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A Pen In Need Of Identifying

northlodge

By northlodge
in Great Britain & Ireland - Europe

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northlodge Vintage

northlodge

Posted
Posted

Today I stopped off at a decommissioned RAF camp in North Lincolnshire, where I was amazed to find that every one of the old H blocks was rammed full of antiques for sale. My 10 minute coffee break became a half day of searching for fountain pens. Alas, the Lincs based FPNers must have got there first as I found only 3 items worth throwing money at.

 

One was this interesting item, where I will offer a few select snaps just to allow the cleverest amongst you to test your pen ID-ing skills

 

So any one fancy identifying this make / model?

 

http://i736.photobucket.com/albums/xx4/northlodge/pens%202012/pen%202015/why%202_zpsfza5o6yl.jpg

http://i736.photobucket.com/albums/xx4/northlodge/pens%202012/pen%202015/why%203_zpswxuor0i1.jpg

 

http://i736.photobucket.com/albums/xx4/northlodge/pens%202012/pen%202015/why%201_zps6vb5w43r.jpg

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Cob Collectors Item

Cob

Posted
Posted

Surely an Onoto of some sort or could it be even rarer - a predecessor from Mr Sweetser?

 

Cob

fpn_1428963683__6s.jpg “The pen of the British Empire” fpn_1423349537__swan_sign_is.jpg


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northlodge Vintage

northlodge

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Okay Cob, no one else about to take a punt, and I know how you have a love of Onoto & Swan pens, so here is a picture of the barrel stamp:

 

http://i736.photobucket.com/albums/xx4/northlodge/pens%202012/pen%202015/why%20last_zpsgwd0y8ah.jpg

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Cob Collectors Item

Cob

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Well; that certainly took the wind out of my sails.

 

Obviously dates from the days when "Made in Japan" meant a bloody fake! I mean even the plunger knob for God's sake!

 

They really went for it - copying one of the two best makes, and then naming it after the other!

 

Thanks: you have real collector's item there.

 

Cob

fpn_1428963683__6s.jpg “The pen of the British Empire” fpn_1423349537__swan_sign_is.jpg


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Ispriluc Extremely Rare

Ispriluc

Posted
Posted

I would have said Onoto as well, based on the type of markings on the nib. What does it say on the other side of the nib?

 

So this is a fake?

Parker 51 Vacumatic 0.7 Masuyama stub; TWSBI 540 M; TWSBI 580 1.1; Mabie, Todd and Bard 3200 stub; Waterman 14 Eyedropper F; 2 x Hero 616; several flexible dip nibs

owned for a time: Parker 45 flighter Pendleton stub, Parker 51 aerometric F, Parker 51 Special 0.7 Binder stub, Sheaffer Valiant Snorkel M, Lamy Joy Calligraphy 1.5 mm, Pelikan M200 M, Parker Vacumatic US Azure Blue M, Parker Vacumatic Canada Burgundy F, Waterman 12 Eyedropper, Mabie Todd SF2 flexible F

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northlodge Vintage

northlodge

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Having now done a little research, including a thread over in the Japanese pen forum, I think it is too simplistic to say "fake". There was a Japanese company called "Swan" that were a significant player in that market during the first part of the 20th Century. Several leverfills and a couple of ED's can be found through a search on here.

 

This is the only example of a piston filler I have found, but it would not be unreasonable to expect the successfully technology developed by DLR to be copied (with minor alterations) by a Japanese company for that market.... Is this so different from the situation today?

 

So not a fake, but certainly a case of copying of design and technology

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BCastle Mint

BCastle

Posted
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If it is Japanese, could it be an eyedropper rather than a piston filler? These too had mechanisms that have piston shafts which acted as a shut off/flow valve.

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northlodge Vintage

northlodge

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If it is Japanese, could it be an eyedropper rather than a piston filler? These too had mechanisms that have piston shafts which acted as a shut off/flow valve.

 

Oh blimey, now life is getting difficult ;-)

 

I am not sure how I would be able to tell, although there is no evidence of a petrified seal on the end of the piston, so it is quite possible. NB the end of the piston is flat in the way of the Onoto Minor, rather than pointed (as would have been the case of an Onoto of the period this was made).

 

Perhaps I should enquire over on the Japan forum.

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Cob Collectors Item

Cob

Posted
Posted

Having now done a little research, including a thread over in the Japanese pen forum, I think it is too simplistic to say "fake". There was a Japanese company called "Swan" that were a significant player in that market during the first part of the 20th Century. Several leverfills and a couple of ED's can be found through a search on here.

 

This is the only example of a piston filler I have found, but it would not be unreasonable to expect the successfully technology developed by DLR to be copied (with minor alterations) by a Japanese company for that market.... Is this so different from the situation today?

 

So not a fake, but certainly a case of copying of design and technology

And a trade mark!

 

Cob

fpn_1428963683__6s.jpg “The pen of the British Empire” fpn_1423349537__swan_sign_is.jpg


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mallymal1 Antique

mallymal1

Posted
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Oh blimey, now life is getting difficult ;-)

 

I am not sure how I would be able to tell, although there is no evidence of a petrified seal on the end of the piston, so it is quite possible. NB the end of the piston is flat in the way of the Onoto Minor, rather than pointed (as would have been the case of an Onoto of the period this was made).

 

Perhaps I should enquire over on the Japan forum.

 

I'd say definitely an eye dropper with shut off.

 

Definitely show it on the Japanese forum. If Stan's around, he'll probably have all the gen.

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Cob Collectors Item

Cob

Posted
Posted

There is an explanation of the functioning of these pens on p. 216 of the third edition of the Pen Repair Manual (Marshall and Oldfield).



Cob


fpn_1428963683__6s.jpg “The pen of the British Empire” fpn_1423349537__swan_sign_is.jpg


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northlodge Vintage

northlodge

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Thanks for the links, I was unaware that ebay carried such useful information.

 

 

There is an explanation of the functioning of these pens on p. 216 of the third edition of the Pen Repair Manual (Marshall and Oldfield).

Cob

 

 

I only have the earlier version of this book, but it matters not as I will probably just flip this pen on ebay (it certainly does not fit into my collection!)

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chunya Collectors Item

chunya

Posted
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I read a piece a short while back, and it was probably where that ebay section originated. It struck me then as odd (as I couldn't get my head around it), why they would need a plunger to improve safety, to avoid ink spillage.

Nevertheless, that was a very interesting find, Northlodge.... and must have been a really early example of 'commercial flattery' by the Japanese.

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BCastle Mint

BCastle

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I read a piece a short while back, and it was probably where that ebay section originated. It struck me then as odd (as I couldn't get my head around it), why they would need a plunger to improve safety, to avoid ink spillage.

 

Think of it as a tap rather than a plunger (it shouldn't really be extended out as that risks damaging the seals)

With the blind cap (tap) fully closed a washer/disc at the end of the shaft seals the top of the feed and no ink can escape

With the blind cap loosened a turn or two, the ink can flow for writing

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chunya Collectors Item

chunya

Posted
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Think of it as a tap rather than a plunger (it shouldn't really be extended out as that risks damaging the seals)

With the blind cap (tap) fully closed a washer/disc at the end of the shaft seals the top of the feed and no ink can escape

With the blind cap loosened a turn or two, the ink can flow for writing

That makes sense now .... clear as a bell .... It's a shame you didn't write that article

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