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Antique Waterman's Id Help

daffie

By daffie
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daffie Rare

daffie

Posted
Posted

Hi all,

 

I don't know much about Waterman. But today I bought this pen, because I think its beautiful!

Please see the pictures and tell me all you know about it, I would appreciate that.

And can you tell me if its valuable?

 

I can't see any cracks or dents. It is in pretty good shape.

 

Cap and barrel have (silver) markings. At the end of the barrel it says 'Waterman's Ideal' and a globe.

 

On the nib it says 'Waterman's Reg.U.S. Pat.Off'.

 

Regards,

daffie

post-106033-0-25169800-1432731295_thumb.jpg

post-106033-0-89083300-1432731320_thumb.jpg

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Ernst Bitterman Donor Pen

Ernst Bitterman

Posted
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I'm not seeing anything like it in my early catalogues (the oldest I have is 1918); it seems very slender. Perhaps, if your camera will allow, a shot of the hallmarks would let some clever person sort out the approximate age as a stepping stone to identifying the model... or perhaps the jeweler who did the bodywork.

Ravensmarch Pens & Books
It's mainly pens, just now....

Oh, good heavens. He's got a blog now, too.

 

fpn_1465330536__hwabutton.jpg

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chunya Collectors Item

chunya

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I can just about make out that it is silver, and it was assayed in London, but can't make out anything else.

A photo of a complete set of hallmarks will tell us the year and who the silversmiths were ... sometimes the value is in who fashioned the overlay.

 

Nice looking pen

Edited by chunya
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daffie Rare

daffie

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Yes, it is indeed a very slender model.

 

On one side it has an engraving, dated 16th July 1906

On the other side are the markings, I hope the new pictures will help.

 

The markings say: F.D.W., a lion looking to the left, a lions head, and a 'K'.

 

Regards,

daffie

post-106033-0-94393100-1432741087_thumb.jpg

post-106033-0-06845900-1432741105_thumb.jpg

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chunya Collectors Item

chunya

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There is a full set of hallmarks there ... which is good as it will always add value ... but I still cannot make them out.

If you can't get a better photo, can you describe what the markings are.

 

There is a Lion there which tells us it is sterling silver. There seems to be a Lion's head, which tells us it was assayed in London ... I can't quite make out the single 'letter', but if it is a K then it was assayed in 1905. The makers (looks to be three initials) marks I cannot make out at all.

Edited by chunya
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gregamckinney Antique

gregamckinney

Posted
Posted

You have a fantastic pen there!

 

Look for model 402 in the sales catalogs of the higher end folks like David Nishimura or Gary Lehrer.

 

Best Regards, greg

Don't feel bad. I'm old; I'm meh about most things.

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daffie Rare

daffie

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There is a full set of hallmarks there ... which is good as it will always add value ... but I still cannot make them out.

If you can't get a better photo, can you describe what the markings are.

 

There is a Lion theer, which tells us it is sterling silver. There seems to be a Lion's head, which tells us it was assayed in London ... I can't quite make out the single 'letter', but if it is a K then it was assayed in 1905. The makers (looks to be three initials) marks I cannot make out at all.

Hi,

 

I have described the markings in that post with the pictures, as good as I could.

 

Regards,

daffie

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daffie Rare

daffie

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You have a fantastic pen there!

 

Look for model 402 in the sales catalogs of the higher end folks like David Nishimura or Gary Lehrer.

 

Best Regards, greg

Thanks. Do you think it is a valuable pen? I like to know if I had payed a good price.

 

Regards,

daffie

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Vintagepens Collectors Item

Vintagepens

Posted
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It's a standard London hallmark for English-retailed Watermans. The overlay is factory, in the "Commercial" pattern (often called "line and dot" by collectors). The pen is surely a 402, though English-market pens of this sort don't have the model number imprinted at the barrel end as was typical for USA-market pens. The one unusual feature is the metal collar at the front of the barrel right behind the section. Perhaps this was added as a repair; though it resembles the locking ring found on Swan pens with a bayonet attachment, it cannot function in the same way in the present configuration.

Figure on a value of several hundred dollars.

David Nishimura

 

www.vintagepens.com

vintagepensblog.blogspot.com

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chunya Collectors Item

chunya

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Posted (edited)

Hi,

 

I have described the markings in that post with the pictures, as good as I could.

 

Regards,

daffie

Apologies, I went straight to the pictures and missed what you'd written.

So, you know that it was overlayed in 1905, the only silversmiths I can find with those initials were Frederick Dendy Wray .... but I think that is not as important now as the pen itself ... seems you have got your hands on a little gem there! Congratulations!

Edited by chunya
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crescentfiller Vintage

crescentfiller

Posted
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Oops. I was viewing on my phone and couldn't make out the "lines."

Quite clearly "line and dot," and in nice condition, too (as now seen on my Mac!).

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daffie Rare

daffie

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Hello all,

 

Thanks for the replies! I know more about it now.

 

I am only curious about the thicker ring at the front of the barrel. Is it original? I haven't found another example on internet. But when it is a repair, I can't understand that the pattern is exactly the same, I can't make out any difference. Please help me with that 'problem'!

 

I paid 45 Euros for the pen, I don't think I paid too much.

 

Regards,

daffie

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chunya Collectors Item

chunya

Posted
Posted

Hello all,

 

Thanks for the replies! I know more about it now.

 

I am only curious about the thicker ring at the front of the barrel. Is it original? I haven't found another example on internet. But when it is a repair, I can't understand that the pattern is exactly the same, I can't make out any difference. Please help me with that 'problem'!

 

I paid 45 Euros for the pen, I don't think I paid too much.

 

Regards,

daffie

45 Euros .... were you wearing a mask and carrying a bag with SWAG written on it?

An absolute steal! Well found!

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Xof72000 Vintage

Xof72000

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I paid 45 Euros for the pen, I don't think I paid too much.

 

 

Waouh !! Congrats !

Lucky you ... no need to play "Loto" anymore !! :thumbup:

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delano Extremely Rare

delano

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Posted

I don't know Watermans, and I don't really know enough about pens, but I do know beautiful. And that Waterman pen truly is.

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