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/in...findpost&p=2924

 

As to the 51 being "marvelously functional" and "breathtaking beauty". Next to a Snork, the 51 is only comparably beautiful, and inferior in functional marvel. 51's stopped innovating after the collector. An aerometic or vacumatic filler? puuhlease. And the nib hood may be nice to look at, but is a lousy place to suck ink from, hiding a drop after you wipe it so it will spill out onto your pants later. :blink: Snorks are much better at preserving ink moisture and filling both!

 

Yup, 51 belongs on the "polarizing" list too.

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v366/justiniano/Spork.jpg

 

(Ducking and running....)

Edited October 27, 2005 by KendallJ

[kjervin]

That buttresses my point, those that have Krone pens, like them; those that hate them, haven't tried one. Therefore, polarizing.

 

Kj

[amin]

I'd add the Waterman Edson to the list. I really enjoy mine, but many seem to dislike them.

[KendallJ]

That buttresses my point, those that have Krone pens, like them; those that hate them, haven't tried one. Therefore, polarizing.

 

Kj

Id' go with that.

 

Your point: everyone hates them except those who have them.

Rique's point: everyone hates them except the ignorant, who have no opinion of them.

 

Those are pretty "polar" statements.

Edited October 27, 2005 by KendallJ

[Titivillus]

That buttresses my point, those that have Krone pens, like them; those that hate them, haven't tried one. Therefore, polarizing.

 

Kj

Id' go with that.

 

Your point: everyone hates them except those who have them.

Rique's point: everyone hates them except the ignorant, who have no opinion of them.

 

Those are pretty "polar" statements.

But I have one and still hate the oveblown limited editions

 

Not to mention that the sac ossified in the one I own.

 

Kurt H

[JeffTL]

Funny thing is that I find the 51 very pleasant for filling; it's easy to get the hooded nib very clean after a wipedown. Of course, on a Snorkel, you don't have to wipe the nib anyway, but compared to an exposed-nib dunking pen, the 51 is clean-filling.

[Michael Wright]

And the nib hood may be nice to look at, but is a lousy place to suck ink from, hiding a drop after you wipe it so it will spill out onto your pants later. :blink:

Glad to see the 51 is controversial -- would hate it to be boring.

 

But the drop of ink in the collector is avoidable, IF YOU FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS (at least for Vac fillers). For the last operation of the Vac plunger, they tell you to leave the plunger depressed until after you withdraw the pen from the ink. You let the button go, and lo and behold, it sucks the surplus ink out of the hood.

 

Of course, you still have to wipe the business end, as you do with any pen except the Snorkel. Which is, indeed, a great pen, but it has too many parts and it's a cylinder with pointed ends, rather than a constantly, gracefully, changing form.

 

Best

 

Michael